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‘58 365 vacuum pump

Started by Rdtreur, April 01, 2022, 08:15:52 PM

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Rdtreur

I got my '58 365 motor out for a re-ring/reseal job, so I got the oil pan off. I don't use the vacuum wipers because I converted to electric.
So I don't need the vacuum pump no more.

Now my question:
Can I just plug the vacuum pump directly on the pump, inside the oil pan? Or should I plug it outside of the motor for some reason? Or is it better to just leave it unplugged?

Many thanks, Ramon
R.D. Treur
Past caddy’s:
‘68 convertible ‘70 Eldorado,  ‘75 sedan, ‘75 Fleetwood

J. Gomez

Quote from: Rdtreur on April 01, 2022, 08:15:52 PM
I got my '58 365 motor out for a re-ring/reseal job, so I got the oil pan off. I don't use the vacuum wipers because I converted to electric.
So I don't need the vacuum pump no more.

Now my question:
Can I just plug the vacuum pump directly on the pump, inside the oil pan? Or should I plug it outside of the motor for some reason? Or is it better to just leave it unplugged?

Many thanks, Ramon

Ramon,

In my case I added a thing aluminum plate in between the vacuum and oil pump plates to cover the holes. Removed the hex key that drives the vacuum pump and left it inside the vacuum pump in case someone would want to revert back my process.

There is another method of using a later year oil pump which our late departed friend Johnny Washburn had done on his '56; if memory serves me right he used a '60 one.

Good luck...!
J. Gomez
CLC #23082

Rdtreur

Quote from: J. Gomez on April 01, 2022, 08:35:56 PM
Ramon,

In my case I added a thing aluminum plate in between the vacuum and oil pump plates to cover the holes. Removed the hex key that drives the vacuum pump and left it inside the vacuum pump in case someone would want to revert back my process.

There is another method of using a later year oil pump which our late departed friend Johnny Washburn had done on his '56; if memory serves me right he used a '60 one.

Good luck...!


Thanks for the reply. Do you maybe have some photo's or maybe a shop manual image/drawing of that oil and vacuum pump so I know what I am starting before I take the thing apart.

Many thanks, Ramon
R.D. Treur
Past caddy’s:
‘68 convertible ‘70 Eldorado,  ‘75 sedan, ‘75 Fleetwood

fishnjim

Hope this helps.  It's my spare.  There's two parts the gear pump for the oil and the vane pump for the vacuum.  The rotors are connected by a hex shaft.   I think all he did was blank off the vacuum side.  ie, replaced the separator plate with a solid one.
I left mine rebuilt and intact and just put a vacuum plug on the end of the vacuum line that comes up in the rear from the check valve.   So far no issues.   

J. Gomez

Quote from: Rdtreur on April 02, 2022, 08:25:46 AM
Thanks for the reply. Do you maybe have some photo's or maybe a shop manual image/drawing of that oil and vacuum pump so I know what I am starting before I take the thing apart.

Many thanks, Ramon

Ramon,

Yes I do here are a few;

P6250067 is the aluminum plate I made on the vacuum pump side, the top one faces the oil pump.
P6250069 is the note I made to show the hex key was left inside the vacuum pump.
P6250070 is the complete unit.


Hope this helps.

Good luck..!
J. Gomez
CLC #23082

Braits

Hi everybody, ,
here is Enrico from Italy.
I own a 1957 Cadillac, hope I'm in the correct section.
I took the oil pan out yesterday, and found my vacuum pump has a crack in the lid. Do you think this affects the oil pressure?
I have no interest in the windshield wipers working with vacuum. what do you recommend me to do? exclude the vacuum pump? if yes, is there a section where it is explained well how to do it? Thanks

Enrico
Braits

Roger Zimmermann

Quote from: J. Gomez on April 02, 2022, 09:26:40 AMP6250067 is the aluminum plate I made on the vacuum pump side, the top one faces the oil pump.

It's probably too late, but why did you use aluminum as a separation between the oil pump and the vacuum one?

To Braits: remove the vacuum pump and replace the plate between both pumps with another one without the hole in the middle. Use steel and not aluminum.
If you can have a 1959-62 oil pump, you can use the later one.
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Braits

Quote from: Roger Zimmermann on March 25, 2023, 04:44:36 AMIt's probably too late, but why did you use aluminum as a separation between the oil pump and the vacuum one?

To Braits: remove the vacuum pump and replace the plate between both pumps with another one without the hole in the middle. Use steel and not aluminum.
If you can have a 1959-62 oil pump, you can use the later one.

Hi,
thanks for your help, that's what I want to do, unfortunately here in Italy parts for Cadillac are nowhere to be found. so i have to keep my original pump.then find a way to adapt the windshield wipers, what I would like to know is: do I permanently remove the original plate with the hole and replace it with the new one without the hole, or do I still leave the original plate under the new one? then, is it better if I use a sealing paste? or just the plate and screws?? thanks
Braits

Roger Zimmermann

Enrico, you cannot leave the original separator plate with the hole, you may loose some oil pressure. Take a steel plate the same thickness as the original one, drill the holes for the screws and install it that way. That new plate must be more or less perfectly plane. No sealing paste is needed.
Keep the discarded parts, you never knows what happens in life!
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

J. Gomez

Quote from: Roger Zimmermann on March 25, 2023, 04:44:36 AMIt's probably too late, but why did you use aluminum as a separation between the oil pump and the vacuum one?
 

@Roger,

Sorry a bit confusing with my previous note, the original metal plate with the holes for the vacuum pump driver and vents was left on oil pump, the thing aluminum plate was place in between the two pump.

You will notice on picture P6250070 the original metal plate faces the oil pump, then the aluminum cover and the vacuum pump. So the thing aluminum was use to cover the holes on the original metal plate.

Hope this helps..!   ;)
J. Gomez
CLC #23082

Roger Zimmermann

Thanks Jose! Now I understand better. Indeed, this is what Enrico could do, with a thin piece of aluminum to close the hole in the middle.
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Braits

Quote from: J. Gomez on March 25, 2023, 07:15:22 AM@Roger,

Sorry a bit confusing with my previous note, the original metal plate with the holes for the vacuum pump driver and vents was left on oil pump, the thing aluminum plate was place in between the two pump.

You will notice on picture P6250070 the original metal plate faces the oil pump, then the aluminum cover and the vacuum pump. So the thing aluminum was use to cover the holes on the original metal plate.

Hope this helps..!   ;)


HI,
Thanks everyone, I'm not sure I understand. the two answers may be different. you tell me not to remove anything, but only to apply a new plate above the original, just below the oil pump.. I would like to put some photos but I can't upload, or read how to do it but I can't find the way..
Thank you

Enrico
Braits

Roger Zimmermann

Ah! Foreign language is sometimes difficult! José did that: on the oil pump, he installed the original steel plate. To close the hole in the middle, he did an aluminum plate, thinner than the steel plate, put it on the steel plate and finally installed the vacuum pump on top of that.
I hope it's clearer for you.
Il will not attempt to explain how to load the pictures, my English is not good enough. I'm visiting several forums, each one has a different method to load pictures!
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Braits

hey!
Thanks, I think I understand. it's true yes foreign language is difficult..I think I understand now, on Monday or Tuesday I'll do a test. I'd like to ask for something else, the pipe that attaches to the vacuum pump. do you leave it plugged in? And where does that pipe end up? Do I need to make other external changes? thanks.
Enrico
Braits

Braits

#14
I try an old method to show My pics

https://ibb.co/mvCYq2Q


Here Is the hole in My vacuum pump...
Braits

J. Gomez

Quote from: Braits on March 25, 2023, 02:38:28 PMhey!
Thanks, I think I understand. it's true yes foreign language is difficult..I think I understand now, on Monday or Tuesday I'll do a test. I'd like to ask for something else, the pipe that attaches to the vacuum pump. do you leave it plugged in? And where does that pipe end up? Do I need to make other external changes? thanks.
Enrico


@Enrico,

If you plan on covering the vacuum pump as I did and mention above with a plate it would be up to you, you can leave the pipe in place and just block the outside connector (on the side of engine block) or not connect the pipe (but still block the outside connector).

Spero che questo ti aiuti..!  ;)
J. Gomez
CLC #23082

Braits

Quote from: J. Gomez on March 25, 2023, 05:39:03 PM@Enrico,

If you plan on covering the vacuum pump as I did and mention above with a plate it would be up to you, you can leave the pipe in place and just block the outside connector (on the side of engine block) or not connect the pipe (but still block the outside connector).

Spero che questo ti aiuti..!  ;)


Thank you,
I hope I understood. tomorrow I Will remove the pump and prepare the steel plate. then I try to close everything.
just one last question. ( for the moment) ::)
inside the vacuum pump, do I need to remove anything? Or do I leave everything as it is?
Thank you.
I'm already sure I'll have to ask for help to find the external connector...  :D damn Italian.. better to cook spaghetti than work on a Cadillac ;D  ;D
Braits

Roger Zimmermann

Enrico, you can leave the rotor inside the vacuum pump. Behind the starter motor, you will find a valve (see the picture). Follow the tube which goes behind the RH cylinder head and close it the way you can.

Valve.JPG
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Braits

Hey!
Thanks for the Pic! Is everything much Easier with a clear image!
Thanks!!
I hope in these two days to post my new progress.
You are vert kind
Braits

Braits

Hello friends,
unfortunately in these days I could not do anything. just find the steel plate... but no minutes to work it. I'll have to wait some extra time.
but I'll let you know how it goes
I really Need to make It run before June .. that a the way...
Thanks
Braits
Braits