56 Fuel Pump, one good squirt then It seems like it's pumping air.

[Christopher Petti]

I am having troubles with my carb flooding at stop lights or whenever I slow down the car for that matter. This happens once the car is at temperature. So I was told to check the Fuel pump and use the test in the shop manuel. So I did. I dissasmebled the fuel filter and put a can up to the opening. I had my buddy cranking the engine. I would get one big spurt and then air with a little gas. I'm confused. The Manuel said, at least half a pint glass with nine spurts. Is my Fuel pump bad or am I doing something wrong? The Fuel pump is Brand new. (rebuilt) Is this condition common, am I doing something wrong?

Chris

Also, Does anyone have a picture of what the gasket looks like that goes between the intake manifold and the carb? I think I have the wrong gasket sold to me by Kanter. Those guys sent me so many wrong parts. They will never see another red cent from me again.

[Otto Skorzeny]

Hi Chris,

Last year two new fuel pumps failed on me after having zero fuel pump trouble since I bought the car in 2001. The culprit turned out to be ethanol distorting the diaohragm.

My newest fuel pump,  purchased at Auto Zone brand new for $50, has been working fine. The others must have been made with the old style "non-ethanol compliant" rubber.

Before condemning the pump, I would make sure your fuel line is perfectly clear all the way to the gas tank. Once you verify that it is, then buy a new pump.

The test outlined in the manual is exact and correct. If your pump deviates from the specs, your carwill not run correctly.

When you install the new pump, perform the test it before hooking everything else up.

9 squirts will pump exactly 8 oz of fuel.

[J. Gomez]

I am having troubles with my carb flooding at stop lights or whenever I slow down the car for that matter. This happens once the car is at temperature. So I was told to check the Fuel pump and use the test in the shop manuel. So I did. I dissasmebled the fuel filter and put a can up to the opening. I had my buddy cranking the engine. I would get one big spurt and then air with a little gas. I'm confused. The Manuel said, at least half a pint glass with nine spurts. Is my Fuel pump bad or am I doing something wrong? The Fuel pump is Brand new. (rebuilt) Is this condition common, am I doing something wrong?

Chris

Also, Does anyone have a picture of what the gasket looks like that goes between the intake manifold and the carb? I think I have the wrong gasket sold to me by Kanter. Those guys sent me so many wrong parts. They will never see another red cent from me again.

Chris,

Suggestion;

a-   Disconnect the input line from the tank at the fuel pump.
b-   Connect the input from the fuel pump to a gas container.
c-   Retry the test.

If you get the full 8oz the pump should be fine, else the problem could be some where in the line, tank.
I also second Otto’s suggestion "I would make sure your fuel line is perfectly clear all the way to the gas tank."

Good luck..!

Gasket picture attached..!

[Christopher Petti]

Hi Chris,

Last year two new fuel pumps failed on me after having zero fuel pump trouble since I bought the car in 2001. The culprit turned out to be ethanol distorting the diaohragm.

My newest fuel pump,  purchased at Auto Zone brand new for $50, has been working fine. The others must have been made with the old style "non-ethanol compliant" rubber.

Before condemning the pump, I would make sure your fuel line is perfectly clear all the way to the gas tank. Once you verify that it is, then buy a new pump.

The test outlined in the manual is exact and correct. If your pump deviates from the specs, your carwill not run correctly.

When you install the new pump, perform the test it before hooking everything else up.

9 squirts will pump exactly 8 oz of fuel.

I just put up a new tank w/sending unit and stainless fuel line. It should be good. No obstructions. I just took it on a four hour journey up to Flint and back last wednseday. It has no issues while the car is running. Also when I took the carb apart the other day I found a clump of crap sitting on top of my needle valve which was probably helping my carb flood. I just don't understand because when the pump is all hooked up it pumps tons of gas but for some reason it doesn't want to when I'm just cranking on the engine with the carb off the engine. The gentleman in Arizona that I purchased the pump from told me that is set up for today's fuels. Or I wouldn't have purchased it from him. I am confused because I have been lowering my floats to compensate for too much pressure and my test is proving that there it's not passing gas. I'm confused. Otto what problems were you having with the two that failed?

[Christopher Petti]

Chris,

Suggestion;

a-   Disconnect the input line from the tank at the fuel pump.
b-   Connect the input from the fuel pump to a gas container.
c-   Retry the test.

If you get the full 8oz the pump should be fine, else the problem could be some where in the line, tank.
I also second Otto’s suggestion "I would make sure your fuel line is perfectly clear all the way to the gas tank."

Good luck..!

Gasket picture attached..!

I was talking about the gasket between the intake manifold and the carburator. The WCFB.

[Otto Skorzeny]

Yah, what the hell? That's  the fuel pump gasket.

Long story short, when I performed the requisite test on both pumps, they each only put out 1/2 the required amount of fuel.

My car would start and run fine until I needed more power, then it would conk out.

I think Jose's idea about cutting the gas tank and line out of the equation all together is a good one. This will tell you once and for all whether the problem is the pump or not.

You also must be certain that the fuel filter is securely in place and not sucking air.

If the pump doesn't perform while sucking gas from a can and pumping directly through a tube into a jar, then replace it.

If it does work, then you'll have to back track down the fuel line to the fuel tank to find a bad connection or whatever. Install each component in the line and test it to rule out that component.

[J. Gomez]

I was talking about the gasket between the intake manifold and the carburator. The WCFB.

Chris,

Oops multitasking is not one of my virtues..! The gasket pattern should be the same for either Rochester or WCFB carbs.

Otto,

I’m running low on brain cells..! Need an overhaul..! 

[Otto Skorzeny]

Just curious Gomez, how is it that you happen to have photos of obscure gaskets ready to post on your computer?

And I thought I was a car nerd.

[J. Gomez]

Just curious Gomez, how is it that you happen to have photos of obscure gaskets ready to post on your computer?

And I thought I was a car nerd.

My friend, soft copy of the manual plus Photo Shop great combo..! You can jpg/gif anything on the fly..! 

[Dan LeBlanc]

I think the testing method is flawed - if I remember correctly, you need to disconnect the fuel line, not the bowl from the fuel filter (that is if you're using the stock bowl and not an inline filter).

[Otto Skorzeny]

Not sure I understand what you mean by flawed.

The instructions are very specific in the manual. The pump should produce exactly 8oz of gas in 9 squirts.

[Dan LeBlanc]

His testing method.  It sounds like he's removing the bowl.  I'm having writers' block today.

[Walter Youshock]

The Fuel Pump filter bowl requires  2 gaskets to perform properly--one is on the INSIDE of the filter assembly where the fuel filter fits onto the filter assembly, sealing the INSIDE (intake) of the filter to the assembly.  This is not usually supplied in a Filter Kit.  This gasket goes UNDER the filter.  The Bowl Cover gasket goes OVER the filter assembly outer lip and seals the glass bowl to the filter housing.

I remember my vapor lock issues were caused by: Inferior or NO sealing of the INSIDE fuel filter to housing; OR; Air being brought into the filter assembly because it was warped.  That pot-metal bowl assembly might be warped and the gasket is not sealing at the filter.

[Christopher Petti]

Chris,

Oops multitasking is not one of my virtues..! The gasket pattern should be the same for either Rochester or WCFB carbs.

Otto,

I’m running low on brain cells..! Need an overhaul..! 

Jose are you sure those are the real gaskets? My gasket doesn't cover the complete perimeter of the carb. The gasket goes in on both sides, on teh passenger side right beneath the idle air passage screw and in the exact same area on the driver side. It seals off the area on the front part of the manifold but it doesn't cover the whole perimieter. When my car floods the gas come out of that area. If that's the correct gasket I'm going to have to send away for the correct one.

[J. Gomez]

Jose are you sure those are the real gaskets? My gasket doesn't cover the complete perimeter of the carb. The gasket goes in on both sides, on teh passenger side right beneath the idle air passage screw and in the exact same area on the driver side. It seals off the area on the front part of the manifold but it doesn't cover the whole perimieter. When my car floods the gas come out of that area. If that's the correct gasket I'm going to have to send away for the correct one.

Chris,

The picture I posted came directly from the Master Parts List, and it shows the same part # for the Carter and Rochester. If you look at the Shop Manual under Section 10 the Throttle body for Carter and Rochester share the same contour (picture attached) at the base plate, so the information is from the documentation.

If I recall NAPA has a rebuilt kit for Carter carb, but not for the Rochester, so check your local NAPA. Also, if you have a carb shop they may have a kit handy.

[Christopher Petti]

Chris,

The picture I posted came directly from the Master Parts List, and it shows the same part # for the Carter and Rochester. If you look at the Shop Manual under Section 10 the Throttle body for Carter and Rochester share the same contour (picture attached) at the base plate, so the information is from the documentation.

If I recall NAPA has a rebuilt kit for Carter carb, but not for the Rochester, so check your local NAPA. Also, if you have a carb shop they may have a kit handy.

I contacted Tim at Daytona Carb and he sent me a picture of the Carb Gasket that I should have and I do have the correct one. Which bums me out. I proved out the Fuel Pump, it is working beautifully.  Thanks for the help guys. I have been learning a lot lately about this car. I also took the car out after work last night in the cold weather. It ran beautifully. It was acting like it was starving for fuel but overall it was cruising nice. It was weird after driving for a while it stopped stalling at Red ligjhts. Then I idled it in my driveway for about twenty minutes and it didn't stall out. The idle slowed down but I think the outside temperatire was keeping the car cool. Otto how hot does your car get? I'm wondering if my car is getting to warm and thats what it causing the gas to boil? I changed the thermostat and all the heater hoses. I never checked the radiator though. At this point I have no leaks. What could I do to cool it down? In traffic on a hot summers day the car will idle at 210-215. cruising the car will sit at 190. Last night driving around in the rain it idled nice and didn't stall out at the red lights, if I let it sit it will idle iitself down but not out. Once I let the car idle itself down and stall out, then the gas started bubbling and fizzing out of the venturi's and betweent the carb and intake manifold. Tim and the carb store told me that it is Ethanol that is causing this. He told me to try 87. Otto you said you use 93 all day. I'm trying to find out what to do. Is my car running to warm and causing the gas to percolate? or should I try and use 89 or 87 and adjust my timing so the car doesn't knock? 

[Otto Skorzeny]

My car runs normally with the needle about halfway. In traffic or hot days it will climb up to 3/4 or so.

I use 93 octane all the time. I tried 87 once and it knocked and backfired at shut-off. All grades and brands of gas around here have 10% ethanol.

I don't see how the octane rating will affect carburation at all. Octane is an anti-knock measurement and has no effect whatsoever on volatility.

210-215 doesn't sound too hot to me.

[Christopher Petti]

My car runs normally with the needle about halfway. In traffic or hot days it will climb up to 3/4 or so.

I use 93 octane all the time. I tried 87 once and it knocked and backfired at shut-off. All grades and brands of gas around here have 10% ethanol.

I don't see how the octane rating will affect carburation at all. Octane is an anti-knock measurement and has no effect whatsoever on volatility.

210-215 doesn't sound too hot to me.

Tim said that the lower octane gasolines have less ethanol and will percolate and a higher temperature than the higher octane gasolines. It doesn't make any sense to me either but I'm starting to run out of options here. I was told by my mechanic that my carb has come kind of bad Voo Doo attached to it but I don't believe him. I think that is something that I haven't figured out yet. I wonder whats up with it. Driving around llast night it would just shut off on me for no reason and I would have to throw it in neutral and starti it up again while coasting down the street. The car confuses me with it's inconsistancy.

[Otto Skorzeny]

Read the pump where you fill up. It will tell you what percentage of ethanol is in the gasoline. I'm not aware of any locales where ethanol levels vary between grades of gasoline. It's possible I guess but I don't see why that would be.

In Atlanta, by federal mandate, all gasoline n the metro area has 10% ethanol regardless of octane rating.

I suppose it wouldn't hurt to try 89 or 87 octane and see what happens.

My car has a Carter WCFB. It's been a really good carburetor ever since I bought the car. I rebuilt it once.

[Dave and Deb]

I've had three new fuel pumps give me trouble in the last couple of years.  Each time one of the brass valves had come slightly dislodged.  The symptoms of this is starving for fuel/reduced flow.

Unscrew the top cover and double check the valves haven't moved.

Dave