Author Topic: 1966 California smog vacuum issues  (Read 535 times)

Offline 67_Eldo

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #20 on: February 08, 2018, 09:09:40 PM »
Since I'd mentioned before that a 1966 Carter differs from a 1967 Q-Jet, I figured I wouldn't repeat my disclaimer again. But I'll do it this time. :-)

The issues I mentioned weren't carb or intake-manifold specific. The Q-Jet reference was to strike fear into the hearts of those who believe they can toy with Cadillac carbs with impunity. If you can protect a Q-Jet, you can protect anything! :-)

I'm certainly not recommending that you switch to a Q-Jet! If the car came with a Carter, it should remain with a Carter.

Having said all that, I'll provide a bit more detail about how my dirty-fuel fears were amplified.

Since my car had accumulated very few miles in the 15 or more years before I got it, the carb was full of "varnish." One of the reasons it cost a small fortune to rebuild was because a considerable amount of varnish -- old fuel that had dried up inside the carb -- had to be removed. Anything under the Eldo's hood that dealt with fuel (such as the fuel pump) was full of this varnish. Then, after the carb rebuild was complete, I asked "If the varnish buildup was that bad in the carb, wouldn't it also be pretty bad in the gas tank?" They had to admit that my point was a good one, but they didn't want to drop the tank because they didn't want to drop the tank.

The external filter I took a picture of is not a stock filter. Nor is the fuel-line plumbing stock. The fuel line from the (rebuilt) fuel pump to the carb is all new custom metal fuel line. So if you look at any Cadillac shop manual, you won't see anything that matches my car.

With the extra fuel filter in place, I was able to run all sorts of additives to the gas while worrying less about chunks of varnish breaking loose in the gas tank and clogging up my recently de-varnished Q-Jet. I used Seafoam and Lucas Oil and other stuff for a few months. Since it doesn't take long for the Eldorado to drain a tank of gas, I ran lots of fresh, treated gas through the system. It appears that whatever varnish there may have been in the tank was dissolved in the new gas + additive combo rather than breaking into chunks and clogging filters. But I'm glad I took the precaution anyway.

To attach your new bowl, you'll probably have to buy some new fittings and pipe or hose. You can then locate the new filter anywhere you choose. I would suggest not mounting it too close to an exhaust manifold! :-)

I think Greg's temperature sensor idea is a good one. I might do that on my car because the dashboard is half disassembled and my stock temperature gauge is not in the instrument cluster at the moment. I might use Greg's technique to pop in an aftermarket temp gauge until I get around to reassembling my instrument panel. It looks like it will be quite a while before I'm able to put my dash back together and I'd like to know the engine temperature in the meantime. But I don't want to mess with the original sensor because I'm ultimately going to return to it. So that's my rationale for, perhaps, going with two temperature sensors.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 09:14:02 PM by 67_Eldo »

Offline 35-709

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2018, 09:29:45 PM »
Hmmm, no air compressor.  If you're working on your car, that pretty much comes under the basic tools category. 
You say you rebuilt your carb --- compressed air is regularly used in the rebuilding of carburetors to make sure any dirt/crud, whatever, doesn't remain in any of the narrow passages.  An air compressor is rather essential, it doesn't have to be a huge shop compressor. 

Yes, that fuel bowl is incorrect, possibly you can use the top off your old one but, of course, if your old one is still intact just replace the filter element in that or just go with the throw-away type filter can.

I am quite sure Summit does not sell a temperature sensor that will work with your Cadillac temp gauge, they are not "all the same".  Your local NAPA store should be able to get you a proper replacement or get one here ---
http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/cadillac,1966,deville,7.0l+429cid+v8,1320220,cooling+system,temperature+sender+/+sensor,4748 
Any of the three under the "Standard Replacement" heading should be fine.
My recommendation is, don't buy cheap.  Unless yours has already been tampered with, the connection between the old and new senders should be the same.

OK, back to your fuel lines.  The idea is to get whatever old gas and crud out of the lines that might be in there rather than pump it through to that freshly overhauled(?) carburetor with the fresh gas (filter or no filter) --- which you will have now that you have decided to drop the tank and clean it/have it cleaned.  Without a compressor: disconnect the fuel line at the fuel filter, attach a hose to it and run it into a can, as I described before, crank the engine until you get fresh fuel, reconnect the fuel line and start the engine.

Good luck!
« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 09:35:37 PM by 35-709 »
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod

Offline CadillacGirl_1966

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2018, 09:36:23 PM »
Thanks for the info! I do want to keep the car as original as I can. Thats why I want to go with the original sensor but as I mentioned I cant figure out how to connect it. All I have is an old sensor and a green wire with just a ==O on the end of it.. if that makes sense? So I figured something must be missing. The one from summit racing has a connector that comes with it but I think it is for connecting to a pigtail which I apparently no longer have.

All I could find was the 1965 wiring. I wish I had known classic cadillac wiring website existed, because I literally went through and colored in all the lines by hand and had it laminated myself hahaha... I'm going to buy the larger sized one. It's only 30 bucks.

I'm still confused why my fuel filter doesnt have the bolt in the top to attach it to the oil fill tang. I see one of you posted a photo of yours that looks the same. But little things like that bother me lol.. I imagine it wont be a big deal once I have the proper fuel lines in place but for now I am going to have to use the old setup. I am sure my landlord must have an air compressor lying around somewhere (he's a car and "stuff" hoarder for real) but you dont think that would be too much pressure for blowing the line out? I have zero experience with this.

Offline 35-709

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #23 on: February 08, 2018, 09:41:18 PM »
It won't be too much pressure if you are just blowing out the line, i.e., the line is completely disconnected at both ends.  The tank end will be disconnected when you drop the tank, the pump end will have to be disconnected.  BUT, use the "No compressor" method that I described above since you will have a clean tank with fresh gas to flush the lines out.

The bowl type fuel filter you bought is a generic, your Cadillac came with a fuel filter bowl designed for that application.  Maybe one of the parts guys here has a correct filter bowl setup to fit your car.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2018, 09:44:53 PM by 35-709 »
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod

Offline 67_Eldo

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #24 on: February 08, 2018, 09:49:50 PM »
If your stock temp sensor is like mine (which I think it is), the little loop (or spade) simply snaps onto the top of the sending unit. On my car, that was a very tentative connection. I used some small pliers to tighten up the connector so that it snapped more firmly onto the sensor.

Still, it is (IMHO) a relatively fragile connection compared to most others on a big, beefy ol' Caddy!

And if it is my pic of the fuel filter you mentioned, don't use that as a guide. That isn't the way it came from the factory. The Q-Jet has its own fuel filter built into the carb itself. I don't know if the Carter has a built-in filter, but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't.

Offline CadillacGirl_1966

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  • Name: Jennifer Doak
Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #25 on: February 08, 2018, 09:52:07 PM »
As far as the carb goes yeah, I dont think I did blow anything out. But it wasnt that dirty in there to begin with. I hope theres no crap in there just have to cross my fingers I guess.

That really sucks about the bowl. I didnt have an old one, it was just one of those throw away ones. I cant return it now :( it cost me 75 bucks too! That makes me so mad because it said it was for a 66. Grrr....

Offline 35-709

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #26 on: February 08, 2018, 09:55:00 PM »
It'll no doubt work but it won't be nicely supported in position like the original.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod

Offline 35-709

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2018, 09:58:37 PM »
Here is a pic of a '66 fuel filter setup.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod

Offline CadillacGirl_1966

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #28 on: February 09, 2018, 02:01:55 PM »
One of the wires i had attached to the transmission kickdown was actually the coolant sensor connector lol

But now it seems im missing a connection on the kickdown. Pic attached. I alsp removed the carter aftermarket (from the 70s i guess) emissions kit on the firewall. I found some info about them and i dont need it, its not original and it stifles the engine i guess.

Now i need to figure out where the missing connector is and where the oil pressure sensor is hiding.

Do you think there would be enougj crap and varnish in the tank that i should have it professionally cleaned? The gas cover has been open to the air for quite some time. Someone stole my gas cap many moons ago. Its an old radiator style cap so i cant buy a locking one.

« Last Edit: February 09, 2018, 02:07:24 PM by CadillacGirl_1966 »

Offline 67_Eldo

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #29 on: February 09, 2018, 02:46:40 PM »
Bruce Roe knows everything about the Turbo-Hydramatic 400 transmission and many others here are much more transmission-savvy than I am. However, I'll take a guess to kill time before the others arrive. :-)

It may well be that your vehicle only uses those two connections. While the vast majority of 1966-67 Cadillacs shipped with the "switch-pitch" option built into their THM 400s (types AA and AJ), my 1967 manual says that the commercial-chassis Caddys use THM 400 type AB hardware which did not contain the switch-pitch option. If that's the case, all you need is one wire to connect to the kickdown solenoid.

Looking at your picture, it doesn't look like anything has ever been hooked up to that terminal. Like maybe forever? So my guess -- and it IS a guess -- is that Cadillac used the same switch they used for the rest of their cars (that contained switch-pitch THM 400s) and simply didn't hook up that one terminal. I would seek a second opinion on that one.

The oil-pressure switch (or sender or sensor or whatever) is at the back of the engine, right on top. I've attached a picture of mine.

Onto the gas question. It your car running? If not and if that gas cap has been missing for years, I'd give serious thought to having the gas tank cleaned out. Locking or not, I'd get some kind of cap on there right away.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2018, 03:01:02 PM by 67_Eldo »

Offline 35-709

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2018, 07:20:31 PM »
Jennifer, do it right and get that tank out and cleaned!  Even more important if that tank has been opened for "quite some time".

Here are your fuel tank caps, including locking ones ---

http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/cadillac,1966,commercial+chassis,7.0l+429cid+v8,1492838,fuel+&+air,fuel+tank+cap,5900 
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod

Offline 55 cadi

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #31 on: February 10, 2018, 02:21:08 PM »
Yes the tank needs to be replaced or cleaned and lined, I know this from experience with my Cadillac, it will damage your carb, I had a 1/4 inch of sludge in the bowl of my carb from the bad stud in tank.

Also I know in California that your car is over 25 years old so you don't have to have those extra smog parts on it, unless the car was bought that way from new then keeping it that way for originality, but can be removed completely if you wanted, I believe, unless there is something in the retract is needed to make car run, I don't know.
I had a 66 mustang convertible in California and I removed those because it was considered a classic and didn't have to have on
Jason
1955 Cadillac sedan series 62
1966 mustang convertible w/pony PAC, now in Sweden

Offline chrisntam

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2018, 06:14:39 PM »
If you don't have a compressor, you can get an air tank, fill it with air, get the appropriate air fittings (a blower nozzle) and some rubber hose.  For several more dollars though, you can get a cheapie air compressor.

Disconnect the gas lines at the tank, disconnect the lines that connect to the fuel pump.  Blow the lines out.

Not sure if back to front or front to back is better...
1970 Deville Convertible  MTS 507
Dallas, Texas

Offline 67_Eldo

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2018, 06:58:58 PM »
If you don't have a compressor or a tank handy, you can rent a compressor from your local Home Depot.

https://www.homedepot.com/tool-truck-rental/Electric-Air-Compressor/AC1-HE02-05HD/index.html

That's what I'm going to do when soda-blasting time rolls around in the Spring.

Offline CadillacGirl_1966

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2018, 07:48:00 PM »
I had this tank cleaned and repaired a few years back. It shoild be ok to just be cleaned out again. Its a commercial chassis only tank.

Oddly enough someone has plugged my oil pressure sensor hole with a bolt. Dunno why. I will have a look again on the kickdown wiring to see if i can get it correct. As far as i remember the switch was working before.

Pics attached. Where can i get a correct sensor? I know someone mentioned the temp sensor i thought was for my car actually wasnt so i want to make sure. It puzzles me why theyd plug it up like that though.

Offline 67_Eldo

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #35 on: February 10, 2018, 08:01:09 PM »
Maybe the sensor was leaking? People take surprising shortcuts when faced with the prospect of spending money on an old car, even when a correct fix isn't tough to execute.

That oil sensor is a common one. You should be able to find it at any local parts store. For example, we have O'Reilly's auto parts on the Great Plains. They offer three options. The consensus is that you (usually) get what you pay for when faced with bargain options.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/shop/ignition---tune-up-16776/engine-sensors-17084/oil-pressure-sensor-switch-12875/1966/cadillac/deville

Offline CadillacGirl_1966

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Re: 1966 California smog vacuum issues
« Reply #36 on: February 11, 2018, 04:20:49 PM »
Oh ok great. Yeah i have found quite a few things on this car over the years that were totally mickey moused. I will order a new sensor but keep that little plug just in case. I've mailed a few places about having the tank cleaned. I get my other hearse back from the shop tomorrow so i will be able to bring it over there. I'll try to drop it today but its a little harder to jack up than a normal car lol

Those locking type gas caps arebt correct for my car. I know because i have bought one thinking it would fit lol.. I had a radiator cap on there for a while. Fits fine. Maybe the first two listed on rock auto are the right ones they do look very similar.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 04:24:25 PM by CadillacGirl_1966 »

 

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