international bidders on my ebay cadillac????

[Kevin Wiles]

i'm a bit sketchy about the international bidders that are now bidding on my cadillac on ebay

from germany, austrailia, etc.

I put in the auction that I will only sell to USA and Canada, what gives?

I'm scared of getting a fake money order or cashiers check and then losing the car AND the money.

The bidding ends today, what should I be on the lookout for?

[Stampie]

You can do a couple of things.  A direct bank transfer is safe.  I've also taken deposit through paypal but required cash on pick up.  If they insist on a money order then tell them you will hold the car for two or three months.  A legit buyer will work with you and make you comfortable in the process.  A lot of international buyers have friends in the US that handle the transactions for them.

Stampie

[Robert CLC #20619]

I have had nothing but problems with international bidders. Countless questions, request after request for pictures and I am talking over a 100, criticisms about the car, extremely low offers, etc. I know this is just part of doing business but it does get old. I have had 2 buyers come and look at cars, call me the next day and agree on price, payment type and then nothing. My experience with ebay is there are a lot of picture collectors but then again I have sold cars on ebay just not to international bidders. Do not take anything but a direct wire transfer. You can not even trust bank checks anymore.
Good luck
Robert

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

I am an international bidder on ebay, and have completed three vehicle purchases, and also purchased dozens of smaller items, and many times have been treated as if I was from outer space and not worthy of dealing with.

I agree that us "Aliens" can sometimes appear to be a little bit demanding with questions and requests for more detailed pictures and descriptions, but as we are so far away, we really need to know what we are going to be spending our hard-earned money on.

Every item that I have purchased has usually ended up with the seller realising that there is more than just America in their world and becoming a friend of the seller.

Being a Member of the CLC has opened the doors to purchasing parts when the Sellers refuse to deal with "Aliens", and many times I have been able to have Members go and look at, or pick up something for me, so that inspections of the items can be made, and the sale being successful.

Bruce.

[76eldo]

Don't be afraid to sell your car to an international bidder.  I have done this twice, and had no problems.  In fact, if you are selling a vehicle, and you receive a wire transfer info your account, the money is good.  Do not take any other form of payment, unless it's cash.  Even Paypal payments can be made with stolen or bogus credit cards.

I have sold several cars to out of state buyers, and in a couple of cases, out of the country.  It's great.  You are dealing with a trucker, who is picking up the car for the buyer.  No test rides, no questions, no tire-kicking.  Providing that you represented the car honestly, you will have a happy buyer.

If you are nervous about giving a stranger your bank's routing number, and checking account number, don't worry, that info is on every check you send out.

Do NOT give out any additional info, such as date of birth or social security numbers.

I have taken cashier's checks as payment in the past from a US bank, but I have always had the sender fax me a copy of the check, and I verified it's validity by calling the bank directly.  Get the phone number from directory assistance, do not take the number from the sender.

There are many car collectors in other countries like Germany, England, and Australia who are taking advantage of the exchange rate, and getting some bargains in the process.  It's a risk for them too, because they are paying for the car, and the shipping up front.

Good Luck,

Brian

[Otto Skorzeny]

Another way to protect yourself is to open an account strictly for the transaction you are making. Just keep little or nothing in the account you wish to have money wired to. After the money is wired into this account, withdraw it and deposit it into your regular account immediately. This way, no one ever has your personal account information to make any unauthorized drafts from your account.

Bank security is practically non-existent when it comes to people (legit or crooks) making drafts from your account. All they need is the account number and the routing number.

To repeat what others have said, cash and wire transfers are the only means of payment to accept. Cashiers' checks and personal checks cannot be trusted to be genuine even if the bank says they look good. Banks make virtually no attempt to accurately verify the authenticity of checks. Even if they tell you a check is good, it may come back 3 weeks later as a forgery and you are on the hook for all the money.

As for buying a car yourself, Never send money by wire transfer unless you have possession of the car or it is in the possession of someone you know and trust. Once money is wired, it cannot be recalled - it's gone. Pay in cash or have your trusted representative pay in cash for you.

Forrest

[TJ Hopland]

I assume your car is worth shipping overseas?     I get all the intl bidders and questions about certified checks for 70's junkers that I have a $500 reserve on.     One car was a typical 77 fleetwood with some rust, missing trim, faded paint and interior.   Opening bid was $500 because it did have a new steering wheel, hood ornament, and a few other parts that were worth that much.   I listed it as pickup and cash only and the ebay disclaimer about no title parts only.   I had 47 bids from 8 bidders, 6 of which were not in the US.  'Winning bid' was $8500!   All of them talked about inspectors and shippers and checks.   None of them ever went anywhere as I expected and I ended up selling it for $400 to the first guy that bid that was only a few hours away.   Same thing happens on craigs list.  You can tell they dont even look at any of the ads the reply to.  Ya gotta wonder how many people get screwed.  Must be enough to keep at it. 

[Fred Zwicker #23106]

   When buying, the best way is to fly or drive to the seller's location, carefully check out the car and the title, then from their location call your bank to wire the money to the seller while holding firmly to the phone with one hand and the title with the other hand.  Once you complete the call ask seller to release his grip on the title, which must be signed (and notarized in some states).  Then wait for the wire transfer to clear and then either drive the car home, or put the car on your trailer to take home (or arrange for shipping on the spot).  Doing the whole deal through eBay without seeing the car is very risky and can lead to many disappointments, as most cars look much better in the photos as when viewed in person.

If selling for cash - remember that some buyers need a co-signer for their cash!  LOL.  Also if buying or selling for cash in excess of $10,000, banks will make a report to the IRS of such transactions if deposited to either \seller's account or removed from buyer's account.  It is very difficult to find a buyer willing to pay in cold cash if selling prices is substantial, and if so, you have a problem on how to deposit the funds if over $10,000. 

Things sure have changed from prior years when a handshake was all that was necessary and cash was an acceptable means of buying and selling.

Fred

[Xris Laggan]

........Sell to the highest bidder ,(he/she may be overseas ) ,get your money before shipping and you have nothing to lose.

.
The bidding ends today, what should I be on the lookout for?

   ...........Ebay 's positive feedback

I have had nothing but problems with international bidders. .........................
......I have had 2 buyers come and look at cars, call me the next day and agree on price, payment type and then nothing.

As a buyer from Australia , I wish I was able to view the cars in person , I can't imagine flying all that way , agreeing on a price and then not turning up . Sounds more like locals .

  You need lots of pics as not all sellers can be trusted to tell everything .Some don't lie ,but will fail to mention some relevant infomation .With computers, didgital cameras ,websites and email posting pics is easy.
A small amount of effort for a possible better return .
Wasn't there a gentleman on this site who recently sent back  a 70's eldorado because it wasn't as described ?

  As for Sellers of smaller items who have a landlocked thought pattern ,There is such a thing as Internationall shipping and if a buyer is prepared to pay for the shipping cost , how much more effort is it really , to buy more stamps/pay the extra charge and place the article on a different counter !
  Many times I have been prepared to pay more than the winning bid ,the seller loses out as well .

Xris Laggan
Qld. Australia

[eam]

Dear Iris:  You must be one trusting soul or you are not aware of all the scams going on throughout the world since these computers came into existence.  There are so many phony bank checks, shipping documents,wiring fraud, etc. in these type of transactions.  Yes, it is unfortunate you live so far away when you would like to buy a car here in the USA but that's what is out there so people, including me a chartered accountant, just do not trust transactions from such distances away.  But as we all know Australia is one of our better countries but unfortunatly there are wrong individuals there too just like they are here too.  I served in the Korean War with many Australian soldiers, what a bunch of great guys and good soldiers too.  God bless Australia!  EAM

[Xris Laggan]

Dear Eam ,
   yes , there are a lot of scammers out there , but there are ways of dealing with internationall buyers that work . Very rarely is a item shipped to me with out the monies being cleared at both ends.That's what I mean about nothing to lose .
  Trusting I am , but , I do use a seperate account for all these type of transactions.
For my next vehicle ,I will definitely be contacting a fellow CLC member for help and dealing through them ( as long as someone wants to help ).
  The only other choice would be a reputable shipping agent ,one who pays cash to the seller upon pick up of the vehicle .
    But which ever arrangement is made , it still needs a seller to be prepared to sell internationally .
Are the transactions from one side of the States to the other , any safer than an overseas transaction?
( This is a genuine question ,not sarcasm . )

I 've never served ,and am from a younger generation ,though not todays generation ,but I have been involved with a few of the diggers from Viet Nam and North Africa ,and all I can say is that I have the utmost respect for them , yourself and all the other former and serving , service men and women.
In the words of your generation , " I salute you " , and of todays youth,   " RESPECT!!

Xris Laggan
   

[Otto Skorzeny]

The one advantage of selling in the States as opposed to a foreign nation is that you have access to law enforcement. If your money disappears in a foreign country, you have virtually no legal means to persue  it. If you are scammed in the US, you have a better chance of seeking help from law enforcement.

Crooks of course know this so most of the internet scamming seems to be perpetrated by people overseas. It's not just ebay or craigslist transactions but things like  the old "Nigerian Scam"  and phony lotteries seem to never end.

[35-709]

How did you make out with your sale Kevin?  Here we are still talking about your auction that ended 3 days ago.  The subject has been pretty well hashed over but for future reference here are my experiences buying and selling cars on eBay. 

I have purchased 2 cars (a '60 Caddy Coupe and a '71 Sedan deVille) on eBay, both I paid for by wire transfer, the only way to go other than possibly cash.  The '60 I had shipped to me in Florida from N.Y. State; the '71 I flew out to Missouri and drove home since I was already part way to Missouri on other business.  Both cars were bought having seen only pictures posted on eBay and frank discussions with the sellers before the final bidding.  The '60 was not quite as expected but OK, the '71 was beautiful.  Close up pictures and lots of them showing all aspects of the car are important, pictures from 5, 10, or 20 feet away are helpful in getting an overall view of the car but are basically worthless.  Of course a personal inspection is best but sometimes not possible.  If you or a friend/agent cannot inspect the car but you are determined to buy it anyway you will be on thin ice, be prepared for some disappointments or at least be aware of the possibility. 

I sold my '71 Sedan deVille on eBay to a fellow in Germany.  First time I had ever sold a car on eBay, yes I was nervous about it.  He bought the car at the "Buy it Now" price I had listed within a couple of days of my auction start (gee, maybe I didn't ask enough  ).  I made it clear in the auction listing that only cash or a wire transfer would be accepted.  He had an agent in the U.S. and the agent contacted me for the wire transfer information and I had the money in my account 3 or 4 days later, I immediately transferred it to another account --- just to make me feel better.  So --- so far my experiences have been good.  If you did not want any foreign bidders and you made that clear in your listing (eBay also will block foreign bidders if you so state while filling out the online auction form), you, as the seller, can/could have removed those bids.  Hope it all went well.
Geoff N.       

[Kevin Wiles]

UPDATE well the bidding ended and the person eventually getting it is really from brazil but he has an agent here in the US who bid on it and will be paying for it for him.   The company name is Sirroco group from florida that bought it and will be handling the exporting of the car and so forth so its a USA bidder but he sounds foriegn (acccent).  He's waiting to get the money from his brazil buyer then he'll be sending me a Cashiers Check from Bank of America.   I plan on calling bank of america using the telephone directory, (not the tele number on the check) and verifying that the funds are good..    Once i've done that and deposit it and wait for it to clear, nothing bad could happen right?   After that point in time how should I handle the title and bill of sale?   overnight it to my buyer to sign then provide a prepaid overnight for him to return it, then once its completed send it with the truck driver?   Any insight on any of this is greatly appreciated.  I am going to accept his cashiers check upon it being verified and upon it being cleared.   I'm trying to be extremely careful here. 

[Kevin Wiles]

and he has great feedback.

[Otto Skorzeny]

Everything is probably on the up and up but you should not accept a cashiers check or a check of any kind.

When the guy comes to pick up the car, you and he go to Bank of America together and let him CASH the check and hand you the money in the bank. Failing that, have the banker transfer the funds from the buyers' account directly to your account.

You CANNOT EVER , NEVER, NOT EVER accept a cashiers check or personal check and assume it to be real. If you do, you put yourself at considerable risk. As stated earlier, the bank will say it looks good, they may even "verify " the funds. WEEKS WILL PASS! You'll think the check has cleared and lo and behold, 3 or 4 weeks later the check will turn out to be a forgery.

You will then owe the bank for the total amount of the check AND you will have lost your car!

Modern photocopying technology makes it impossible to trust checks from people you do not know first hand.

DO NOT release your vehicle until you have the CASH in your hand or in your specially opened account into which the money has been wired and confirmed!

As far as the title goes, all you have to do in most states is sign it in the sellers' box and hand it over to the purchaser. It's up to the buyer to fill out his portion and register the car in his own county or whatever.

[35-709]

I signed my title and sent it Registered Mail, return receipt requested, to my buyer's agent if I remember correctly.
 
Forrest is right, if your buyer is an active eBayer he should expect to have to get you the money via wire transfer.  I would contact his agent and tell him that a wire transfer or cash are the only acceptable means of getting your money to you.  This is also something that should be made quite clear in an auction listing for a high dollar item.