Author Topic: Allante collectibility??  (Read 4028 times)

Offline David King (kz78hy)

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #40 on: December 02, 2012, 04:10:21 PM »
Just a little fact on the Allante that surprised me when after our local CLC meeting happened a few months ago.  Being in Detroit, a lot of local members were very involved when some of these cars were in production.

The Allante is the 1st GM car with computer controlled components, meaning a LAN based system to operate everything.  So the electronics were a completely different than anything before and the 1st attempt at how the cars of today operate.  There is a specialist who works on these cars and won't touch it if the harness has been cut or altered.

I owned a '88 that I bought in '90.  Great car for ride and handling, but underpowered.  Lost my job and had to dump the car at a loss.

David
David King
CLC 22014
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Offline Guidematic

  • CLC# 19186
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  • Name: M. Jones
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #41 on: December 02, 2012, 06:49:09 PM »

 Yes, like I said the first car that employed multiplexing. Essentially a bunch of computors that talk to one another over a LAN, or as it's called in the truck and bus world these days, the J-1939. One module, an input will tell another, an output, to turn on a device. It sounds complex, but it greatly simplifies wiring.

 It's de rigeur amoung all vehicles these days.

 Mike
1970 Fleetwood Brougham 68169
1985 Eldorado Coupe 6EL57
1988 Eldorado Biarritz 6EL57
1990 Brougham d'Elegance 6DW69
1994 Fleetwood Brougham 6DW69

Offline waterzap

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #42 on: December 03, 2012, 01:21:17 PM »
Whats the deal with the brakes on these cars? For some reason they can be very expensive to fix?
Charlotte, NC
-1978 Eldorado Coupe

Offline 76eldo

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  • Name: Brian Rachlin
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #43 on: December 03, 2012, 08:05:36 PM »
The 87-92 models used the Bosch III braking system.  It will stop on a dime and give you 9 cents change, but it consists of a master cylinder, an electric pump and some kind of a pressure reserve cylinder.  It's a complicated system and not a lot of mechanics understand it.  Dealers used to charge about $3000.00 to rebuild the entire system and many of them went bad.  it's recommended to flush the fluid every other year.  No one ever did this when the cars were fairly new, so many of the systems failed.

Allante Source in FL has all of the tech support and parts available to keep these going.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
CLC # 22443
Current collection:
1960 62 Series Convertible
1970 DeVille Convertible
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1980 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1981 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1985 Eldorado Biarritz Convertible
1985 Eldorado Touring Coupe Convertible
1984 Seville
1985 Seville
1999 Eldorado Touring Coupe

Offline Guidematic

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  • Name: M. Jones
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #44 on: December 04, 2012, 09:00:48 AM »

 It is a complex and expensive system. We called it the Teves system. There was no self diagnostic ability like in the later systems either, so diagnosing it could be an issue.

 The main issue with them was the valve body would develop an internal leak causing a pressure loss. This would cause the pressure pump to run almost continuously causing it to burn out. Than bothe the valve body and the Powermaster unit would have to be replaced at great cost. This was an integral system, not like the later remote systems, so when the system went down, you had to repair it or you had very little braking ability.

 And yes, it could cost $3,000 to properly repair. But sometimes you could get lucky and it would only be the accumulator or the power relay.

 Another problem was the reluctor wheel on one of the front half shafts could split due to corrosion build up between the ring and the CV joint. This would literally cause the system to go into convulsions as soon as you touched the brake.

 Mike
1970 Fleetwood Brougham 68169
1985 Eldorado Coupe 6EL57
1988 Eldorado Biarritz 6EL57
1990 Brougham d'Elegance 6DW69
1994 Fleetwood Brougham 6DW69

Offline Caddyjack

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  • Name: Jack Larson
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #45 on: December 07, 2012, 05:03:35 PM »


 the Allante was quite advanced in terms of electronics.  So advanced that there was not room on the instrument panel for separate right & left turn signal indicators on the dashboard!
Actually, that's a Pininfarina thing. There's room for the separate signal indicators, but like the Alfa Romeo, they just indicate both at the same time when flashing. For whatever reason, the Italian half of this thought this was cool.

I have a pair of 'em...a black '91 and a white '92. They're BIG fun, and really do get a lot of looks and questions whenever I drive them. Yup, the top is a pain to some people. Takes me 20 seconds to raise or lower it. Once you know how to use it, it's easy, and folds into such a small space, the trunk in these things is HUGE.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 05:06:21 PM by Caddyjack »
Jack Larson
Philadelphia, PA


Offline Greg Powers

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #46 on: December 08, 2012, 07:38:21 AM »
I think that anything is collectible. Look at the people who collect Gremlins, Pacers, Pintos, and Vegas. It will never be a highly sought after Cadillac due to the many flaws that the car had from new. It's over the top electrical complexity and vehicle specifiic parts make it a very expensive Cadillac to repair. It also takes a mechanic trained by GM on the vehicle to make sure that the integrity of the systems remains intact. I probably paid for mine twice between the purchase price and expesive repairs (Bosch II brake system repairs with mjor components, top pull down mechanism, sound system failures, Speed Sensitive Strut system and several other less significant failures. Like with any Cadillac, Buy what you want and enjoy, that will bring you the greatest long term satisfaction. - Greg
G.L. Powers>1994 Fleetwood Brougham/1954 Series 62 Sedan/1958 Fleetwood 60 Special/1963 Series 62 Convertible/1971 Sedan Deville/2000 Deville-sold/2001 DTS-sold/1976 Eldorado Convertible-sold/1983 Coupe Deville-sold/1990 Allante-sold/1990 and 1991 Brougham deElegance-sold/1992 Brougham-sold/Always looking!

Offline D.Yaros

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #47 on: December 08, 2012, 04:16:29 PM »
There is something totally incongruous about any Cadillac having a manually operated top?  I say this as an Allante owner.  Yes, once one gets the hang of it, it is not that hard to put up/down, but still, it is a Cadillac.
Dave Yaros
CLC #25195
55 Coupe de Ville
92 Allante
62 Olds  

You will find me on the web @:
http://GDYNets.WebNG.com  -Dave's Den
http://GrayLady.WebNG.com -1955 Coupe Deville site
http://www.freewebs.com/jeandaveyaros  -Saved 62 (Oldsmobile) Web Site
The home of Car Collector Chronicles.  A  monthly GDYNets newsletter focusing on classic car collecting.
http://www.scribd.com/D_Yaros/documents

Offline 76eldo

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #48 on: December 08, 2012, 04:28:55 PM »
Two seat high end luxury cars have a real market, rich guys and their trophy wives.

As soon as the first trophy wife tried to lower the top on her Allante and broke a nail, it's all over.  Off the the Mercedes dealer to buy a one-button top lowering SL.

The tops on the 87-88's were horrible.  The next generation was marginally better.  90.5 through 93 was still manual with the silly  pulldowns that either didn't line up, stripped the gears, or half latched and then the top blows open at 60 mph.

If they were going to stick with a manual top, they should have copied the Corvette.

Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
CLC # 22443
Current collection:
1960 62 Series Convertible
1970 DeVille Convertible
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1980 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1981 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1985 Eldorado Biarritz Convertible
1985 Eldorado Touring Coupe Convertible
1984 Seville
1985 Seville
1999 Eldorado Touring Coupe

Offline D.Yaros

  • '55 Coupe de Ville
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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #49 on: December 09, 2012, 06:56:00 AM »
Two seat high end luxury cars have a real market, rich guys and their trophy wives.
Hmm, how in the heck did I end up with one?  I am not rich and my wife is the same age as me!
Dave Yaros
CLC #25195
55 Coupe de Ville
92 Allante
62 Olds  

You will find me on the web @:
http://GDYNets.WebNG.com  -Dave's Den
http://GrayLady.WebNG.com -1955 Coupe Deville site
http://www.freewebs.com/jeandaveyaros  -Saved 62 (Oldsmobile) Web Site
The home of Car Collector Chronicles.  A  monthly GDYNets newsletter focusing on classic car collecting.
http://www.scribd.com/D_Yaros/documents

Offline wcoates

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  • Name: Bill coates
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #50 on: December 09, 2012, 05:27:00 PM »
Have owned three( phase 1,2 and 3 ) and have already seen comments in this thread that pretty much summarizes my experiences/thoughts.  Top was a nightmare.  If powered from day one they'd still be making the car.  The 4100 engine was under powered and needed close maintenance on coolant pellets.   The 4.5 was bullet proof.  The N* was also a nightmare as I had the dreaded headgasket problem. Bosch brakes in '87-'92 were expensive to fix if maintenance was not performed regularly. 

Collectable- not in my lifetime.  Having said that, I have to say I think the car is gorgeous and as a summer ride/fun factor it has more bang per dollar than any Vette-Camaro or others.  Get a well cared for car and drive the heck out of it.  Collectable=no!

Offline 76eldo

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Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #51 on: December 10, 2012, 07:42:27 AM »
Dave,

I was referring to the cars when they were new... 8)

So many are getting parted out they will be a very rare car in ten years.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
CLC # 22443
Current collection:
1960 62 Series Convertible
1970 DeVille Convertible
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1980 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1981 Hess & Eisenhardt Eldorado Convertible
1985 Eldorado Biarritz Convertible
1985 Eldorado Touring Coupe Convertible
1984 Seville
1985 Seville
1999 Eldorado Touring Coupe

Offline APerrone

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  • Name: Art Perrone
Re: Allante collectibility??
« Reply #52 on: December 15, 2012, 10:58:21 AM »
I had a '91 that is still running great.  It has 190,000 miles on it and I never had any problems with the brakes other than replacing the pads from time to time and a brake line from the master cylinder to the pump.  I changed the fluid a couple of times, but nowhere near every year.  I am on my second Allante, a '92 with 92,000 miles and same goes for the brakes.  The top is no problem at all.  I can raise it and latch it within a few seconds.  The problem is with the mini covers if you have them in, and I always do, because you have to go around to the other side to take the right one out. 
I also have a '64 Deville convertible and the top is a bear to latch.  It takes 2 men to pull it into the holes and tighten the latch.  I even broke the latch trying to lock it in place.  It takes what seems like forever to get the top out of the boot and up to the windshield.  Once, when my son was following me with the '64, it started to rain.  We pulled over to the side and started putting the tops up.  I had the Allante top up before there was 50 rain drops on the seats  and the '64 was just getting to the windshield.  We almost drowned before we got it latched.
I have had an Allante since 1994, it is my daily driver and I tow it behind a motor home all winter, and although I have had problems, they weren't any more than any other car I have owned.
Collectible?  It would probably be a nightmare if you let it sit for months at a time.  It needs to be driven.  As far as the wife is concerned, if she can't operate the top, she can't drive it.  You would be surprised how quickly they learn how to operate the top without breaking a nail or even scratching the nail polish!
Happy Motoring
Art Perrone
Sodus Point, NY
'64 Deville convertible
'92 Allante
'99 Deville d'elegance
« Last Edit: December 15, 2012, 11:02:50 AM by APerrone »

 



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