1937 Cad 7519 V12

[T.L. Stinson]

Hello:

I have an opportunity to purchase a 1937 Cad 7519 V12 4 door 5 passenger sedan in good shape for $15,000. Body is primed and ready for painting after some additional smoothing. Needs six new tires and windshield wipers. Needs an 8V batery, radiator work, muffler and pipe system. Has some cracked glass on sides. Has new wiring installed and has all new cloth like original. Seems to be all there but cant run the engine due to needed radiator work.

I want to restore and drive. Really like the car and the standing egg grill and I am about to make the purchase this week.

Please let me hear your thoughts pro and con)and comments about this model.

Many thanks.

Tyrone L. Stinson, Sr.

[Rusty Shepherd CLC 6397]

It sure seems like a bargain at that price as you describe the car. Those are beautiful cars with equally handsome and very smooth engines. I think youll find that it is actually an 8519 rather than a 7519 as all 75 series cars were V-8s. In 1936, Twelves were offered as both 80 (sharing 131 wheelbase with the 65 and 70 series V-8 cars)and 85 (sharing 138 wheelbase with the 75 series V-8 cars), but the shorter-wheelbase 80 series Twelve was not continued for 1937. 1937 75 and 85 series cars are identical except for the engines and engine badging on the bodies, unlike the Sixteens which had a longer wheelbase than any 1937 V-8 or V-12 Cadillac as well as several other body trim differences.

[T.L. Stinson]

Hello Rusty: Many thanks for your response and information. The asking price is $15,000. I have been talking about this car for almost a year. I offered $10,000 but the owner can accept $14,000. I need to act or lose the car. This is a very bad time for me to consider purchasing because I will have three children in college next semester. Sorry for the very personal information however I need to know if the vehicle is worth the investment even if it just sits in the gaurage for the next 4 years. I would be very happy just having it there to look at. The door jamb and under hood plates are marked Style 7519 Body 678. If in fact it is a Series 85 Fleetwood (wb 138.0) there were only 474 built with the V12 of seven models. I dont know how many of this particular 5 place touring sedan. So I am confused regarding Body #678. Would that be a body style or the body number for a 7519 with a V12 exchange? I could send pixs but dont know if you can send them here. Any way, many thanks for your time and interest. Ty

[Rusty Shepherd CLC 6397]

I really hate to advise you on purchasing any car when your kidscollege education is involved. If, however, you believe you can spare $14,000.00 and with the car in the condition you describe, I would buy it if it is a V-12 and pass if it is a V-8 which seems likely from the data plate. Just to make sure, raise the hoods and look at the engine and count spark plugs if necessary. Besides the number of cylinders, these engines are visibly very different.  The V-8 is an L-head/flathead design and there are flat cylinder heads with the spark plugs in the middle of the heads. If a 37 V-8 is still painted its original color, the entire engine (it is a monoblock all-iron design)will be painted Cadillac engine green which is a medium to dark olive green.  The V-12 is an OHV motor and basically the 1930-1937 OHV V-16 engine minus four cylinders.  It has a cast iron block and an an aluminum crankcase.  It is a much more handsome engine with beautiful black and aluminum ribbed valve covers and with the spark plugs (due to the OHV design)below them. It also has two updraft carbs (one for each bank)as opposed to one downdraft carb on the V-8.  This was the last year for the V-12 and the OHV V-16 Cadillac engines.  For 1938, both engines were replaced with a new flathead 135percent V-16. In addition to being a twelve-cylinder car, the reason Id go with the Twelve and pass on the Eight is that they are far rarer.  According to Maurice Hendrys Cadillac bible there were 3,227 75s (including commercial chassis)produced in 1937 as compared to only 474 85-V-12s and a miniscule 49 90 V-16s. Im interested to know which series the car youre looking at actually is as well as your decision. BTW: For $14,000.00, Id probably be content to just look at it, too, if its a Twelve.

[Rusty Shepherd CLC 6397]

I forgot to address the body number/model number issue. Cadillacs of this period were really easy to identify by their model numbers. The first two numbers were the year model, then a dash, then a two-digit series number followed by a two-digit body style. The body styles had the same numbers in each series (although, of course, not all body styles were offered in each series), so a 1937 La Salle 4-door 5-passenger touring sedan would be a
37-5019 and a 1937 V-12 of the same style would be a 37-8519. If I remember correctly, the body numbers are not always accurate, but the fact that the one shown, 678, is far larger than the entire 1937 Twelve production in all body styles, is, to me, just further evidence that the car is a 75 V-8. With 3,227 75s built that year, it is entirely possible that at least 678 were in the popular 5-pass touring sedan style.  The only 1937 series in which this style was not relatively popular (and, in fact, none was produced)was the 90 V-16 which is entirely reasonable as those cars were on a 154 wheelbase which provided a huge back seat area with ample room for jump seats and most often were chauffeur-driven, so all the four-door Sixteens that year were 7-passenger.

[T.L. Stinson]

Hello Rusty: Many thanks for your help. I plan to revisit the car this Saturday morning. The information from the data plate was provided by the owner and has me very curious (non-negative). One of the pictures shows the engine from the passenger side. What I see is a large black air clearner (a tank of a unit)off set to the left from the center of the valve cover. The valve cover has an oil cap in the center. To the right of the cap below the cover I can see three manifold exhaust units and one intake from the air cleaner mount which is located in the center of the manifold. I see part of the rotor cap in the front of the engine between the valve covers. the valve covers are solid aluminum in color. I think I see 12 horizontal ribs on top of the right side of the valve cover. I cant make out another air filter on the opposite side of the engine from this picture. I think it is a V12 but I will let you know Saturday. In any case, should there be a V12 in a car stating 7519 and body 678 for a production of 474? Would this be a special order or a late 1936? You seem to be very knowledgable and I thank you for your time and interest. If I could send you the pixs for your review please let me know. Ty

[T.L. Stinson]

Thanks again Rusty: Looks like we are thinking along the same path. I wonder if the V12 was provided at some later time. I will do a thorough look Saturday. Ty

[Jack mcilwraith #10584]

I have read somewhere [cant locate at the moment]that the 80 and 85 series bodies were given the 75 designations,so this probably is a v-12.

[JIM CLC # 15000]

04-21-05
Tyrone, reading your first post, dont put an 8 volt battery in the car.
That will give you screwey readings on the gas gage, plus shorten the life of the 6VOLT bulbs.
I hope you meant 6VOLTS and mis-typed it as (8)eight.
As for supporting your kids in school, a lot of people have carried a full load and worked their way thru college.
Besides, unless they plan to be Drs or lawers, a degee in basket weaving will get them a good position in the working world.
Good Luck, hope it turns out good for you, Jim

[T.L. Stinson]

Thanks Jim: I thought I heard the owner say it needed an 8 or 9 volt battery but I guess 6 volts would be correct. Many thanks. Ty

[T.L. Stinson]

Hello Jack: Many thanks for your comment. I will look at the car again tomorrow and write down all the information for the plates and the engine. Hope all is as it should be. Although, if it turns out to be a V12 put in at production of the car (special order?) in a V8 body production, or an engine exchange at a later time by an owner it may still be a great buy for the condition of the car and engine. I like the style of the car very much and the V12 would be a plus even though not an authentic match. I just wonder what the real purchase value should be now other than what I may be willing to pay. $10,000 to $15,000??? Ty

[John Tozer #7946]

The reason your V12 has a 75.. series of numbers is that in 1937 cadillac did NOT change the body plate numbers for the V12 cars - both V8 and V12 engined cars were plated as 75 series vehicles.

Hope this helps clarify this point of confusion.

Regards,


John Tozer

[T.L. Stinson]

Many thanks John:

I had read that the 75 and 85 were essentially the same other than the engine being V8 or V12 as you say. Now knowing that the plats for the year 1937 show no change regarding the engine will solve a lot of anxiety on my part. Thanks. Ty

[John Tozer #7946]

Ty,

If you want a reference for this, on Page 212 of the Standard Catalogue of Cadillac, 1903 - 1990 you will noice that, even though the section is headed CADILLAC - SERIES 37-85 - TWELVE, all the Style numbers remain 37-75....

I have also emailed you a copy of advice I received from Matt Larson who has done extensive research through all the Build Sheets in the Historical Centre for the 1937 75 series cars (V8 and V12) and gave me he same advice - that both V8 and V12 bodied cars have 75.... style numbers on their body plates.

So rest easy, it is most likely a genuine original car (might exlain why it is sooooooo inexpensive).

Regards,



JOHN TOZER