3d printing basics and what sorts of Cadillac parts are possible

[TJ Hopland]

We have recently had several threads where the subject of 3d printing came up but wasn't really the point of the thread so it didn't go real deep into the subject but there seemed to be a lot of interest and a few members with some skills and hands on experience in the field so I figure maybe its time to start a thread on the subject.   

I will start out with some basics and my and how I became interested in the subject.  Later we can talk about the specific Cadillac parts.   Anyone with experience wants to jump in feel free.  Anyone wants to ask questions feel free.   I figure first we will talk about the basics of what is out there now on the hobbyist level.   I know I was very confused about what the options are and what things cost and what you need to do what sorts of things.   My experience so far is with FDM,  if someone else wants to cover what that is and what the other options are.....


I have been interested and kinda watching the field since I first saw something about Jay Leno getting a scanner and printer many (15?) years ago in his garage.  I don't remember what the show was called at the time or even if it was his show.  He may have just been a guest location on some other car show.   The show showed how they had some damaged super rare part on one of his cars that they were able to scan then re construct.  They then did a plastic 3d print to do test fits and then I think they made a mold and had the part cast because at that time there were not high temp plastics or metal 3d printing materials. 

Of course the first ones were sort of diy prototypes that evolved into very complex and expensive units that a hobbyist could not afford so budget limited enthusiasts began to build their own from 'off the shelf' parts.  Companies started to notice what people were doing and decided we can just throw all the parts together in a kit which then evolved into we can just sell a mostly or fully assembled units that we have today for as low as $150.   

The main limitation a beginner would have with the $150ish  units is they have a pretty small build volume.   Build volume is how big of an object you can make.    The smallest ones tend to be in the 4 inch by 4 inch and 5 inch tall range.   That's fine if your ultimate goal is to make fancier hotels for your Monopoly set or maybe clips for your Cadillac's sun visor but its going to be a frustrating limit for a lot of other stuff.  $500 these days can get you something with a 12x12x16 ish volume that can print a few but not all of the popular materials.   In the design software you can split up an object in such a way that you can assemble it into something larger than your printer can print but that doesn't work all objects you may want to build. 

Quality of print isn't as tied to the cost as you would think.    In the hands of an experienced person you may not be able to tell the difference between something printed on a $150 printer vs a $1000 one.   Besides build volume the thing you tend to get for more money is the ability to reliably print with a wider range of materials.  Some materials are very forgiving when it comes to temperature stability and are very easy to reliably feed into a simple inexpensive machine while others can be very temperamental and require extra features and precision in the printer to work reliably.

The different materials all have different characteristics as far as your finished product.  Temperature stability is a factor.  A knickknack to sit on a shelf doesn't matter much when it gets soft but something you are going to put under the hood of your Cadillac like that windshield wiper motor cover someone was talking about does need to stand a reasonable amount of heat.   How brittle or soft it is as well as chemical or UV resistance are also factors depending on your application.   Some materials can cause wear on the printer parts so that can be a consideration.   Materials that require higher printing temps can be hard on the less expensive printers so there are a lot of factors to consider.   Don't forget about cost too.   Could be a big cost difference going from a $20 roll to $80+ if your parts are very big or you plan to make a lot of them.  If its a more temperamental material you may also have more failed prints which will waste more time and material.   

Thats all I have time for now....  again anyone else with some experience fee free.   I suspect there are a lot of people interested in the subject just don't know where to start or the basics so that is what I hope to cover here.  Maybe eventually it could evolve into its own section here were we help each other out with designs and making parts for our cars.             

[MaR]

I have made a variety of parts and even more models for my '74 Eldorado so far. I do my prototyping on hobby printers and anything that I want made out of something durable, I have professionally printed out of what ever material is suitable for the application. Some parts are nylon, some are ABS, and some are metal. Nothing that comes off of my hobby printer would be considered "production quality". It's just not good enough.

[Scot Minesinger]

This is a huge positive for our hobby, and it has many other very useful applications.  I envision that there are 3D printing centers like Kinkos, where you send in the electronic file, specify the material, they print it and then ship it to you.  Or we have our own 3D printers.  The issues will be updating equipment, keeping heads (and other things) that print the material maintained, size of printer, scanners, and getting a good file to print.  One piece units, such as say the kick down arm on the 472/500 engines that engage passing gear is a great application for this technology.  Drill out the rivets on the old unit, and use thru bolts to attach the new printed arm.  The arm might be printed at home or a local 3D printer.  the possibilities are only limited by our imaginations - imagine printing out the chrome grilles on the front corner marker lights for a 1970 Cadillac out of a chrome like material in an hour, instead of re-chroming an original for like $1,000 and two months with a risk the chrome thickness makes it not fit anymore.

[MaR]

Here is an example of a part I reproduced. I started out with an NOS part and I made a few sketches of it.






From that, I made a solid model of the part to be able to print it.






After that, I printed sections of the part out to test fit it on the housing it mounted to.








Once I was satisfied with the geometry, I had it professionally printed. The white one was the printed version.





From there, I prepped and painted it.






And then I mounted it to the housing and then the assembly to the car.







I did the same process for the turn signal filler: model, prototype, professionally print and then paint and install. Once you have one of them, making the other side is a simple click of a button.















Also, once you have the parts modeled, you can make changes to improve on them. For example, why do the two parts above need to be two parts?

[Scot Minesinger]

WOW!!!!!!

[MaR]

Here is something else I printed and just used as is from my home machine. It's a support collar and distributor adapter for an oil pump priming tool. I used a steel rod for the actual pump spinner and 3D printed parts for the supports. I even was able to integrate in helical oiling groves in the collar so it would not wear out so quickly.

[TJ Hopland]

Matt's first photos of the below the headlight piece is a good example of how for prototyping you can deal with a smaller printer.  Obviously for that application you probably would not want your final product in 3 pieces to be glued or bolted together but it works great for prototyping.    And I think it was Scott who said someday it will be like Kinkos,  boy that dates us all doesn't it?   Didn't they stop using that name in the early 2000's?   As far as I can tell at least where I live it is that way now.      I google 3d printing and get about a dozen hits and 11 of them are shops that will print for you and that is just local.  Internationally there are even more options   I do live in a fairly large metro area so it may not be that way for everyone yet but I'm sure its coming.

For some parts and some people the hobbyist quality parts may be more than good enough.   Take something simple like a knob or lever or like I mentioned above a clip for a sun visor.   Sure if you look close you could tell it was a home 3d print but compared to having a missing or broken part or maybe having to pay a lot for a 'real' one if you can find one it may be a great option.  The ability to be able to take them to a 'pro' and get them made from just about any material you can afford is just a bonus. 

So far I have mostly printed other people's designs but have successfully made 2 of my own.  My next projects which are still simple designs are going to be toolbox organizers.  I figure those should be good things to learn about because they are all basic simple shapes so I stand a good chance of success rather than getting frustrated trying to design something too complex.  The next one I'm planning is some sort of rack to hold some long allen socket bits I have that are always rolling around loose in the drawer.   After that I will likely look and see what the next set is that is rolling around loose.  The allens drive me nuts (or should I say fasteners?  ha ha) because at a glance they all look pretty similar so its hard to tell or guess the sizes unless they are all in line.    The are not like regular sockets where the diameters and heights vary so are easier to identify. 

[MaR]

Here is something else that people with 425/472/500ci engines are familiar with: the spark plug wire clip that mounts to the rocker cover bolt posts.






I just have not bothered to print them out of a durable material yet but they do fit and work as intended.

[MaR]

Matt's first photos of the below the headlight piece is a good example of how for prototyping you can deal with a smaller printer.  Obviously for that application you probably would not want your final product in 3 pieces to be glued or bolted together but it works great for prototyping.    And I think it was Scott who said someday it will be like Kinkos,  boy that dates us all doesn't it?   Didn't they stop using that name in the early 2000's?   As far as I can tell at least where I live it is that way now.      I google 3d printing and get about a dozen hits and 11 of them are shops that will print for you and that is just local.  Internationally there are even more options   I do live in a fairly large metro area so it may not be that way for everyone yet but I'm sure its coming.

For some parts and some people the hobbyist quality parts may be more than good enough.   Take something simple like a knob or lever or like I mentioned above a clip for a sun visor.   Sure if you look close you could tell it was a home 3d print but compared to having a missing or broken part or maybe having to pay a lot for a 'real' one if you can find one it may be a great option.  The ability to be able to take them to a 'pro' and get them made from just about any material you can afford is just a bonus. 

So far I have mostly printed other people's designs but have successfully made 2 of my own.  My next projects which are still simple designs are going to be toolbox organizers.  I figure those should be good things to learn about because they are all basic simple shapes so I stand a good chance of success rather than getting frustrated trying to design something too complex.  The next one I'm planning is some sort of rack to hold some long allen socket bits I have that are always rolling around loose in the drawer.   After that I will likely look and see what the next set is that is rolling around loose.  The allens drive me nuts (or should I say fasteners?  ha ha) because at a glance they all look pretty similar so its hard to tell or guess the sizes unless they are all in line.    The are not like regular sockets where the diameters and heights vary so are easier to identify.

Personally, I use Shapeways to do my professional printing. They are reasonably priced and have a huge variety of materials and methods available. I have been making and selling 3D printed reproduction parts for old video game systems for years now and Shapeways has always come though for me.

[MaR]

Here is what can be printed with a state of the art, full color 3D printer. This was printed as shown below with nothing done to it after it was printed.

[MaR]

You can also 3D print metal:

[TJ Hopland]

Yes to most of us darn near seems like there is no limit to what can be done today.   I know they are literally 3d printing rocket engines that have successfully got payloads into space.    I'm sure for an an engineer or some other highly skilled person there are still limits but its growing by leaps and bounds practically daily. 

I have not actually contacted any of the local shops yet and I'm sure some of them just have really good websites and are just people in their mom's basement with a $150 printer but at least one of them I recognize as a company that has been doing a lot of custom cnc stuff for years and had a pretty big facility so chances are decent they are legit pro's. 

The other great use for hobbyist 3d printing is where you don't actually need a 3d printed part for the final project.  The 3d printed part may just be some sort of fixture or jig to make it easier to make what ever it is you are making.   Think of things like the Kreg pocket hole jigs.  You could fairly easily design and print something similar to that especially if you didn't need it to last for 100's of holes.   Even if it did need to last there are ways to do metal inserts.    Maybe you just need a stand to hold your climate control programmer steady on your workbench?   Tons of uses where the 3d print just helps you get to the end goal.     

[MaR]

Yes to most of us darn near seems like there is no limit to what can be done today.   I know they are literally 3d printing rocket engines that have successfully got payloads into space.    I'm sure for an an engineer or some other highly skilled person there are still limits but its growing by leaps and bounds practically daily. 

I have not actually contacted any of the local shops yet and I'm sure some of them just have really good websites and are just people in their mom's basement with a $150 printer but at least one of them I recognize as a company that has been doing a lot of custom cnc stuff for years and had a pretty big facility so chances are decent they are legit pro's. 

The other great use for hobbyist 3d printing is where you don't actually need a 3d printed part for the final project.  The 3d printed part may just be some sort of fixture or jig to make it easier to make what ever it is you are making.   Think of things like the Kreg pocket hole jigs.  You could fairly easily design and print something similar to that especially if you didn't need it to last for 100's of holes.   Even if it did need to last there are ways to do metal inserts.    Maybe you just need a stand to hold your climate control programmer steady on your workbench?   Tons of uses where the 3d print just helps you get to the end goal.     

I just printed a jig for a project last night.

[PHIL WHYTE CLC 14192]

I visited the NASA JPL centre in California last year, I have a friend who works there. Anyway, while we were there another friend of my brother turned up and he worked in the engineering dept. He showed us round there and i was really impressed with the 3D printing being done in metal. They made what they called metal fabric, like chainmail. I know NASA is obviously cutting edge but I think the potential for small production runs of rare metal parts will be affordable on machines like these in the not too distant future. Phil

[MaR]

I visited the NASA JPL centre in California last year, I have a friend who works there. Anyway, while we were there another friend of my brother turned up and he worked in the engineering dept. He showed us round there and i was really impressed with the 3D printing being done in metal. They made what they called metal fabric, like chainmail. I know NASA is obviously cutting edge but I think the potential for small production runs of rare metal parts will be affordable on machines like these in the not too distant future. Phil

You can do this right now.

[TJ Hopland]

I'm sure NASA is able to print some pretty exotic materials including metal but I think even some of my local websites say they can do 1 off parts in aluminum and stainless.   I imagine its not the identical stuff you would machine but it must share a lot of the properties to be still called aluminum or stainless.    I believe its a centering process that starts as a powder which they have been doing gears and other cast like parts out of for several years now.   The difference is before it was more of a mold casting process that was baked where as the 3d version I think uses a laser to 'melt' or center the metal.    Center as in the middle and centered as in the metal process appear to be spelled the same, gotta like English eh? 

Chainmail is a reasonable example of something you can do with a 3d printing process that you can't do the same way with other methods.   I assume the only way to manufacture the stuff in the past was you has to make the link with an opening so it could be inserted in the next link.  Once inserted you then had to close it up somehow which would effect the time look and possible the strength of the product.   If your link had to be flexible enough to be bent closed that would mean it would take a similar amount of force to un bend and fail it.   With a 3d print the parts are just created at the same time so there doesn't have to be a design compromise just because you have to be able to assemble it.   May be other compromises but for some products you get a better product.   I think that is one reason they are doing rocket engines and medical parts.   The 3d process allows once piece designs that would have been impossible to assemble.

One of my first prints was a cat toy that was a hollow ball with small holes about the size of a golf ball with a small ball inside it.   My cats didn't care but I thought it was a neat demo.   I can't find it at the moment but another demo I printed was a gear bearing.  Its a planetary sort of design with the gears having  hearing bone teeth so they stay in place.  Mine is more of a fidget spinner sort of thing but just the fact that I could print something that spins fairly freely after spending less than $500 and a couple weeks tinkering around really shows the possibilities.     

[67_Eldo]

I'm the person who printed out the windshield-wiper-motor cover for my 67 Eldorado. That was my first foray into printing ABS parts a few years ago.

I have a cheap ($300) printer that has a "hot-end" modification, meaning it can print materials at slightly higher temperatures than it could out of the box. For automotive parts, you typically need to use 3D filaments that require higher temperatures to print. ABS plastic is just about the lowest-temperature material you can get away with for the demanding automotive environment. My printer can just barely reach a printing temperature that allows it to use nylon. But at that point, if I want a quality print using a more temperature-resistant material, I'd be better off shipping my design off the the aforementioned Shapeways.

That's the process I used to create one of my favorite (to date) pieces. I wanted to put 1968 mirrors on my 1967 Eldorado. Most of the Eldorado body pieces between 1967 and 1970 are interchangeable. But thanks to the safety regulations of 1968, the external rear-view mirrors needed to be a) larger, and b) able to break away from the door more easily. Therefore the way the 1968 mirror mounts to the door differs completely from 1967's solid, simple attachment. I wanted an adapter that would allow me to attach a 1968 mirror to a 1967 door without requiring me to modify either the door or the mirror.

I've attached a pic of the result (fitted to the 1968 mirror). It is a solid aluminum print from Shapeways. Although I printed a number of prototypes in ABS to get the sizes right, plastic would not be strong enough to actually hold the mirror to the door under real-world conditions. Shapeways offers a number of materials, but all the metals other than aluminum are sintered together from the powdered form of the metal (e.g. steel). Aluminum was the only metal that Shapeways could actually "melt" into one solid piece using a laser 3D printer.

That piece (along with a tiny retainer you can't see) cost about $100 to print and required about a month of turnaround time. So it isn't like taking film to a one-hour photo (if anyone does that anymore).

Generally speaking, in most cases it is probably faster to fashion a piece out of metal or fiberglass than it is to model and print. And printable materials are going to be quite limited for the foreseeable future. But once you've got it done, you at least have all the dimensions of the part in your computer. :-)

[76eldo]

Mitchell,

The parts that you have made for your car are amazing.
I need some of the spark plug plastic holders for a 1973 500 engine.
Would you consider selling me a set of 4?

Thanks
Brian

[Highwayman68]

So should we have a Folder or a thread for everyone to add their files too with pictures of the final product  so everyone has access to them? This seems like it will be come the normal soon so why not get a head of it now here.

[35-709]

Mitchell,

The parts that you have made for your car are amazing.
I need some of the spark plug plastic holders for a 1973 500 engine.
Would you consider selling me a set of 4?

Thanks
Brian

Those are readily available from Dorman through your local parts store (they can order them if not in stock) or Amazon, eBay etc.  Dorman makes them in 2, 3, or 4 hole configurations.

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/dorman-help-spark-plug-wire-retainers-40283/9110092-p?product_channel=local&store=9232&adtype=pla&product_channel=local&store_code=9232&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIj4GH6YTe6AIVBp-fCh1lRQ8MEAQYBSABEgLRUfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds