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Need help with car history 1981 eldorado, check the carfax

Started by Tonyv_73, February 19, 2018, 04:29:17 PM

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Dave Shepherd

Again, agreed, milesge not important though, as the cars overall condition speaks for itself, but tell thst to the next buyer.

Tonyv_73

also for carfax the info is pretty much the same, only instead of saying 1994 that it had 47k miles it says 1990 it had 40k miles, could it be that the 1994 is also incorrect??
1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

Tonyv_73

1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

Tonyv_73

1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

Cape Cod Fleetwood

You can also go to a Caddy dealer service center, give them your vin, and if any work was done on the car by Cadillac they'll have those records.
There are 2 kinds of cars in the world, Cadillac and everything else....

The Present -1970 Fleetwood Brougham

The Past -
1996 Deville Concours
1987 Sedan De Ville "Commonwealth Edition"
1981 Coupe De Ville (8-6-4)
1976 Sedan De Ville
1975 Sedan De Ville

The Daily Driver and work slave -
2008 GMC Acadia SLT *options/all

Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

#25
Agreed - condition will have to do the talking here. Many buyers understand mileage reporting irregularities that can occur, especially when it comes to older cars. Would it be better if the car didn't have this problem? Absolutely. How much it will harm resale value on an (otherwise presumed clean car - assuming that is the case) - is difficult to answer. To the right buyer, it probably won't make much difference - especially since we are not talking a super high dollar car to begin with.

Again, the best argument is simply that it's EXTREMELY unlikely someone started pounding a then-13 year old Cadillac in Canton Ohio at the rate of over 23,000 miles a year! If this spectacular mileage accumulation took place on a year-round basis in a snow belt state, this car would have been junk 20 years ago. If only driven in favorable weather during that period, the owner would have only 6 -  8 months to log that same 23,000 miles - again on a 13 year old car. It simply wouldn't happen. 1,000 times more likely a title clerk slipped up than such a scenario.

If you present the case properly when you go to sell, any reasonable person should accept the explanation. Otherwise I doubt you'll have much success getting this issue corrected which usually requires years of inspection record log books by heaven knows what inspection station(s) - decades ago, in Canton, OH, assuming you know who they were, assuming they're still in business, assuming they retained this documentation- are nil. 
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Barry M Wheeler #2189

#26
I had some raised eyebrows when I registered my 19,700 mile 1991 Seville. It helped when I told them that the dash was digital and went to six figures.

At this late date, you may or may not get any help from your DMV. What you might do is go to the biggest branch around you and ask for the oldest (In years of service) employee there to help you. It is liable to be a very crusty, opinionated older lady that doesn't take .... from anyone. Be very, very polite to her and see if you can get on her good side and interested in your problem.

This happened to me when I sold my '41 to Jeff Hansen. I had forgotten that I couldn't find the right SN and the State Policeman friend who was filling out my out of state papers and I decided to use the #s on the cowl tag as "I'd probably never sell the car anyway." Delaware only takes the "right #s" so Jeff started out for home without the car. I took the stuff I had to the DMV and a lady like I described said that "it'd probably take forever" to straighten out, but leave things with her and she'd see what she could do. We went to have lunch nearby and after we'd eaten, I had thought of another possibility to try and went back to the DMV. I walked in and she was waving a handful of paper with a big smile on her face. She'd gotten on the phone and straightened it out. Called Jeff and he and Rob made a 180 degree turn on I-70 and came back and loaded up the car a few hours later.

Pardons for the repeat of my war story, but the moral of the tale is, "Be patient, don't get upset, and get someone interested in solving your problem at the DMV." (Take a couple of pictures to show how pretty the car is.) These people put up with so many problems every day that when someone actually shows them some respect and asks politely "What can you do to help me?" they just might get interested in being the one who does just that. Good luck.
Barry M. Wheeler #2189


1981 Cadillac Seville
1991 Cadillac Seville

Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373

I don't know for sure, but I think you are chasing the wrong ghost. Unless I missed something, am I correct that only the Carfax and similar reports show it as over 100k? What does your title say?
If your title doesn't say it is over 100k or exceeds mechanical limits, etc then it isn't. Carfax is simply a reporting agency, not the dmv. Their information is incorrect and they need to correct it. Similar to Equifax/Transunion. Contact Carfax and tell them you dispute their records and their inaccuracy hurts the value of your car. See what THEIR dispute process is and go from there.
Jeff
Jeff Rosansky
CLC #28373
1970 Coupe DeVille (Big Red)
1955 Series 62 (Baby Blue)
Dad's new 1979 Coupe DeVille

Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

The error appears to have occurred when the car was emissions tested in Georgia. Typical.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

smokuspollutus

There are plenty of legitimate reasons why the speedometer cluster could have been removed from this car, and I agree that there is no way this car went that sort of distance in such a short period of time and is alive to tell the tale.

What interests me more is that the car apparently accrued less than 300 miles in 13 years. Do you have any information on what the car was doing between 1999 and 2012?

Tonyv_73

No i do not, When I purchased the car, I got it from craigslist last year from Florida, I assumed that it was a Florida car based off the overall damage of the car.  She needed a headliner, the leather was a bit dry (not terrible), The dash cracked when I had the windshield resealed.  And the car had a bit of rust that needed attention (by fenders).  Currently the car is a solid 8 out of 10.  I had to get new sun visors because the passenger one sagged.   Since i have had the car Ive detailed the car and have made it as nice as I can. This is a 1981 Eldorado Biarritz, Factory sunroof, CB stereo, Digital Dash, Memory Seats, Passenger  reclining seat, Cruise, 8-6-4 engine.  Ive added original appliance rims, and pinstriped it.  The car is Brown with tan interior
1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

jsanford

Good looking car. Clearly the idiot at the Georgia inspection station saw 64k and just assumed 164K, then the speedometer cable was disconnected or it just sat for a long time. Nice to know that after its travels it has returned to the land of its birth and is loved.

Jeremy
Jeremy
Sacramento, CA
1980 Seville
1981 Eldorado
2016 ELR

cadillacmike68

#32
Quote from: Tonyv_73 on February 19, 2018, 05:53:01 PM
went with autocheck, found out that there was a potential rollover on the milage in 1999.  The car had 47k miles in 1990, and 164k miles in 1999, then it was bought in 2012 with 64k miles. the car was in an accident in 1993 in ohio, case #371, Data Source: State Agency.  Is there any way i can look up that case number to find the full report?

Look at your numbers and THINK.

47,000 in 1990 - 9 years - possible
164,000 in 1999 -9 more years- again possible but also possible that it had only 64,000 perhaps it was lightly used.
64,000 in 2012 - 13 years - no way, even if it was 64,000 real miles in 1999.

So the odometer mist likely went past 100,000 in the early 2000s. and it wasn't registered properly. Possibly 2 errors here

OR maybe only one error and it has it rolled over twice.  :o

Carfax has gotten expensive. It used to be pay $60 or 80 and get up to three in a 30 day period.
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

cadillacmike68

#33
Quote from: smokuspollutus on February 22, 2018, 02:00:59 PM
There are plenty of legitimate reasons why the speedometer cluster could have been removed from this car, and I agree that there is no way this car went that sort of distance in such a short period of time and is alive to tell the tale.

What interests me more is that the car apparently accrued less than 300 miles in 13 years. Do you have any information on what the car was doing between 1999 and 2012?

That didn't happen. The car has at least 100,000 more miles that what the odometer says.

Didn't OP mention that all ther speedo screws had been removed sometime prior ??

What is the condition of the steering wheel top area (if it is leather wrapped - if not there's no way to tell), the pedals, carpet, and the front seats? I had a Fleetwood brougham with close to 200,000 miles and the seats still looked pristine. A have one with over 100,000 now and it looks better than my 1968's front seats which only have about 40,000 miles of wear on them.
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

cadillacmike68

Quote from: Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621 on February 22, 2018, 09:43:58 AM
The error appears to have occurred when the car was emissions tested in Georgia. Typical.

That's only one error. There's almost zero probability that car only went 300 miles in 13 years, so it Had to roll over once between 1999 and 2012.
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

Tonyv_73

when I got the car it needed a great deal of mechanical work, the radiator had brown water in it, the interior is a solid 7 out of 10, the seats are a little dry but clean and complete, no scratches.  The steering wheel is great, but that being said this car was in an accident in 1993, so how extensive was the damage etc.  I believe that a few hundred miles went on the car from 1999 to 2012 because the car was dusty and dirty from sitting when i got it.  The air vents blew dust out of them every time i used the car for the first month or so when i got it.
1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

#36
According to more detailed history report (first one posted on the previous page), the car traveled 23,000 miles per year from 1994 - 1999- This is extremely unlikely. Not to mention while being registered in a snow belt state.

Second point: When the car was taken to an emissions station (as opposed to a titling agency), the next odometer reading just happens to be slightly higher than that last previously recorded (after an even 100,000 is subtracted). That is quite a coincidence.

Third point: What possible economic motivation could there have possibly been to turn the mileage back on a vehicle which in 1999 was probably worth $3,000 at the absolute maximum? Extremely unlikely event #3.

Therefore, you would have to accept a string of three strong unlikelihoods against the very strong likelihood of an emissions station inspector of assuming the odometer had rolled over because of the age of the car. 

Heaven knows why at this point why dash screws have gone missing - as there are any number of reasons why a repair was needed that would've required removal (or partial) removal of dash and/or any number of  components within.

I submit the dash screws are a red herring in this picture.   

 

A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

David King (kz78hy)

I think the odometer time limit is 10 years for the feds, so that car is long over anyone caring about the mileage legal requirement.

If you like the car and it runs and drives fine, I would not worry about it.  You could spend a lot of time and effort attempting to track down info & history and in the end, it won't matter.  It's a 37 year old $3500 car.

My 2 cents

David
David King
CLC 22014  (life)
1958 Eldorado Brougham 615
1959 Eldorado Brougham 56- sold
1960 Eldorado Brougham 83- sold
1998 Deville d'Elegance
1955 Eldorado #277
1964 Studebaker Commander
2012 Volt
CLCMRC benefactor 197

Director and Founder, Eldorado Brougham Chapter
Past President, Motor City Region

Rare Parts brand suspension parts Retailer via Keep'em Running Automotive

Tonyv_73

Quote from: David King  (kz78hy) on February 23, 2018, 11:18:51 AM
I think the odometer time limit is 10 years for the feds, so that car is long over anyone caring about the mileage legal requirement.

If you like the car and it runs and drives fine, I would not worry about it.  You could spend a lot of time and effort attempting to track down info & history and in the end, it won't matter.  It's a 37 year old $3500 car.

My 2 cents

David

Not a $3500 car...
1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

sding

Quote from: Tonyv_73 on February 23, 2018, 01:05:29 PM
Not a $3500 car...
I agree you have a solid $6000.00 car! I love these eldo.