New '57 owner. Lots of problems.

Started by car go b00m, August 25, 2022, 11:29:22 PM

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Jw4

#100
Quote from: Lexi on November 30, 2022, 01:39:01 PMThe seller had to know the mess this car was in.
Not necessarily. Since this was a dealer, they might genuinely have no idea what they are selling. Furthermore, giving them the utmost benefit of the doubt, they might've even driven it once, across the lot, and it performed okay (did not stall, stopped by itself, and did not have time to drop the coolant, etc., all over the place). Then it stood, for a while, and the original brake cylinders started leaking (because they were corroded inside, due to previous extended storage, and that short dealer "test-drive" ruined the seals).
Moreover, there is sometimes a great difference in opinion between different people evaluating the same car, especially if they are not well familiar with it. Thus, it is extremely important to inspect it yourself, of course. I've only purchased one car unseen (turned out to be great, by the way) but it only cost $2k, and I only committed to paying the towing fees before I had a chance to see it (the seller was actually from my town, the car was stored elsewhere, so he was also interested in bringing it here).

Quote from: Jon S on December 01, 2022, 02:54:55 PMThis particular car is a very unfortunate situation, and I believe the seller should be exposed for what he is.
Given the fact that they swapped in a broken glass and, somehow, forgot to tell the buyer about it, I would definitely at the very least leave them appropriate feedback all over the internet.
Ivan Beliaev

Lexi

#101
Quote: Drivers window was smashed and held together with tape after I was told all of the glass was good:  (you're gonna love their reply..)  "oh, didn't I tell you about that?  A guy with a pink coupe stopped by and needed a replacement window.  We took the window off of this (your) car, and sold it to him, and swapped the broken one into yours." End quote

If we are to accept only one item; that they failed to advise of the window situation, their credibility is seriously in question if not zilch. If the sale to the OP had already been finalized THEN they sold the window, that is even worse, dare I say even criminal (in some jurisdictions). The vendor would have zero credibility. They have a responsibility to know what they are selling and to honestly represent it. That is their business. Yes, 2 sides to every story, and we have only heard from the OP who may be an habitual complainer type who has not told us of certain facts, but it doesn't look good on the seller at this point. In court as we used to say, at this juncture the seller's is not a case that I would like to defend. Would you buy a car unseen from this vendor? Clay/Lexi

Poncholover

At least you have great bones & super curb appeal. Those are the most important. If the only trouble is mechanical, if you get it right the first time, you will be done. Sleep on it this winter.
Flattie Caddy

Jon S

#103
I find it very funny that people think not using a car causes major problems. There are times I don't use my 1958 for six months at a time and I have never had leaking brake cylinders or engine mechanical problems.  I'm not saying we shouldn't use our cars more often but I'm tired of the excuses that not using them causes major problems.  These cars were very well-made and over designed in many cases.
Jon

1958 Cadillac Sedan De Ville
1973 Lincoln Continental Coupe
1981 Corvette
2004 Mustang GT

Lexi

We can apply Ivan's remarks to provide some benefit of doubt, but the OP's narrative indicates that there are issues, perhaps even criminal matters if all is factually reported. As usual with these cases the narrative fails us at critical points as Ivan indirectly noted. Mike's advice I think is sound, as the owner has the winter to determine what the car requires so he can make a decision whether to fix or sell this car come spring. But the owner has apparently not adopted my tip on who can assist him in that regard, (as per the last time I spoke with my shop). His claim is that he can't find anyone to help, though I provided him with a professional who can. Hopefully he will keep us posted. In conclusion, the optics are not good. Clay/Lexi

Jw4

#105
Quote from: Jon S on December 02, 2022, 09:03:22 AMI find it very funny that people think not using a car causes major problems. There are times I don't use my 1958 for six months at a time and I have never had leaking brake cylinders or engine mechanical problems. 
Jon, you are right. In general, short periods of storage (seasonal) are perfectly fine. It would still depends upon the storage conditions, though. Having the car sitting in a warm and dry garage is obviously different than having it on the street with significant temperature variations (condensation, freezing, etc.).
It is the longer storage which causes problems. With brakes specifically: have you ever noticed rust stains on the inside of the brake cylinder walls, underneath the outer rubber dust seals? What about rusty fluid? Glycol-based fluids absorb water and, if not changed in years, might cause the cylinder to rust inside. If you take it apart and clean everything, you might be able to save it by polishing. However, if you start using such cylinder as is, the cylinder walls and seals might get scored with corrosion debris. So if you get an older car (ore one which was sitting for a while) and want to keep the original brakes, I would recommend inspecting and servicing them before you start using it, as to avoid doing potential further damage to it.
Ivan Beliaev

car go b00m

#106
Here is where I am with, everything...


My father, who turned 84 today is not doing so well.  The chemo isn't working.  He doesn't know about this car. The idea was to drive up to see him in it and surprise him. He grew up with cars of this era. His sister and her husband had a 58 series 62 convertible in the mid-60s.  This would make his day.  Not only did I get cheated out of a summer with this car, but so did he. 

My mother, whom is not in the best of health herself, is beside herself worried about him.

I'm worried about the both of them.


I sold my house to my brother, so that I could move closer to work/out in the country.  I splurged a bit and bought myself my long awaited 57 Cadillac. We won a huge, ten year contract at work. They gave us all promotions, and raises. Then two months later, laid us all off. They call it "redistributing us".  We have the choice of no job, or being transferred to another location. Now I am stuck living in the house that I used to own, minus my garage, with my brother whom is understandably annoyed that I have his money, and the house. It doesn't help that we absolutely hate one another.

Last week whilst driving to work, I was merging on to the highway, and that apparently didn't fit in with another guys plans. It annoyed him so much that he chased, then cut me off, and did the swerving brake check thing.  I moved to the far left lane. He did the brake check swerve thing, and misjudged. Clipped the right front corner of the vic with his left rear quarter.  He PITTed himself into the concrete median.  I have a scuffed bumper, and a broken head light.  OPP charged him with careless driving.  Then promptly charged me with the same...because... sure..  why not?  Easier than investigating and then making an actual decision, I guess. Charge'em all and let God sort'em out.  There's $1500 to fight that, plus even more stress waiting.  Not to mention fixing the vic.


This is why I am so frazzled and impatient.  This is what my life has been from as far back as I can remember. Bad luck. Stress.  The simplest things turn in to disasters of epic proportions. It just piles up and up and up and up and up.

As for sending the car out, yes, a shop was recommended to me, and I tried to have to taken there, but CAA will not tow a car to or from a storage unit.  I cannot drive it home from the storage unit to be towed from there, so its stuck where it is until I can justify spending that much money on a private tow to have it taken somewhere to pay someone to diagnose and maybe fix it, and then pay to have it private towed back.  I've spent the guts of $45k on a running and driving car, that does neither of those things.  While I have the cash on hand, a lot of it is earmarked to buy my next house.  Also, I am understandably red and chapped at the whole situation.  More money is like pouring salt on it.


As for leaving the car till the spring; that is not an option.  This car has to go, or it will have to go.  I'm not going to have another immobile car sitting around soaking up funds and taking up space. Its costing me $300/mo for the storage unit.  The Prelude and the Z are both stuck because of no longer available parts. I can't have a third paper weight in the fleet.  Summer and life are both too short.  It has to be on the road next summer, or it's history.


Now thats out of the way...

With the car up on stands, I found that the left front wheel as a distinct 12 to 6 o clock wobble.  I have a set of brand new lower balljoints, and a set of uppers on the way. 

I was surprised (and annoyed) to find that the uppers are still riveted in place.  Original ball joints after 65 years and [10]4000 miles?  Of course...

I was hoping that they had been replaced at some point in the past six decades so that I wouldn't have to drill rivets out.


I haven't had the drums off yet, but, I noticed that the wheels spin with absolutely no resistance what so ever.  The slightest touch, and they spin freely for minutes on end. I am thinking these brakes are way out of adjustment. 

I am on self imposed/self declared stress leave, so I will be going down tomorrow to have a look at the brakes, and perhaps replace the lower ball joints.  I may even tackle the rag joint. 

...that is if a meteorite doesn't crash through the roof of the storage unit and knock it off the stands while I'm underneath it. 




Anyways, here's some parts porn for having to listen to my ranting...







Comparison between the pump to carb lines. Caddy Daddy vs. InlineTube.

The fleet:

1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (broken)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (broken)
1999 Honda Prelude (broken)
2011 Ford CVPI (almost fixed)

Lexi

#107
Quote from: car go b00m on December 04, 2022, 10:50:52 PMAs for sending the car out, yes, a shop was recommended to me, and I tried to have to taken there, but CAA will not tow a car to or from a storage unit.  I cannot drive it home from the storage unit to be towed from there, so its stuck where it is until I can justify spending that much money on a private tow to have it taken somewhere to pay someone to diagnose and maybe fix it, and then pay to have it private towed back.  I've spent the guts of $45k on a running and driving car, that does neither of those things.  While I have the cash on hand, a lot of it is earmarked to buy my next house. 

I spoke with a vintage car and Caddy buddy who routinely uses CAA to tow his cars. In his opinion there should be no reason why they would not tow your car from a storage locker. You probably ran into a driver who was over zealous and made a decision that he was not authorized to make. What probably cancelled your tow arrangement would be if your car does not have a valid licence plate (renewed). I assume you bought the car "uncertified" so you must have a mechanic here issue a certificate of mechanical fitness. No pun intended but based on all your mechanical complaints with this car, it looks like you are far from having it certified. Without a valid plate, you would be dead in the water. Odd that the driver would not mention such as that pre-condition is clearly noted on the CAA site, which among other guidelines states; "Vehicles that are unlicensed/un-plated or have invalid plate stickers", (will not be towed), for example. I did not see any mention of a dealer plate though, (perhaps a way to satisfy this requirement?). I also did not see any mention of a storage locker nullifying removal for a tow. The link below provide CAA rules for towing and what is not acceptable. Some drivers want to see all the paperwork, others do not care. Clay/Lexi

https://www.caasco.com/auto/roadside-assistance/roadside-services-guide

Michael Petti

Hegarty insurance has towed my car on occasion from my house. Maybe your insurance company would do the same.

car go b00m

Quote from: Lexi on December 06, 2022, 02:07:32 AMI spoke with a vintage car and Caddy buddy who routinely uses CAA to tow his cars. In his opinion there should be no reason why they would not tow your car from a storage locker. You probably ran into a driver who was over zealous and made a decision that he was not authorized to make. What probably cancelled your tow arrangement would be if your car does not have a valid licence plate (renewed). I assume you bought the car "uncertified" so you must have a mechanic here issue a certificate of mechanical fitness. No pun intended but based on all your mechanical complaints with this car, it looks like you are far from having it certified. Without a valid plate, you would be dead in the water. Odd that the driver would not mention such as that pre-condition is clearly noted on the CAA site, which among other guidelines states; "Vehicles that are unlicensed/un-plated or have invalid plate stickers", (will not be towed), for example. I did not see any mention of a dealer plate though, (perhaps a way to satisfy this requirement?). I also did not see any mention of a storage locker nullifying removal for a tow. The link below provide CAA rules for towing and what is not acceptable. Some drivers want to see all the paperwork, others do not care. Clay/Lexi

https://www.caasco.com/auto/roadside-assistance/roadside-services-guide


The car had a temp registration and is plated.   CAA has never asked about plate validity. As long as A plate is on the car, they have never checked.

It was their call centre that refused the tow.  They saw the address and turned it down flat.

"We don't tow to or from storage facilities."

They also gave me a hard time when I wanted to have a car towed from one shop that couldn't fix a [german] car, to another that could (or claimed they could... nobody can actually fix those things).

It got to the point where the most stressful and inconvenient part of having to call CAA was not the break down, but calling CAA itself.
The fleet:

1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (broken)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (broken)
1999 Honda Prelude (broken)
2011 Ford CVPI (almost fixed)

Lexi

There is nothing in the CAA Towing guidelines about a storage facility. Its just another parking garage in your case. If it is cluttered or for some reason unsafe to attempt removal, they will pass, regardless of where your car is parked. Review the link I sent earlier its not there. My buddy has had no issues in the past either. I would call them back and ask them to show you where in their guidelines that storage facility policy notation is and ask for specifics. There are a few guidelines on service shop towing such as no can do for general maintenance call or 2 trips in one day, to name just 2 examples. The devil is in the details and we don't have them all. If you are intent about having your car serviced as leaving until spring is no option as it has to go, (quote); the decision will be made for you. You will have to either meet CAA tow guidelines or pay an independent to move your car. Sorry to hear of all of your bad luck, (I won't be buying lottery tickets with you). Clay/Lexi

car go b00m

#111
Quote from: Lexi on December 06, 2022, 11:19:11 AMThere is nothing in the CAA Towing guidelines about a storage facility. Its just another parking garage in your case. If it is cluttered or for some reason unsafe to attempt removal, they will pass, regardless of where your car is parked. Review the link I sent earlier its not there. My buddy has had no issues in the past either. I would call them back and ask them to show you where in their guidelines that storage facility policy notation is and ask for specifics. There are a few guidelines on service shop towing such as no can do for general maintenance call or 2 trips in one day, to name just 2 examples. The devil is in the details and we don't have them all. If you are intent about having your car serviced as leaving until spring is no option as it has to go, (quote); the decision will be made for you. You will have to either meet CAA tow guidelines or pay an independent to move your car. Sorry to hear of all of your bad luck, (I won't be buying lottery tickets with you). Clay/Lexi

They looked up the address, and refused to come out.  Stating that they don't to tonir from storage facilities.  They wouldn't even pick it up from the parking lot next to the storage facility.

I sold a car that was in storage before. The guy called CAA to tow it back to his place.  They refused to even come on the property.  We had to push it from the unit, out to the shoulder of the main road and tell them it broke down.

I canceled my membership with them.

I have Hagerty, but, I don't want to burn all of my lifelines with them, because IF this heap ever does see the road again, I'd put money on it needing a ride home at least once or twice.





Balmy five degrees, working in it now in a t-shirt. Pop the dust cap off, pull the cotter pin.   Find out the nut on the hub is larger than anything I have.    Breath in... exhale...breathe in...exbale...counting to ten...

No biggie... I'll have a crack at the lower ball joints.

Got the ball lower left ball joint scraped clean of about half an inch worth of old grease.  Make sure the bolts turn freely, and they do. Hooray.

Check the nut on the new one... 15/16ths.  Go to crack the old one loose and...  its also larger than that.  Larger than the 1 inch socket I have. Of course it would be.    What size ARE they?

The last thing I could do was have a stab at adjusting the brakes.  After several minutes of spinning the star wheel, and several hundred clicks, there was absolutely no change. 

This thing fights me, kicking and screaming, every step of the way.


When I first inquired about this car, there was a framed black and white photo of a scene from The Little Rascals/Our Gang in the back seat.  I asked what the deal was with it.   The dealer told me that the car belonged to one of the actors from the show, but didn't know which one off hand. Thats not why I bought it  nor do I care about that.  However  if the story is true, I'm certain this would have been Carl "Alfalfa" Switzer's car.  It would explain a lot.


The fleet:

1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (broken)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (broken)
1999 Honda Prelude (broken)
2011 Ford CVPI (almost fixed)

Lexi

Quote from: car go b00m on December 06, 2022, 03:25:56 PMThey looked up the address, and refused to come out.  Stating that they don't to tonir from storage facilities.  They wouldn't even pick it up from the parking lot next to the storage facility.

Hmmm. Interesting, so I called CAA this afternoon as these are things that may impact other classic car owners, and your information is also contrary to my understanding. CAA advised that they will pick up a car from a storage facility. They said that it first has to be pushed out of the storage unit, after which they would pick it up. They will NOT tow it back to a storage unit though. They also advised that cars must have been used sometime during the last 6 months, (news to me). This is because CAA basically provides a "roadside emergency" service. I advised that many classic car owners in the rust belt will park a car for 6 months or more. If not started, and I presume run on the road, they as well might be disqualified from a CAA tow come spring if their car failed to start. A bit of a grey area there. Your car was running but not on the road. Perhaps that is what was used to deny your tow? They just want it clear from the unit & apparently used within the last 6 months before they pick it up. Cars also have to be licensed and insured. So it appears that you were provided with incorrect information, as they will pick up from a storage unit, with the above noted provisions in mind. They said nothing about certain addresses being invalid. I spoke with 2 reps to be sure. The first was Customer Service who put me onto Road Service to ensure accuracy with respect to the answering of my questions. For other classic car owners a good thing to keep in mind especially this "must have been used in the last 6 months" requirement for your claim to a tow to be honoured.

So, someone is still sticking pins in your Voodoo Doll effigy. Clay

car go b00m

Finally got the drum off.  Everything looks fairly decent, aside from the boot on the wheel cylinder is missing a chunk.

That, and the star wheel appears completely sized. Qont turn at all in either direction.  Seemed to turn fine yesterday.


Ball joint time.  Place a jack under the spring seat. Check.  Raise the arm one inch. Check.  Remove the nuts holding the ball joint in  check.  Hit the steering arm to release the back joint. Check.  Check. Check. Check. Check.  It won't come out. OF COURSE.

Put a nut on the end of the joint  and smacked that. Nope.

Pickle fork? Nope.

Jacked the arm up with the ball joint itself. Nope.



I have never, and I mean NEVER worked on a car like this before.  I have had some tough days with some rusted out hulks, but this takes the bloody cake.  I have yet to win a battle with this cursed heap.

I look at it, and I can't see myself ever driving it. I just can't picture it.
The fleet:

1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (broken)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (broken)
1999 Honda Prelude (broken)
2011 Ford CVPI (almost fixed)

The Tassie Devil(le)

Removing those ball joints at the taper is requiring some really heavy hammers, and a lot of trust in the person holding the largest hammer (Anvil) on the back of the piece you are striking.

The bigger the "Anvil" the less pressure that is required to free up the taper.

I have had some really brutal ones, and the secret is to leave the nut on the thread, but loose, so that when you hit with the smaller hammer, and miss, you will not destroy the bare thread.

It is all about shocking the outer taper in the joint to flex.   It is this "flexing" that releases the taper.

Bruce. >:D 
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

dn010

Heat up steering knuckle/arm depending on which one you're trying to remove. You can also try using ball joint removal tools...
-----Dan Benedek
'57 Cadillac Sedan Deville 6239DX
'81 DMC DeLorean

Burt6666

Quote from: dn010 on December 08, 2022, 09:13:31 AMHeat up steering knuckle/arm depending on which one you're trying to remove. You can also try using ball joint removal tools...
I would never heat up the knuckle...ever !!!

dn010

#117
You don't heat these parts up to be glowing. Giving it a little heat to let it expand and then using a ball joint tool works just fine without destroying anything in all the decades I've been doing these sorts of things. If anything is going to break, it is when you're swinging a hammer at it. But, to each their own.

Sometimes it has taken all three - heat, tool and striking these to get them to release on certain cars.
-----Dan Benedek
'57 Cadillac Sedan Deville 6239DX
'81 DMC DeLorean

car go b00m

#118
My four new wheel cylinders, and, upper ball joints arrived.

While I was waiting for them to arrive, I noticed something odd about a picture of the brake I had snapped the last time I was there.

I couldn't get the shoes adjusted, and eventually the star wheel froze up and wouldn't turn any more.

I glanced at the manual and had a "waaaaaiiit a minute" moment.  I looked at the picture, and voila... mystery solved!  The pillock who worked on this car before me put the adjuster in backwards.  Turning the star wheel up was adjusting the shoes IN, until the adjuster bottmed itself out and wouldn't turn anymore.

I flipped it around and within seconds I had the shoes speading nicely.  I was going to replace the wheel cylinder but...  I'd had enough of the car by that point and I had to walk away for a while.

Why?

Well, I had another crack at rat lower ball joint.  Yup, still on that.  I have a balljoint spreader but I couldn't find it, so I dropped $11 on another one (which means the original one will magically appear). 

CLUNK!  Ball joint popped.  Nice!

Now to slip it out and swap in the new one.  Ah... not so nice.

Following the manual, I had it on stands, and placed the jack under the spring seat. Jacked it up, which should take the tension off of the joint, and it should pop out.  Nope.  The entire front end lifts, with no compression of the suspension.

The ball joint is loose, and slides up and down, but it will not clear the steering arm.  Prying it with a pry bar and pickle fork only fights with spring tension. 

I have never worked on a car so stubborn in all my days. Nothing goes how it should with this car. I swear it is cursed.




[Edit] 12/25 I guess I won't bother posting in here anymore.
The fleet:

1957 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (broken)
1990 Nissan 300ZX (broken)
1999 Honda Prelude (broken)
2011 Ford CVPI (almost fixed)