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Syenthetic Oil

Started by John Bezik #15976, December 28, 2009, 11:48:28 PM

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John Bezik #15976

 I have a 90,000 mile good running 472 1970 deville and have used Castrol 20-50 at oil changes ever 3000 miles or sooner if my mileage is less. I have done this for the last 9 years.No lifter noise or anything  just runs good. I have been seeing ads for Castrol Synthetic oils and am wondering it I should change to that or keep using regular oil???[/i]

Mike Josephic CLC #3877

#1
In my opinion, I would stick with what you have been using.  Why change what is
working for you?  In your situation, there is no advantage to doing this.

With a relatively high mileage car, switching to a synthetic now would do more harm than
good.  The synthetics tend to free up alot of "crud" that is likely in your engine and also
tend to promote oil gasket leaks.

If you were getting a complete engine rebuild, then my opinion would be different.

Mike
1955 Cadillac Eldorado
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1995 Cadillac Seville
2004 Escalade
1997 GMC Suburban 4X4, 454 engine, 3/4 ton
custom built by Santa Fe in Evansville, IN
2011 Buick Lucerne CX
-------------------------------------
CLCMRC Museum Benefactor #38
Past: VP International Affiliates, Museum Board Director, President / Director Pittsburgh Region

47bigcadillac

synthetics are only good for extreme cold start or extreme hot operations, or in very new engines. What you could add though is some ZDDP (zddplus.com) with your regular mineral oil because in the 2-3 recent years the ZDDP levels have decreased.
R. Brandys

1932 355B  5 pass Coupe,  Fleetwood          
1935 LaSalle Coupe  5077
1947 Club Coupe      6207

dadscad

Synthetic lubricants have superior flow characteristics when cold. Particularly important on infrequently used vehicles on start up. Synthetics have superior heat tolerance, less apt to oxidize, break down. Synthetics have superior film strength, better wear protection. Synthetics have virtually no impurities, creates less deposits over petroleum lubricants. Synthetics have superior detergents, cleaner engines. Synthetics are less volatile than petroleum lubricants, less oil consumption from boil off. These are a few of the benefits you’ll enjoy, by using a quality synthetic lubricant.  ;D
Enjoy The Ride,
David Thomas CLC #14765
1963 Coupe deVille

Mike Josephic CLC #3877

#4
"QUOTE"

Synthetics have virtually no impurities, creates less deposits over petroleum lubricants. Synthetics have superior detergents, cleaner engines.
David:

I grant you, all you stated about synthetic oil is true.  However, I think you missed the point of the member's question.  Should he put synthetic oil into a high mileage engine from 1970?  In your
own post, you speak about "superior detergents" -- that's not what he needs in a 40 year
old engine that's full of deposits and has never been rebuilt.  That only would bring trouble, as
I previously stated in my original post.


Mike
1955 Cadillac Eldorado
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1995 Cadillac Seville
2004 Escalade
1997 GMC Suburban 4X4, 454 engine, 3/4 ton
custom built by Santa Fe in Evansville, IN
2011 Buick Lucerne CX
-------------------------------------
CLCMRC Museum Benefactor #38
Past: VP International Affiliates, Museum Board Director, President / Director Pittsburgh Region

John Bezik #15976

 :)Guys I am going to keep using 20-50 Castrol with maybe some Marvel Mystery Oil ---Thanks for the Help John

dadscad

Mike wrote: "However, I think you missed the point of the member's question.  Should he put synthetic oil into a high mileage engine from 1970?"

Chuckle.....Mike, I think you misinterpreted and "missed the point" of my post. I was actually replying about 47bigcadillac's comment that synthetic oil didn't have any use other than extreme cold starts and extreme heat conditions. I beg to differ on his opinion. Nowhere in my post did I recommend putting synthetic oil in an engine of unknown condition. I was "only" stating the "benefits" of using a synthetic lubricant.

I agree with you, "IF", you don't know the internal condition of the engine, don't put synthetic oil in it unless you are able to handle the possible consequences if it turned sour. "But" if you do know the engine is clean and in good mechanical condition, synthetic oil is suitable to use and a superior choice of lubricant.

Happy New Year!!
David
Enjoy The Ride,
David Thomas CLC #14765
1963 Coupe deVille

Doug Smith

My only experience with syenthetic oil was a bad one and I hope it doesn't happen to anyone else.  I used regular oil forever with no problems and like you and many others started to read how great syenthetic oil was and what I was missing out on. Well long story short I will say that when you use syenthetic oil with an older engine it finds ALL the little holes and cracks that all engines have but don't show with the thicker oil and leaks thru your gaskets and seals. Syenthetic oil is much thinner (watery) than conventional oils and although it does have its good points its not a good idea for older engines.... :oe
D. Smith

Mike Josephic CLC #3877

Chuckle.....Mike, I think you misinterpreted and "missed the point" of my post. I was actually replying about 47bigcadillac's comment that synthetic oil didn't have any use other than extreme cold starts and extreme heat conditions. I beg to differ on his opinion. Nowhere in my post did I recommend putting synthetic oil in an engine of unknown condition. I was "only" stating the "benefits" of using a synthetic lubricant.

Well ----- chuckle, chuckle, David.

How was I or anyone else supposed to know WHAT you were referring to?  You didn't mention in
your post that you were referring to 47bigcadillac's post.  Since normally people keep their posts in reference to the thread (and the original question), I assumed you were speaking to the original poster with the '70 -- John Bezik.

I didn't want the gentleman to get the impression that it was a "good idea" to use a synthetic
oil in his Cadillac.  That's why I replied to you.  No slight intended and I apologize if you took it that way.

Happy New Year!!

Mike

1955 Cadillac Eldorado
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1995 Cadillac Seville
2004 Escalade
1997 GMC Suburban 4X4, 454 engine, 3/4 ton
custom built by Santa Fe in Evansville, IN
2011 Buick Lucerne CX
-------------------------------------
CLCMRC Museum Benefactor #38
Past: VP International Affiliates, Museum Board Director, President / Director Pittsburgh Region

dadscad

Mike wrote: "How was I or anyone else supposed to know WHAT you were referring to?"

Point taken, I see my mistake for not being more specific in that post. I assumed it would be understood but, obviously not.

Hopefully my post to you didn't come across as being tart, if so, my apologies specifically to you and everyone else that read it. On my part, there was no slight taken, no apologies needed but thank you anyway.

It's a beautiful day here, clear and crisp. Just right to start out a brand new year!

Enjoy,
David
Enjoy The Ride,
David Thomas CLC #14765
1963 Coupe deVille

47bigcadillac

#10
Quote from: John Bezik #15976 on December 30, 2009, 11:38:42 PM
:)Guys I am going to keep using 20-50 Castrol with maybe some Marvel Mystery Oil ---Thanks for the Help John

Don't forget to add some ZDDP because your castrol oil formulation has changed recently with lower ZDDP levels. Compared to the 1970/80's the levels are about half now.   

And I would stay away from MMO, since it is a light oil which has solvents in it - it will dilute your engine oil.

R. Brandys

1932 355B  5 pass Coupe,  Fleetwood          
1935 LaSalle Coupe  5077
1947 Club Coupe      6207

ANDYC

John,   A several years ago, I was a mechanical design engineer with Fram Corp..  We tested different groups of cars & trucks under different driving/load conditions
           and then did oil analyses for various metals wear in parts per million.  Oils used were top grade synthetic and petroleum base products.  End   conclusions      were this:
          Engines with normal, non stressed usage, (especially large engines as in your caddy), the wear results were the same for both oils. Engines used under heavy
          loads continuously, showed less wear using synthetic.  Gasoline milage about the same. For the difference in costs, with normal driving in my cars, I have
          always used a high grade petroleum oil without any problems.  They have all the additives you need for protection.  I have always changed my oil every 3333
          miles .  I do agree with other responses about older engines.  Hope this helps.

ANDYC
ANDY COURNOYER, CLC#25584

39 Limo

On the topic of oil, I have recently been giving the responsibility  of several pre'40 cars some running some not. My question is I rarely drive more then 3000 miles a year ( I know a sin but I try to get more in), so how often do you recommend I change my oil on a "calender" base?

Thanks

Mike Josephic CLC #3877

In cars driven as ours are (a few thousand miles per year or less) cnange the oil and filter
once per year regardless of mileage.  This helps keep the accumulation of moisture, sludge
and contaminants at a minimum.  It's the best "insurance" you can buy for you engine.

You would be amazed at how much water accumulates due to condensation in your
crankcase.

Mike
1955 Cadillac Eldorado
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1995 Cadillac Seville
2004 Escalade
1997 GMC Suburban 4X4, 454 engine, 3/4 ton
custom built by Santa Fe in Evansville, IN
2011 Buick Lucerne CX
-------------------------------------
CLCMRC Museum Benefactor #38
Past: VP International Affiliates, Museum Board Director, President / Director Pittsburgh Region

47bigcadillac

#14
Exactly - i believe the real issue is not the oil, but the non-oil components that build-up no matter which oil you use.

1) the air filter cannot filter everything, dust/dirt accumulates
2)water due to condensation, especailly in winter
3)hydrocarbones
4)metal debris
5)gasoline that flows down to the crankcase during cold starts


this is especially true for cars without oil filters.

for low-performance classic cars driven normally, I'd rather use a cheaper but thick and good enough mineral oil (20W-50) and change it every 500 miles, and adding some ZDDP to make sure it has enough levels.
R. Brandys

1932 355B  5 pass Coupe,  Fleetwood          
1935 LaSalle Coupe  5077
1947 Club Coupe      6207