Author Topic: Best Cadillac ever made your  (Read 729 times)

Offline 64CaddieLacky

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2017, 10:18:53 PM »
I think you could easily divide this subject up into categories, and get a variety of different answers.

Powertrain-
Safety-
Interior Style and fit-
Exterior Style-

It should be of no surprise that, at least through 1970, the reliability of the powertrain and mechanical features such as disk brakes, dual MC, and 472/500 engine steadily improved over previous models.  In fact, perhaps the most damning indictment of Cadillac is that at some time in the early 80s, the powertrain was inferior to that of a decade earlier.  I consider that pretty embarrassing. 

The styling questions are far less generationally tied - I can go for 33, 40, 60, 65, 69, even 79 or 85 Seville.  On any given day, I might say I prefer a different one.  I guess it is somewhat of a consensus that after the mid 60s, there were aspects of the interior that were cheaper.

All together, I guess I think the most complete one of everything might have been 1960.  But I have never owned one.



Very true, such a great post!

Cadillacs from the 390 engine up until 70 or even 71 with the 472/500 had great performance and are secretly sleeper hot rods lol. Performance and reliability did suffer in the mid 70s-80s all that emission crap really screwed things up for a long time. So in many ways a 68 or 69 was a much better car than say a 78 or 79 model although its 10 years older. Progress in this case was not good during those days. But fortunately the industry lived, learned and survived it took forever but the engineering improved mightily in the 90s when Cadillacs were finally great performers once again.

Fit and finish and quality was tops up until 65 or even 64 because in 65 more plastics made its way into the interior but I love the dash on the 65s. My 64 doesnt really have plastics I can think of, its all metal, nothing is flimsy or cheap feeling either. Plus the chrome trim went from being bright and blingly to a more satin finish in 65. 64 was the last year of very nice bright work IMHO.

Looks are subjective and each decade had their own unique designs. I always see the 70s Cadillacs being very conservative, gangster and mafia like. Much more serious looking cars but also the most comfortable. The 50s were very youthful, flamboyant and exciting. The 60s fun, elegant, with clean designs, still youthful with a more grownup design.

But what all of them shared which we all can agree on, is that sort of classiness every decade had going for em which is long now. All that chrome, big bodies, long hoods and trunks, and beautiful trim was like wearing nice jewelry. That classiness ended when GM decided to end the Fleetwood production in 96.

I would even conclude the 92 Brougham the absolute last Real classic traditional Cadillac ever made that was still easily recognizable by the general public.

I get in something new, and they all feel like toys, not real cars. I hop into my 64 and Im still wowed by it. These were real cars with such a solid feeling that cant be replicated anymore. I feel special driving it, and I am sure many of you here can say the same thing about your classic caddy.
1964 Sedan Deville
1994 Fleetwood Bro
1972 Sedan Deville (Sold)
1968 Coupe Deville (Sold)
1978 Lincoln Continental

Online cadillacmike68

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2017, 12:09:17 AM »
I think the best years for Cadillac was 1967-70, with 1968-70 better than the 67s because of the 472 Engine.

1970 DeVilles didn't have Vs so that is a minor detractor for that year.

1969-70 didn't have front vent (or rear vents on Fleetwoods) more minor detractions.

1968 didn't have a closed coolant recovery system, but it does have a temp gauge.

Lots of little things changed in these 4 years, but these were the most nicely appointed and power full size Cadillacs ever built.

Oh yeah, power dropped considerably from 1971 onward with the de-tuning and lowered compression engines.

The Oct 2003 volume of collectible automobile has a great article on these cars:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1954-OLDSMOBILE-F-88-1949-52-DODGE-1967-70-CADILLAC-1932-34-FRANLKIN-V-12-/131818701289?hash=item1eb101c1e9:g:DFQAAOSw9r1V87De


Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike
Current:
1968 DeVille Convertible
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2009 STS NorthStar Platinum ed RWD
2011 CTS PRemiun ed Sedan RWD
Past:
2008 CTS Premium ed Sedan AWD
2005 CTS Hi-Feature Sedan RWD
2000 ElDorado ESC Hard Boot Convertible
1995 Fleetwood Brougham
1973 Sedan DeVille
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1969 DeVille Convertible

Offline 59-in-pieces

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2017, 01:34:46 AM »
Johnny,
A picture is worth a 1,000 words.

1931 Cadillac 452A V16 Pininfarina Roadster - Boat-tail Speedster

 Have fun,
Steve B.
S. Butcher

Offline Steve Passmore

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2017, 02:34:25 AM »
Wasn't the cloth to keep the prices down.

As an aside, all the GM products down here that emanated from USA/Canada were trimmed with Leather.   Even the Chevrolets and Pontiacs, right up until something like 1965.  Even the base models, which in fact was all we ever got, and 4 doors at that.

Bruce. >:D

Odd that, because the same applied here and not just GM.  All cars, even imports that were assembled here got leather. I'm guessing it was a cheaper product back then and they were looking for ways to get it used up? It can actually be cheaper now than some of the cloth out there.
Steve

Offline jdemerson

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made (Export models)
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2017, 07:12:22 AM »
Wasn't the cloth to keep the prices down.

As an aside, all the GM products down here that emanated from USA/Canada were trimmed with Leather.   Even the Chevrolets and Pontiacs, right up until something like 1965.  Even the base models, which in fact was all we ever got, and 4 doors at that.

Bruce. >:D

Odd that, because the same applied here and not just GM.  All cars, even imports that were assembled here got leather. I'm guessing it was a cheaper product back then and they were looking for ways to get it used up? It can actually be cheaper now than some of the cloth out there.

Bruce and Steve,

     You've mentioned a point that is fascinating, but little information about it seems to be known.

     From 1950 through 1957, the list of interior trim codes includes unique codes for export model sedans. (I haven't checked pre-war models or models from the 60s.) The upholstery for these models is invariably all leather, and usually two-tone (2-tone gray or 2-tone brown, and later 2-tone green or 2-tone blue). Typically trim codes are listed for Series 62 sedan and for Series 60S. An excellent source for all this is the following page from the Raritan Chapter:
http://www.rrrclc.org/the-cadillac-color-upholstery-accessory-database-1940-1979/

Here's an example from 1953 MY: There are seven trim codes, ALL leather, listed for El Dorado. There are six more, ALL leather, listed for Series 62 convertible. For the Series 62 sedans the only leather interior trim codes listed are these:
58   Lt Gray Leather & Dk Gray Leather   53-6219,19X   Export
59   Lt Tan Leather & Dk Tan Leather      53-6219,19X   Export
I note that unlike for 1950-1952, the Series 60S DOES have a couple of all leather trim combination listed in 1953 and NOT designated as "Export". But in 1950-1952 U.S. models, even the 60S Sedan was NOT available in all-leather -- except possibly as a Special Order.

Members have reported that there were EXPORT models sedan that had CLOTH interiors in these years. But the Data Books show export models with all leather, and those trim codes were NOT listed as options for U.S. models. But were they available in the U.S. as S.O.?

I've wondered about the availability and the appearance of these unique Export trim codes on Cadillac 4-door sedans sold in the U.S. So, for example, were trim codes 58 and 59 available on models 6219 and 6219X in the U.S. on 1953 models?  If so, was it through Special Order only? Does such a car exist today in the CLC?  Can anyone point to a photo of such an interior?

I appreciate that these posts are off-topic, so if new information should appear I'll use material from here to create a stand-along post.

John Emerson
1952 Cadillac Series 62 6219X
John Emerson
Middlebury, Vermont
CLC member #26790
1952 Series 6219X
http://bit.ly/21AGnvn

Offline Scot Minesinger

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2017, 07:17:34 AM »
Great topic, thanks for posting it.  I drive my classics 4k miles per year (and use as daily drivers almost during good weather), so safety and drive ability are a stronger consideration than most.

In terms of drivetrain, drive ability, safety, looks, comfort, and prestige that is very difficult.  I like the 1970 DeVille Convertible.  To me it is the optimal Cadillac.  The engine, styling and seats are the super high points, and the look of the dash is the weak point. 

I loved my 1995 RWD Fleetwood, drove it from 36k miles in 1997 to 254k miles in 2005.  Amazing car, very reliable, powerful, and surprisingly great gas mileage.  It did not have the style of the 1970 Cadillac.

Really like the 1961/62 years, but from a safety perspective not quite as much.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

Offline James Landi

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2017, 07:36:41 AM »
Not a huge stretch for me, since I'm 72, to recall the "brocade-baroque " fabrics that were featured in living-rooms throughout America of that post WWII era.  My parents insisted on clear plastic covers on their 1960 CDV.   When they gave me that car in 1973, the clothe seats were still encased in the plastic, but alas, moisture, trapped under the plastic had certainly compromised the materials as well as the foam rubber supporting the seats.  I recall coming to a stop light shortly after receiving the gift and seeing that car in my rear view mirror with my wife driving it... by then it looked so out of date, and with wisps of blow-by emanating from under the car, that we quickly sold it, for the most part, because it could not pass NJ inspection-- but also because it was so oddly out of date. If my narrative sees odd, the OPEC oil embargo hit our area very hard, and owning an "old barge" that consumed so much gas as one's daily driver caused more sensible folks to question one's sanity.  That did not stop me, though, from purchasing a 6 year old 1967 Eldorado for $1,500--- no one wanted Cadillacs when you had to sit in "gas lines" for hours with a car that had such a limited driving range on a tank of gasoline.

Offline Steve Passmore

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2017, 08:01:21 AM »
I remember that time well too James. During the embargo here many American cars vanished off the streets or could be bought with just a few pounds but you couldn't drive them far.
Steve

Offline nysdarkblue

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2017, 02:14:29 PM »
Since I have owned my 1990 Cadillac Brougham for 15 years now, I would have to say the 1990 - 1992 Broughams. But I would love town a 1956 Cadillac Fleetwood.
Bill Estes
1990 Cadillac Brougham
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Offline The Tassie Devil(le)

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made (Export models)
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2017, 04:47:22 PM »
Bruce and Steve,       You've mentioned a point that is fascinating, but little information about it seems to be known.
     From 1950 through 1957, the list of interior trim codes includes unique codes for export model sedans. (I haven't checked pre-war models or models from the 60s.) The upholstery for these models is invariably all leather, and usually two-tone (2-tone gray or 2-tone brown, and later 2-tone green or 2-tone blue). ,.......
In the case of Australia, there were no Cadillacs exported from USA to Australian Dealers following WWII, as there were no RHD Versions built by Cadillac.   All Cadillacs imported to Australia were Private imports, and Converted to RHD by specialised companies.

The reason that the lower brands of General Motors vehicles (Chevrolet and Pontiac) had the Leather seats, was because these vehicles were put in the upper class of vehicles, and were made by the factory in RHD form.   Plus, the cars we got were imported from Canada in CKD form, and assembled locally, and to meet the financial constraints, had to contain a specific amount of local content, or they became REALLY expensive.

Local content was assembly, tyres, paint, glass, wiring, panels from the windscreen rearwards, and much more.   This is why cars of the 20's to the 40's looked different at the back from the US counterparts.

Bruce. >:D 
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Offline Jeepers Creepers

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2017, 11:38:29 PM »
    Sorry to all those that own 1961-1964 I think cadillac really f---up, I love the 59s,,,but I think the 1960 was the best

Oh Johnny, how could you not love one of these.  ;D



Kevin and Astrid Campbell
Australia
1964 Fleetwood Sixty Special.

Offline 64CaddieLacky

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2017, 01:52:12 AM »
Oh Johnny, how could you not love one of these.  ;D


Right! The last of the fins with beautiful interiors and still were very Cadillacish. How can you not like any Cadillacs from the 30s-60s? All were great cars in their own respects.

50s inspired styling died after 64. I owned a 68 CD so I know the major differences between the two.
1964 Sedan Deville
1994 Fleetwood Bro
1972 Sedan Deville (Sold)
1968 Coupe Deville (Sold)
1978 Lincoln Continental

Offline Jeepers Creepers

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2017, 02:18:34 AM »
Look at that smiling face....  8)

Those big slab sided beauty queens.
These two are like Vanilla smoothies.

Kevin and Astrid Campbell
Australia
1964 Fleetwood Sixty Special.

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2017, 10:47:56 AM »
First I heard anyone disparage the 61-64. These were extremely well built and tastefully executed automobiles which upheld the Standard nobly.

In terms of ride, quietness and handling/maneuverability, they were significantly improved over the preceding generation.   
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Online cadillacmike68

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2017, 02:06:25 PM »
I must admit, that I also like the early 1930's dual cowl phaeton convertibles. Those are extremely classy looking automobiles. But they're also very expensive today, and I would only be able to drive it for about a month or so here in FL, too damn hot the rest of the year.

1961-64; nice looking well built, not as powerful as the 1968-70, don't like the X frame & two piece drive shaft and there is no Climate Control (except in 1964 and it wasn't as refined as the 1967-70 years).
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 02:08:39 PM by cadillacmike68 »
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike
Current:
1968 DeVille Convertible
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2009 STS NorthStar Platinum ed RWD
2011 CTS PRemiun ed Sedan RWD
Past:
2008 CTS Premium ed Sedan AWD
2005 CTS Hi-Feature Sedan RWD
2000 ElDorado ESC Hard Boot Convertible
1995 Fleetwood Brougham
1973 Sedan DeVille
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1969 DeVille Convertible

Online mattb73lt

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2017, 09:37:50 AM »
1941 60 Special

I'm fairly new to the CLC and was never really a "Cadillac Guy" with my Antique car interests growing up. I've always liked Cadillacs, but mostly Pre-War Styling. I'm a driver, love working on anything old, but most of my enjoyment comes from using these cars for fun and adventures. The Sixty that I have was my father's for the last 20+ years. I've looked after it for the last 10, doing extensive mechanical work to it. I've completely rewired it and converted it back to 6V +GND, spent six months pulling the engine and fixing several mechanical issues before painting and detailing it. Made only two concessions to it, only to keep my father driving it as long as possible, power steering and power brakes(discs up front). Installed a high speed rear for roadability. The last major thing my father had done to it was a complete new interior, to original colors and styling. It's never been apart, mostly repaired and maintained as necessary. It appears to have been repainted at some point(lacquer) and we've repainted the hood, cowl and roof. So, after all that, it has become a very reliable "tour class" car. While it won't pull any trophy's, it does present well and always receives a lot of questions.

Out of all the cars I own, this one, honestly, is the most fun to use, most comfortable and RELIABLE. Everything works as it was intended, to include the heat system.

Yesterday (Sun, 11/12) was my wife and I's first outing to the new local chapter of the CLC. It was about 25 deg when we left the house with the heat cranked. Had it almost off, halfway there. We met some really great new people at brunch and then continued on for the rest of the day with it visiting family, friends and sight seeing. Did over 80 miles and spent the last hour on the highway, at night, coming home. Small trip mile wise, but the coldest weather it's been out in since I've had it. All in very comfortable, quiet conditions inside, even at highway speeds.

We've made numerous day trips with it, with up five adults in it. Even took it to Nantucket this summer for vacation. All of this with several thousand miles and zero issues since completing the engine work. It's become for us a very social car with the ability to bring friends along in comfort and always makes a grand entrance when we arrive somewhere.

 
1926 Ford T Runabout
1927 Ford T Fordor
1927 Ford T Coupe
1940 Ford DLX Fordor
1941 Cadillac 6019 60 Special
1960 Mack B-73LT
1963 Mack B-42P

Offline James Landi

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2017, 11:53:47 AM »
Your car is especially handsome and formal, and "design wise" marks the end of an era of body style evolution.  I applaud your up grades, especially regarding your desire to have an automobile that is both safe and comfortable ( I would be trying to figure out the next step--- a/c) Can you direct me (us?) to some picture?   Happy day,   James

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2017, 12:13:35 PM »
1941 marked the beginning of a new era in Cadillac styling in general.  In the 60 Special however, 1941 was the last year to use the original 60 Special coachwork that began 1938.

The following 60 Special was more of a stretched Series 62 than the distinct car it had been.

To many, the planets came into perfect alignment with the 1941 model and the 60 Special of that year had been the single most club-owned model almost since the CLC's inception. It may well still be the case today.

A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Online mattb73lt

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Re: Best Cadillac ever made your
« Reply #38 on: November 13, 2017, 12:23:36 PM »
Your car is especially handsome and formal, and "design wise" marks the end of an era of body style evolution.  I applaud your up grades, especially regarding your desire to have an automobile that is both safe and comfortable ( I would be trying to figure out the next step--- a/c) Can you direct me (us?) to some picture?   Happy day,   James
I have some posted in the Restoration area, I believe under 1941 60 Special. About a year ago.
1926 Ford T Runabout
1927 Ford T Fordor
1927 Ford T Coupe
1940 Ford DLX Fordor
1941 Cadillac 6019 60 Special
1960 Mack B-73LT
1963 Mack B-42P