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1936 cadillac series 75 limousine 5 passenger

Started by martyranfinson, March 18, 2014, 12:04:24 PM

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tozerco

Hold up there Steve! The luggage rack certainly looks correct to me. This is a "plain back" or "slant back" limo remember and all the parts (including some very heavy castings that fit between the chassis end and the bumper) are particular to this car back and this luggage rack. I have several photos of one on two '36 75 's here and both have the rear bumperettes turned through 180 degrees so they don't foul the luggage rack.

Very nice car with lots of very rare goodies (like that clock from the rear division! Yummo)!

I see they have found the achilles heel of these cars - the rot over the rear wheel well! There will be  a lot of manhours buried in that!!

That extra plumbing at the back of the block is a wierdo. I'd lose that along with the strange looking heater component sitting on the floor in the back. These cars had an exhaust hot air heater for the back seat passengers and it looks like someone has tried to rig up a substitute. The piping and heat exchanger are available new on Ebay (search Klasskollection). They are shown on Ebay for a '36 - 48 Lincoln but the guy will make them, including the branch pipework if needed, for '36, '37 Caddies.

Agree with you about the Running Boards. Just hard work. The guy who did mine new for me reckoned he would never do them again..... well, not for less than four times what I paid!

Should we tell him about trying to replace the '36 engine mounts?

Great to see a car like this being re-birthed but they were virtually hand built and there is very little of anything that was not specific to Cadillac and even the smaller series (60 and 70) won't help for exchange parts. I even recovered very little of use from a '36 parts car I had for my '37. As someone else has said, the '36's made the '37's very popular!
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

tozerco

Here's the Ebay Number for the exhaust heater:

230465177368
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

tozerco

...and a photo of the '37 variant of this car with the correct luggage rack:
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

tozerco

The link to the photos is very informative. Even back then Cadillac "rationalised" their production somewhat. It is evident from these photos that the floor pans for these 75 series cars seem to have the pressings in them for the seven seat arrangement (see Image 1394) even if the car was only finally a 5 passenger car. I see also that the divider partition has the cut-outs for the seven passenger seats to fold into (image 90 of 330) but they have just been upholstered over for the five passenger car (Images 1364 and 1383).

First time I've ever seen how they made the roof on these Formal Cars - they are not a single pressing welded in and loaded with lead as is the case for all the sedans but a totally separate roof pressing (Image 98 of 330) and a heap of separate pressings for the corners. A true Fleetwood "Composite Body" car!

Great photos though for anyone trying to re-build one of these cars.
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

tozerco

Last comment.....

Personally, I've always thought the luggage rack (that is a hangover from much earlier vintages) screws up the otherwise very fluid lines of these "slant back" or "plain back" cars from that era.
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

Steve Passmore

Quote from: tozerco on March 26, 2014, 12:58:24 AM
...and a photo of the '37 variant of this car with the correct luggage rack:

I can see your right John, but I have a hard job getting my head around Cadillac making a rack that would not actually fit the back of their cars without altering the over-riders!  Maybe it was a rack that Fleetwood found that was the only type they could make fit to the detriment of the bumper detail?

I can see no reference to a carrier on GM cars in general after 35 so I guess they had to do something on these trunk-less sedans?
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe

tozerco

Nah, Steve, they actually went to a helluva lot of trouble to stick that farmer's gate on there. If you blow up the photo of the brown car you can make out the HUGE cast bracket (bit like a shoulder bone) that is fixed between the ends of the chassis and the bumper.

Why people who insisted on carrying luggage didn't just buy a trunked sedan is beyond me. I guess we should be happy they didn't throw roof racks on it!

How's your newy coming along?
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

martyranfinson

Thank you guys for all your information. what about changing the engine mounts? Thanks, Marty Anfinson

martyranfinson

Hey Tozerco is that rear window two separate pieces of glass and also do u have a picture of the front of the 37 is the windshield suppose to have two separate pieces to? On ours the rear glass is one piece glass but when i ordered the seal kits the guy was saying it was suppose to have a split glass wondering if he is right?
Thanks, Marty Anfinson

Steve Passmore

Marty, your body style is a little different regards the rear window. your supplier is probably referring to the normal back window of a 36 Cadillac which IS a split window, well  actually one piece e but separated by divisions witch have rubber under the divisions creating three windows.    You will probably have to order the rubber by length and cut and glue it yourself.
The front screens are two separate pieces of glass.
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe

tozerco

Steve is right.

These Formal cars had a single rear window and the solution Steve offers is the way for you to go. I have never seen (but then again, I've never required) rubber for a single rear window. I will have a little bet that it's not particularly fancy or special anyway (unlike the split rear window rubber which has the extra flat rubbers for the two vertical bars). The rubber for the double front windscreen is available from Steele.
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

Jon Riley #13576

Quote from: S Passmore on March 21, 2014, 09:26:32 AM
Thanks Joe.  I have no idea why I cant access that.

What a lovely complete old car. I should be so lucky to have a car to restore in such original condition. The only thing I can see not correct Marty is the bumper 'overiders' or 'bumperetes' are on upside down, the longest section should be facing up.

One other tiny piece of advice, the inside visor brackets are made of cracker biscuits :-\  Just trying to remove the pressed rivets through the visor will break them all to pieces, mine did and it took years to find replacements, they are like hens teeth.

Looks like this 36 has smaller "bumperetes"  Or, they have broken off.  I can't tell.  This car is on Ebay, now.  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cadillac-Fleetwood-Limosine/181366600635?_trksid=p2050601.c100085.m2372&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140211132617%26meid%3D5886185198959979917%26pid%3D100085%26prg%3D20140211132617%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D181366600635%26clkid%3D5886185950687778557&_qi=RTM1562569

Jon Riley #13576


tozerco

I'm going to have a bet that those bumperettes have been cut off. I will also put two months pay on the "ZERO RUST" claim being bunkum!. These cars rust from the back forward and the admission to "dry rot" in the timbers and water damage visible in the back seat tells me:

1.    The rear window rubber has been the first to go - perished and split - so the water gets in. The sun damage to the leather roof suggests that the "Barn Find" barn door was open for quite a while;

2.    The water runs left and right (note how the leather roof cladding is highest in the middle and dips to the low point at the outer left and right hand edges? Water does the same internally - it runs down the grade to the left and the right. There is probably even a weld seam in the sheet metal to guide it there (I should check Jon's excellent photos on this);

3.    At the left and right hand ends, the water, which is now inside the car, has nowhere to go but down - onto the lapped joint between the rear fender and the wheel well in the body. Hence the severe rot in this location in the car Jon is restoring. It was the same in all three of my cars from this period - '36 and '37;

4.    To make matters worse, Fleetwood turned the outside flange on the floor pans UP on these "Plain Back" cars rather than down where the floor pan meets (but is not welded to) the "Plain Back" body panel along the whole of the rear of the car (above the bumper)..... creating a flat dam about 3/4 inch high all around the floor pan so the water sits in the up-turned flange floor area until it rusts through the pan.

None of this is visible or verifiable until the rear fender is removed at least and the rust in the floor can't be checked until the whole of the rear seat upholstery is removed (there is no way in from outside - no trunk to open!) or, at least, the fuel tank is removed and you try pushing a screwdriver through at a few points.

This car has got to be saved but the claims to "Zero Rust" are hysterical and totally unverified (and, in my view, not readily verifiable)!
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

Steve Passmore

I agree with you on all counts John, someone hated those bumperettes turned up the wrong way so lopped em off!.
This car looks a carbon copy of my 37 V12 in condition and that bit you said about the upturned floor pan where it meets the side walls is true also of the smaller Fisher bodies, mine has it.
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe

tozerco

The '36 V12 is doing OK on Ebay but it would want to top out soon or someone is going to bury a lot of money in it. I just noticed the damage to the grille and that alone will take some investment even if you can find a new one.

This car is unusual in that it is actually a 5 passenger car with the "occasional" seats, not the full seven passenger seat sets. I am still intrigued to note that the other car has the cut-outs in the back of the divider for these occasional seats but they don't appear to have been fitted and the cut-outs have been upholstered over.

Pretty rare car I would think so I hope it goes to a good home.
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

tozerco

The car was bid up to $21,100 and the reserve was not met. Just doing a few sums in my head and recounting Ty Stinson's advice on restoring a V12, allowing for totally new upholstery, paint, leather roof, new diecast grille etc. etc. (not to mention the highly probable diff problems that these cars are famous for) someone is kidding themselves if they knocked back that money. Nice car but.......
John Tozer
#7946

'37 7513
'37 7533

Dennis Moitozo

Quote from: martyranfinson on March 18, 2014, 12:04:24 PM
I am doing a full restoration on this vehicle and in need of tons of parts. The customer owns this car is from rapid city SD. This is the first 1936 Cadillac that we are restoring. I was wondering if anyone knows wheres theirs parts or has parts. Thanks for your time Marty Anfinson. If you wanna see pictures of it you can go to www.straightlinescustomrestorations.com

Steve Passmore

Looks like you forgot to write anything Dennis when you posted Martys quote?

Wonder what ever happened about this car as this thread went silent March last year?
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe

Ray Morrison #29582

Dennis, thanks for posting the link for this restoration.  I'd probably missed this thread if you hadn't. I'm in the process of gathering info for my 36-7019's continuing restoration. Mine came in pieces and this is the first chance I've had to see how things fit together. Mine didn't come with much to reference, so this is truly a great find for me. Good stuff!
36-7019 Fleetwood