Author Topic: Differences on Rear Window Moldings between Vinyl and Slick Top cars? 1967 - 70  (Read 332 times)

Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
I'm restoring my 1967 Eldorado which had no vinyl top at the moment.
Unfortunately it suffered from some rust around the rear window underneath the rear window moldings and my moldings are not salvageable after sandblasting...

I *think* all moldings were the same for 1967 - 70 Eldorados.

But there were 3 different moldings available for cars with and without vinyl roof.

- The vinyl roof moldings had a wrinkled finish - painted in the vinyl roofs color
- Cars with a "slick" top either had smooth finish painted moldings (like my car had) or
- Cars with a "slick" top sold in California or in Europe had chrome moldings.

The moldings for vinyl roofs seem to go much cheaper compared to the smooth and chrome ones. My bodyshop now had the idea to get a set of vinyl ones - strip of the wrinkle finish and make them smooth and paint them.

Could this plan work or are there any other differences between the moldings besides the finish? Do they have the same dimensions and thickness?
Or does anybody have good smooth ones for sale on here or knows a good source or recommended parts supplier?


mine after sandblasting



Thanks for any tips!
Gerald
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline D.Smith

  • Posts: 437
  • 1961 Sedan deVille
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #17592
  • Name: Dave Smith
I've only seen two types of moldings.  Grained for cars with factory vinyl tops and smooth ones for those without a vinyl top.
I've never seen chromed ones.    Are you sure those aren't just the smooth ones that have had their paint stripped off and buffed out? 


Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
I've only seen two types of moldings.  Grained for cars with factory vinyl tops and smooth ones for those without a vinyl top.
I've never seen chromed ones.    Are you sure those aren't just the smooth ones that have had their paint stripped off and buffed out?
Im pretty sure that chromed ones were available in 1967. Definitely for the European market. I have also seen them in person.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2017, 01:31:40 PM by www.eldorado-seville.com »
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline 67_Eldo

  • Posts: 148
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #30815
  • Name: sdownie
I have never seen chrome (from the factory) rear-window trim either. All of the slick-top 67 Eldorados I've seen have the trim painted to match the body, like this:

https://i2.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/1.jpg

Since I'm getting rid of a vinyl top, I'm going to strip the vinyl from my (black) rear-window trim and paint it to match the rest of the car.

Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
Since I'm getting rid of a vinyl top, I'm going to strip the vinyl from my (black) rear-window trim and paint it to match the rest of the car.
is there just some vinyl around them or is the grain stamped into the metal? We thought about converting vinyl roof moldings into smooth moldings as well, but we are not sure if and how it could be done.
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline 67_Eldo

  • Posts: 148
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #30815
  • Name: sdownie
Mine are smooth metal. The vinyl is glued on.

Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
Mine are smooth metal. The vinyl is glued on.
sounds promising! Thanks! I hope its not too difficult to remove?
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline 67_Eldo

  • Posts: 148
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #30815
  • Name: sdownie
The trim was easy to remove: The rust opened up the mounting holes and loosened up the spring clips! :-)

Go very slowly. There are a few bolts, but they're easy to get to.

I didn't have to use any force to pry my trim away from the body.

Offline Glen

  • Posts: 2270
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #727
  • Name: Glen Houlton
I have, somewhere, two or three sets of those moldings, but at the moment I cant seem to lay my hands on them.  They must be in my storage unit. 
As I remember the pattern is stamped in the molding.  But it was very lightly stamped, so it is my opinion that the stamping could be covered with a light coating of putty to convert them to the smooth moldings.   
Glen Houlton CLC #727 
CLCMRC benefactor #104

Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
I have, somewhere, two or three sets of those moldings, but at the moment I cant seem to lay my hands on them.  They must be in my storage unit. 
As I remember the pattern is stamped in the molding.  But it was very lightly stamped, so it is my opinion that the stamping could be covered with a light coating of putty to convert them to the smooth moldings.   
Thanks Glen! Would you consider selling a set to me?
Making smooth ones out of the grainy ones seems to be a possibility and thats what my bodyshop is considering as well as a last resort.

Thanks!
Gerald
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline Roger Zimmermann

  • Posts: 2288
  • Switzerland
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #21015
  • Name: Roger Zimmermann
The grain is stamped in the metal. I have some such moldings in my "parts for sale". I will have to go to my storage room to see their condition. I remember I ordered them for somebody but for one reason I don't remember he did not buy them.
I believe that the metal is too thin to make them slick. The alternative is to fill up the recessed area with a filler, but I'm not sure if the idea is a good one.
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham
1972 Coupe de Ville (not yet arrived)
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Offline www.eldorado-seville.com

  • Posts: 140
  • Gerald Loidl
  • Name: Gerald Loidl
Roger it would be great if you could check the condition.
I too think that filling them would be the way to go. The bodyshop does not see a problem doing this.
Im in Austria - so the parts would not have to travel that far ;-)

Thanks!
Gerald
Gerald Loidl
1958 Cadillac Eldorado Seville
1966 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1967 Cadillac DeVille
1967 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado
1974 Cadillac Coupe deVille
1978 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz
http://www.eldorado-seville.com
http://www.cadillac-bigmeet.com

Offline Roger Zimmermann

  • Posts: 2288
  • Switzerland
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #21015
  • Name: Roger Zimmermann
I will look at that during the week. I'll let you know!
Indeed, I went to my store room after I posted the comment above. I only have the upper and lower moldings as well as 2 corners. The lower molding is also damaged at both ends by the rust, similar to yours; the upper one and corners are without rust. These moldings were for a roof with vinyl.
If you need pictures, please tell me. The parts are at home now.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2017, 06:29:27 AM by Roger Zimmermann »
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham
1972 Coupe de Ville (not yet arrived)
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Offline J. Skelly

  • Posts: 123
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #15958
  • Name: Jim Skelly
A guy I met with a '68 had the vinyl top removed, and had the shop grind the textured pattern off of his moldings.  I wonder about their longevity with the thinner metal.  This is one item I mailed Dave Leonard (Original Parts Group) about making reproduction pieces of.  There is definitely demand for them.  I pulled some off of a painted-top '68 a few years ago for patterns, but they have rust issues.  Unfortunately, the rear window designs of these 'E' bodies lends itself to corrosion.
Jim Skelly, CLC #15958
1968 Eldorado
1977 Eldorado Biarritz
1971 Eldorado (RIP)

Offline 67_Eldo

  • Posts: 148
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #30815
  • Name: sdownie
I was wrong: The pattern *is* stamped into the metal. (I have a late-production California car.) The globs of adhesive goop that the previous owner slathered onto the back window fooled me.

I've talked to a number of body-shop folks in the last few months. The overwhelming consensus is that GM back windows (of the 1960s and 70s) were not designed to resist rust at all. A vinyl top will make the situation even worse -- I can attest to that -- but even the slick tops had rust problems designed in.

I am not going to putty over that pattern since that's the way that all of them (as far as I can tell) were made. The trim will be same color as the rest of the car.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2017, 10:36:46 AM by 67_Eldo »

Offline 76eldo

  • Posts: 4972
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #22443
  • Name: Brian Rachlin
Is it possible that a Riviera or Toronado might use the same shape outer moldings?

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
CLC # 22443

I prefer email's not PM's   rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Convertible with factory Tri Power
1960 Eldorado Seville
1970 DeVille Convertible
1970 Eldorado
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1980 Eldorado Hess & Eisenhardt Convertible
1981 Eldorado Hess & Eisenhardt Convertible
1985 Eldorado ASC Biarritz Convertible
2007 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 CT5

Offline Glen

  • Posts: 2270
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #727
  • Name: Glen Houlton
I was wrong: The pattern *is* stamped into the metal. (I have a late-production California car.) The globs of adhesive goop that the previous owner slathered onto the back window fooled me.

I've talked to a number of body-shop folks in the last few months. The overwhelming consensus is that GM back windows (of the 1960s and 70s) were not designed to resist rust at all. A vinyl top will make the situation even worse -- I can attest to that -- but even the slick tops had rust problems designed in.

I am not going to putty over that pattern since that's the way that all of them (as far as I can tell) were made. The trim will be same color as the rest of the car.

The slick top cars came with smooth window molding, I have owned a slick top 68 Eldo since 1973.  There were several zinc anti rust bars under the molding.  But the design trapped water under the molding. 
Glen Houlton CLC #727 
CLCMRC benefactor #104

Offline Glen

  • Posts: 2270
    • CLC Member
      CLC Member #727
  • Name: Glen Houlton
Thanks Glen! Would you consider selling a set to me?
Making smooth ones out of the grainy ones seems to be a possibility and thats what my bodyshop is considering as well as a last resort.

Thanks!
Gerald
It may take a while until I able to access my storage unit.   
Glen Houlton CLC #727 
CLCMRC benefactor #104

Offline JoeKarasinski

  • Posts: 189
  • Name: Joe Karasinski
The 3 cars use the same windshield and door glass. But all 3 use different quarters and backs.

 

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