Author Topic: 74 fleetwood AC  (Read 755 times)

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2017, 02:41:20 PM »
Ordered 5 12oz cans from ebay will have them by the end of the week. Will let you guys know how it turns out

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2017, 02:52:40 PM »
Just a suggestion that you don't put it all in at once. Start with a little and then check for leaks with A/C dye and a black light or other detection device - otherwise you could lose all your valuable R12.

A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2017, 03:42:25 PM »
Going to have it evacuated? and tested for leaks first by a friend who has a shop. If it is good then put in Freon. I have to get some oil I guess too.

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2017, 03:56:50 PM »
I guess Im gonna need to get some sort of device to get the r12 into the system. Side can??? is what was recomended. Question for you guys. I have never don this before how does the oil get introduced into the system?

Thanks

Billy

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2017, 04:13:45 PM »
If you're asking these questions, you should probably call in help from a local a/c pro.

I pretty much assumed the guy doing the evacuation was going to handle the recharge job.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2017, 10:06:46 AM »
No the guys that will be performing the vacuum test will not charge the system with r12 for me I will have to figure out how to do it myself

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #26 on: June 22, 2017, 10:48:34 AM »
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline EAM 17806

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2017, 11:23:52 AM »
My 76 deville was converted to R-134a about 25 years ago and it still works good; the cooling is comfortable and, in my opinion, you're better off converting to the R-134a for availability and reasonable future costs.   EAM
« Last Edit: June 22, 2017, 11:27:13 AM by EAM 17806 »
Ev Marabian

1976 Cadillac Coupe DeVille, 1989 Chevrolet Caprice Classic

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2017, 12:24:18 PM »
EAM...5 guys, a few of which have 134a conversions, are unanimous that R12 works better on cars born with R12 systems.

Aside of diminished cooling capacity, 134a is more prone to leak from an R12 system which was not designed with tolerances needed to prevent escapement of the smaller 134a molecule.

Since R12 is still available at relatively reasonable prices (thanks to the information age), it seems rather foolish not to take advantage of the fact, especially in light of the benefits it provides over the alternative. Original R12 systems are also preferred in the marketplace.

That said, everyone is perfectly free to do as they best see fit. 

Thanks.  :)

A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for Which There is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline Scot Minesinger

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2017, 01:13:30 PM »
Eric,

Yes, there dozens of places to buy affordable r12, however have yet to correspond with anyone in over a decade who can recover r12 from an automotive system to re-install after a non-leak issue was resolved.  This happens the most on the 1973-76 GM with VIR, where the VIR was incorrectly rebuilt or whatever.  Also can happen with a slow leak.

To service r12 you must have a r12 refrigeration devoted recovery system, and those are not inexpensive and unfortunately infrequently used.

To all on the forum please let me know if there is anyone out there who can properly service r12 by recovering it.

One issue/reason r12 was stopped was because it was often vented to atmosphere and not recovered.  This is a huge fine (past 25k) if it is done knowingly and the government catches the offender.

Adding cans of r12 into an automotive a/c system - does not a refrigeration service system make.



R134 is commonly serviced by most garages with the ability to recover.  No question r12 works better than r134 in a r12 designed system.  You can replace the rubber hoses and seals with r134 compatible products for relatively low cost.  The 1971 and newer r12 systems work well with r134.  Admittedly the r12 systems 1970 do not cool as well, and are probably not acceptable in TX with a black interior closed car.  For Virginia r134 is OK in 1970 and older Cadillacs.

If r134 becomes a problem in the future, which it looks like it will be, then maybe will buy an r12 devoted refrigeration recovery system.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

Offline "Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2017, 01:54:09 PM »
William
You are getting advice on everything from the history of R-12 to the advantages of it over R-134a. I believe the question you are asking is in regards to the mechanical process of charging your system. Although the process is straightforward in nature it is not one that those unfamiliar with refrigeration systems, their pressures, their temperatures and the hazards associated with possible mistakes in that process should jump into.  If you have someone that can leak check and evacuate your system why can't they charge it with r-12?

Scott,
Of course I have the recycling capabilities, and since I just use the r-12 for my own cars I can re-use it as opposed to a commercial shop where they have to re-cycle the material and cannot use it themselves.
The reason R-12 was on the "hit list" of the Kyoto Protocol was due to its ozone depletion potential since it was currently (then) being used for everything from a refrigerant to aerosol propellants to foam blowing .
Greg Surfas
Cadillac Kid-Greg Surfas
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75 Coupe deElegance
76 Coupe deVille
79 Coupe de ville with "Paris" (pick up) option and 472 motor
514 inch motor now in '73-

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2017, 03:49:52 PM »
Greg,

The guys said the would not install the r12 not that the couldn't. Another friend said he would help me after they checked for leaks. I realy appreciate all the info!!

Thank-you

Billy Epthimiatos

Online Dan LeBlanc

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2017, 03:56:31 PM »
Do you know FOR SURE what refrigerant oil is in there?  Before charging with R12, I would suggest thoroughly flushing the system and adding 525 mineral oil before recharging.

Dumping R12 into a system with unknown oil type could lead to catastrophic system failure in short notice.

A lot could have happened to the car from 1974 to today so you need to know what is in there first to save yourself some headache later.
Dan LeBlanc - CLC # 27657
1970 DeVille Convertible
1953 Series 62 Sedan (Parts Car)
1953 Fleetwood (Project Car)
2004 Deville

Offline ithaca1230

  • 1974 Fleetwood
  • Posts: 45
  • Name: william epthimiatos
Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #33 on: June 23, 2017, 08:21:40 AM »
I was counting on that the conversion parts were not on the AC and assumed R12 still being used. There still appears to be oil in the system.
Billy

Online Dan LeBlanc

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #34 on: June 23, 2017, 08:45:13 AM »
Yes, still oil in the system, but what kind?  How much?  Is it over full on oil?  Under full on oil?  There's really no way to tell for sure.
Dan LeBlanc - CLC # 27657
1970 DeVille Convertible
1953 Series 62 Sedan (Parts Car)
1953 Fleetwood (Project Car)
2004 Deville

Offline dochawk

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Re: 74 fleetwood AC
« Reply #35 on: July 01, 2017, 04:35:14 PM »
EAM...5 guys, a few of which have 134a conversions, are unanimous that R12 works better on cars born with R12 systems.

134a has only something like 2/3 of the heat transfer of R12--so on a conversion, you only get about 2/3 as much cold.

This may work in some climates, but I love in the desert.  People here who shelled out $60k+ for the mercedes with early r134a were *NOT happy about their new luxury car that couldn't't stay comfortable in the summer.


hawk
1972 Eldorado convertible, 2001 Deville DHS (daughter), 1997 Eldorado ETC (and now my wife wants an Eldorado!)