Cadillac & LaSalle Club Discussion Forum

Cadillac & LaSalle Club Forums => Technical / Authenticity => Topic started by: ByronF on January 29, 2018, 09:52:14 PM

Title: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: ByronF on January 29, 2018, 09:52:14 PM
I am considering re-chroming the bumpers on my 72 Eldorado. I made a few enquiries of local Chrome shops and the pricing was absolutely crazy. While doing some research I came across a process called Spray Chrome which I gather is a paint process. I talked to a few local guys who used this process on their hot rods and they swear by it and claim you can't tell the difference. A few even claim to have won trophies with their vehicles using this process. I gather from them that the cost of spray Chrome is about half of conventional chroming. That is appealing because I can then afford to do both bumpers at one time and not break the bank in the process.

So my question is, does anyone have any experience with this spray chrome? Is it any good, does it look like real chrome, does it last, are there any downsides to this process.

Appreciate any information that can be provided.
ByronF
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: chrisntam on January 29, 2018, 10:07:12 PM
I can't answer your question about the spray chrome, but am curious about the cost of rechroming the bumpers that you were given.

I'm about to get the rear bumper done on my '70, taking it to the guy tomorrow in the morning to look at and get a quote.  I'm expecting $1000.  I'll report back once I find out.

I was only off by $700.

Update:
$1700 to rechrome the back bumper.  They use about a 5 step process (I can't remember them all) including copper.  I looked at other stuff they did, it looked pretty good.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: 35-709 on January 29, 2018, 10:09:12 PM
I have seen it a couple of years ago but there's no chrome like real chrome.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Jeepers Creepers on January 29, 2018, 10:09:31 PM
There is a mob here in Oz that do it.... I think its called Wizard Chrome.

There can be an issue, as a lot of these processes use a clear coat that has been going a tad yellow if it see's a lot of sunlight.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: The Tassie Devil(le) on January 29, 2018, 10:30:04 PM
I saw the results of a person using an expensive spray chrome paint, and the results were nothing like chrome.   It was a disaster, and the instructions were followed to the letter.

As for chrome plating a 1972 Eldorado front and rear bars, mine cost AU$4,800.00 (all 10 pieces) with an additional AU$550.00 for the continental kit.   And I had to do all the minor imperfection shaping.

Bruce. >:D
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Mike Josephic CLC #3877 on January 29, 2018, 11:20:43 PM
Any spray chrome I've ever seen you can tell from 10
feet away --and that's when it's new.  Don't waste your
time and $$.  Get them rechromed.

I had mine done on my '73 along with the end pieces. 
Even 20 years ago it was around $3K.  That was front,
rear and the 4 end pieces.

However, done right it will last a lifetime.  Find a few good
chrome shops, get several quotes, and pay the price.  You
won't regret it.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: fishnjim on January 30, 2018, 10:40:46 AM
Let me see, I acquired a huge car with huge bumpers and I'm worried about the cost to rechrome?   I've heard that somewhere else...
Like everything else, shop around.
Try the parts guys/yards.   You might find one in good or better shape than yours.   The cost of rechrome is labor to heal the surface.  So the worse it's pitted or scarred or more detail, the more it costs to repair.   I have no idea if there's any NOS in this year.
Try the national guys, you may have to turn yours in for a refurb or pay more freight.   They go to meets usually.   Depends on what you want and shape rest of car is in how much $$ to throw down the rat hole.   Will that good one stick out and you'll have to do the others?

"Spray chrome" is more than just one flavor.   They make other metallics.   It's rather expensive as paints go and has a good chance of being messed up if you don't know what you're doing or have the equipment.   They quoted me many hundred $$ for a project, which wasn't bumpers.   Equipment cost thousands.   You still have to heal the scars before you paint(labor $, if you don't DIY).   Then you're left with what amounts to a painted bumper.   Looks can be deceiving though.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: TJ Hopland on January 30, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
Isn't there a chrome like thing that works like a power coat?   Its the same way they can 'plate' plastics.  Still a lot of money in the prep I bet.    Besides that I think a major part of the cost of the real thing is the extra EPA and insurance required with all the chemicals.   I would imagine getting good quality raw materials isn't cheap either.    I doubt those people are screwing around with recycling random scraps like hobbits do. 
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Chas on January 30, 2018, 12:48:28 PM
Was at my Powder Coater last Friday. While poking around his shop, I noticed what at first looked like some chrome plated pieces hangimg on the racks. Got within ten feet of these items and could see that they were coated, not chromed. The finish had sort of a "milky" quality to it.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: ByronF on January 30, 2018, 02:08:07 PM
Thanks for all the input guys, much appreciated. In answer to one of the questions raised I was  quoted CDN  $1500 to $2200 PER Bumper to re-chrome based on the three shops that are within a reasonable distance of me. This is a vehicle that I inherited and while I don't mind spending some money on it, it also needs a lot of other work so saving a few bucks helps with the costs of the other major items - such as rear main seal and pan gasket, repairing the A/C, the auto level system and cv joint, not to mention non functioning power trunk release, a window motor, non functioning door locks and no dash lights. A few things to keep me amused.

On the positive side it has great paint, a new convertible top, new brakes, new ps pump, and a new dual exhaust system  and the radio works great. I have had the wheel rims sand blasted and painted and plan on installing new 235/75R - 15 whitewall radials this spring

Based on my research it is apparent that for spray chrome the prep work has to be meticulous as the chrome paint magnifies the imperfections and it seems the shops that do this process are not all that keen on doing the prep work. Will never understand that as the look of their process will be impacted by the base work and one would expect that they would want the best job out there to promote their product, so one would assume that they would be keen or even insist that they do the prep work. I must be missing something?

I have looked at the powder coat process but have to agree that it is not really chrome like. A few of the local guys that have the spray chrome have offered to let me come and look at their vehicles so I will probably do that before making any final decision.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621 on January 30, 2018, 02:23:30 PM
Bumper cores will need to be prepped properly regardless of final application method chosen. That is where most of the cost will be. If this is a car you are intending to own for the foreseeable future, my opinion is that a half-assed chome job won't look so cheap when you'll be redoing all over again in a couple years.

"The stingy man spends the most" - Click & Clack the Tappet Brothers. :)
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Chas on January 30, 2018, 02:58:33 PM
Byron......here's another option for ya. A few years back I got my hands on a low mileage 1964 Buick Electra Coupe. The car was basically clean....my idea was to detail it on the cheap and quickly flip it for a profit. Found this company out in California called Bumper Boyz (www.bumperboyz.com). They do what I call "production" chrome plating of bumpers. Would you want to put their stuff on a 97 point trailer queen? Obviously no! How about bolting their bumpers to a driver or a nice clean car? Sure! You can ship them your bumpers for chroming, or, exchange them for a pair that they already plated. Believe me, they have about EVERY GM car bumper in stock. Nice thing is, every Spring, Summer, and Fall, these fella's travel all over the U.S. setting up shop at ALL the major swap meets/shows. You can call ahead and pick up/exchange your bumpers at a predetermined spot, thus saving on the shipping. Give them a call to get a price. That way, at least you'll have a baseline for costs.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Caddy Wizard on January 30, 2018, 03:17:46 PM
I am good with a spray gun, am experienced with doing powder coating, and shudder at the cost of chrome plating bumpers.  But really, chrome plating the bumpers is the only way to go.  If the car is a "driver" shop around for the lowest price you can find.  Either that or leave them as is.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: 35-709 on January 30, 2018, 07:00:37 PM
If you go with Bumper Boyz have them do YOUR pieces, don't exchange.  Some of the cores they use to rechrome have been seriously mangled in accidents and do not fit well and their metal prep work may leave something to be desired.  If you are going to sell the car soon BB might be an option, if you are going to keep it, do it right with a reputable chrome shop.  There is NO substitute for quality work.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: chrisntam on January 31, 2018, 09:33:56 PM
Update:

$1700 to rechrome the back bumper.  They use about a 5 step process (I can't remember them all) including copper.  I looked at other stuff they did, it looked pretty good.

It's this place:

http://aandwproductions.com/chrome/index.php

Like a giddy school girl, I said, "YES!"
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: cadillacmike68 on February 01, 2018, 02:44:44 AM
Quote from: TJ Hopland on January 30, 2018, 12:25:13 PM
Isn't there a chrome like thing that works like a power coat?   Its the same way they can 'plate' plastics.  Still a lot of money in the prep I bet.    Besides that I think a major part of the cost of the real thing is the extra EPA and insurance required with all the chemicals.   I would imagine getting good quality raw materials isn't cheap either.    I doubt those people are screwing around with recycling random scraps like hobbits do. 

I think it's called PVD. It uses aluminum. The Cadillac dealer sells wheel with this process. Real shiny but I'm not sure how tough it really is.

As far as spray chrome: "You can't get chrome out of a can".
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: 76eldo on February 01, 2018, 08:40:31 AM
I had my 70 rear bumper rechromed and it cost me $750.  Your Eldo bumpers should cost between $700 and $1000 each.  Keep shopping.
I have heard from people that had bumpers done by the "Boyz" and they were not happy with the chrome.

Brian
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621 on February 01, 2018, 09:02:18 AM
I would not recommend BB.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Acmemopars on February 01, 2018, 12:23:18 PM
I'm not promoting spray-on chrome, but you should know that he's probably not talking about chrome coming out of a paint can.  That comment that chrome doesn't come from a can is 100% correct - full stop.

However, the process below "appears" to be real metal (maybe I'm wrong) or at least something very close.  This guy appears to be using several chemicals being sprayed on a metal gas tank using a pressurized pump sprayer.  An activator, a rinse and a metal spray, etc..

This process look a lot like the process of chroming and nothing is magic and coming out of a paint spray can.

At the very least, it's an interesting alternative and looks like real metal - not paint.

There are hundreds of videos on youtube showing the process.


Example 1:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9-wFTUhpT4

Example 2:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMhpnj5mj6o

Just some feedback.

Thanks
Mike Nelson
Denison, Tx

Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Dan LeBlanc on February 01, 2018, 12:49:05 PM
From the guy who made the second video posted when asked how it turned out:

"Not great.  I tried 3 different times and each time it didn't look right following their directions to a T. I ended up painting it silver and taking my losses."
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Acmemopars on February 01, 2018, 01:31:31 PM
Personally, I live very close (30 miles) to North Texas Chrome listed above and will be getting a quote to have them rechrome my back bumpers on my 57 Eldo.

Do you think they will be able to grind, sand and smooth out the corrosion and pits in the Aluminum ?
I'm assuming yes since this is their core business, but this is my only concern.

Thanks
Mike
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: The Tassie Devil(le) on February 01, 2018, 05:31:26 PM
Each and every imperfection has to be ground out back to virgin material, then filled.

They simply cannot remove a complete layer of metal as it would re-shape the item.

Bruce. >:D
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Bob Hoffmann CLC#96 on February 01, 2018, 06:17:50 PM
I would suggest you find a shop that has a track record of chroming those ends. Someone on the board should chime in. The average shop has NO IDEA what's involved.
Bob
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: INTMD8 on February 01, 2018, 09:12:08 PM
Agreed with many here, would never try to "spray chrome"

I see a lot of modified vehicles many of which have had body color matched painted bumpers which were once chrome.

The chips on those pieces are at least 500-1 compared to the body as the metal is so thick it has no give.(so it takes off the paint easier)

Even if the spray chrome looked good I do not think it would last very long.


And those aluminum eldo bumpers, I would not bring them to anyone that isn't experienced with doing them.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: ByronF on February 01, 2018, 09:24:23 PM
Well it would appear that the consensus opinion is to re-chrome and not bother with some of these new fangled spray chroming processes. Probably very good advice. May have to do one bumper per year. I live in Canada and the cost of shipping to the US, having the work done, then shipping back and paying the exchange rate plus taxes at customs on the return is just too steep. So I have to use local sources and of course they know what the above procedure costs so they price accordingly. Charge what the market can bear I guess, but at least I have 3 shops locally and within reasonable distance that I can get quotes from. And one of them I do know does exceptionally good work based on the examples I have seen on vehicles on local cruise nights. But at least they have tanks big enough to do the whole bumper at once.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: TJ Hopland on February 02, 2018, 04:59:38 PM
I can't find the process I'm thinking of but I believe at least one step of the process takes place in a vacuum chamber.  Does that ring any bells with anyone?  There must be some key word I'm missing in my searches.   Its most commonly used for an anodized look to plastic but apparently can also look like chrome.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: amolnayak on February 03, 2018, 01:31:44 AM
I have learnt the hard way that there is no substitute to good chrome. Especially if you live in large cities with pollution and humidity. In Mumbai we have chrome plants which will do the chrome job for a whole car for 1000 dollars but that chrome will pull off after 3-5 yrs depending on how good you take care of it. And then you have to do the whole process all over again. This really makes the base metal thinner every time. We also have good chrome plants now and they do a phenomenal job and that of course can be in the 5000 dollar range or more depending on the size of the car. I have realized that if you intend to keep the car long term just get it chromed at the best plant you can afford and no headaches for a long long time. 
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Caddyholic on February 03, 2018, 10:45:38 AM
I company that I do some powder coating on 02 Buick wheels or me was getting set up for this process called future chrome. I dropped off a spare 61 interior door panel piece. Had ask if he could use it for practice. He did and I stop by weeks later to pick it up and it did not turn out very good. Parts of it look ok and part of it looked brownish. That was in 2015
He is now closed and I don’t think he ever got the process down pat.

https://www.futurechrome.com/
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: fishnjim on February 04, 2018, 11:39:40 AM
www.spectrachrome.com
I contacted these guys a couple years back and what I refer to as "spray" chrome.   It was featured on one of the "Mobsteel" shows they did a '53or54 Packard.   
A 50 or 20 foot chrome job.   Spray like paint then spray water to activate.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Seville1957 on February 16, 2018, 02:09:58 AM
Quote from: Acmemopars on February 01, 2018, 01:31:31 PM
Personally, I live very close (30 miles) to North Texas Chrome listed above and will be getting a quote to have them rechrome my back bumpers on my 57 Eldo.

Do you think they will be able to grind, sand and smooth out the corrosion and pits in the Aluminum ?
I'm assuming yes since this is their core business, but this is my only concern.

Thanks
Mike

Hey Mike,

I'm in the same boat with my 57 Seville, was quoted $6,000 to do my rear bumpers, OOUCH. But hey cars these nice deserve the investment, not some cheap spray chrome. That's like getting you girlfriend a wedding ring from a bubble gum machine!
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Justin Norwood on February 16, 2018, 09:54:30 AM
I am looking at rechroming the front grill on my '47, but the wait time was "at least 12 weeks." I needed something faster, so I am trying out a powdercoat solution called: prismatic coating powders - super chrome uss4482. My flying goddess was just completed and I plan to pick it up in the next few days. I'll let you guys know how it turns out.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Flyer on February 16, 2018, 02:25:13 PM
I recently had chrome work done on my 1962 Thunderbird roadster at a shop in Terrill, TX, Morales Chrome, 972 524 3966. They did both front and rear bumpers, parking lights, and head light trim for $1200.00. The work looks very good, at least as good as it came from the factory. Theirs is a cash only business.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: Justin Norwood on February 17, 2018, 10:50:01 AM
Following up on my experience with trying out Prismatic's "Super Chrome" on my flying goddess. Please see the attached pic - Prismatic on the left, my 70 year old pitted chrome on the right.

My assessment:
The Prismatic "Super Chrome" isn't good enough to pass for chrome. not even close, really. Even if you did the entire car in this powder coat, it isn't good enough. The Prismatic is metallic, but a dull gray. It isn't reflective...it is like looking at a smoked mirror. Maybe not even that good...it's one shade lighter than a gun metal gray paint.

Furthermore, when I asked if the powdercoat place would be willing to try more parts (e.g. grill), they declined the work citing the pot metal and how it causes bubbles in the powdercoat.

Net/net - I wasted $100 giving this a try. I then took my front grill, hood lip and flying goddess to a chrome shop that agreed to do those three items for $2,000 with a 6 week turnaround time. I feel robbed, but it is what it is. Thank the EPA for putting most chrome operations out of business.
Title: Re: Chrome or Spray Chrome
Post by: cadillacmike68 on February 18, 2018, 12:28:47 PM
I don't think these "spray" places are using chromium, I'm pretty sure they are using aluminum. Most PVD processes are definitely aluminum. 

Now, aluminum can be polished up pretty nice. I have rims from my 40 yr old Raleigh Professional bike that look almost as bright and shiny as chrome, but they are just highly polished aluminum. However, they need a lot of care to keep looking that good.