News:

Due to a technical issue, some recently uploaded pictures have been lost. We are investigating why this happened but the issue has been resolved so that future uploads should be safe.  You can also Modify your post (MORE...) and re-upload the pictures in your post.

Main Menu

41 Cadillac Rear Suspension-Help

Started by Bill Podany #19567, April 13, 2010, 01:57:45 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Bill Podany #19567

I own a 41 60 Special that is a Senior Winner in the CLC.  It appears that the strength of the rear leaf springs has softened and the car sits lower in the rear than it should.  I would appreciate suggestions to improve this condition and raise the rear of the car maybe 2 to 4 inches.  Does anyone know if there is an origional standard for the posture of the car from its rear suspension?  I am not mechanical and have to hire a mechanic do all of the work; it is my understanding that this can be a difficult process and fix.  Many thanks for your advice.

Bill Podany
Knoxville, TN 
1941 60 Special Fleetwood
1955 Eldorado

Sweede64

If the leafs are in good shape and not cracked or rustedout you can reshape them in a big sliproll.
Thomas Karlström

35-709

Any good spring shop can re-arch your springs, Bill.
Geoff N.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold - but still in the family
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod - Sold
1942 Cadillac 6269 - Sold
1968 Pontiac Bonneville Convertible - Sold
1950 Packard 2dr. Club Sedan
1935 Glenn Pray - Auburn Boattail Speedster, Gen. 2

Otto Skorzeny

If you need new springs, there are a couple companies that can help you. Eaton is one of them. For contact info click on link in signature.
fward

Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for YOURSELF

HUGE VENDOR LIST CLICK HERE

Bill Ingler #7799

Hi Bill: I have been in your position with both my 47 and a 41 60s. You have about 3 ways to correct your problem. Depending on how much your 41 looks like a low rider you can add another short leaf spring or spacer at the bottom of each rear spring which could bring up the rear height of the car. As as been mentioned you could re-arch the springs if you have a spring company in your area that has a furnace and the capability, plus specs to heat and re-arch. If you go this route you will need to get new spring liner material as when they take the old springs apart ,the old liner will need to be replaced . Eaton spring I believe sells replacement teflon liner for the leaf springs. I elected to go with the last option on both my 41 and 47 and that is to bite the bullet and buy new rear springs for the car. I am not sorry I did as Eaton builds a quality product which brought the rear to the right height. Now, if you also have weak front springs, then the addition of new rear springs to bring the car to the right height, might make the car low in the front. This happened on my 41 so new springs in the front were required to make the car sit level with the rear. Have fun.

Bill Podany #19567

Member Contributors:

I submit many thanks for your contributions and ideas to what I perceived to be possible sagging rear suspension to my 41 Cadillac 60 Special.

Fortunately, after having my mechanic carefully check the measurements on the rear suspension as detailed in the Shop Manuel (as sugested by member Bob Schuman) all seems to be exactly correct to its original standards.  It was my perception that this car may have a problem; Sorry, I remain eternally anal on these issues.

Bill Podany
Knoxville, TN
1941 60 Special Fleetwood
1955 Eldorado

Tom Magdaleno

One way to check ride height without a spec is to look at a factory photo.  Draw an imaginary line from the center of the wheel to some point on the body and see how yours compares.
Tom
'38 Cadillac V16
'71 Buick Riviera
'65 Chevy Truck
'56 Packard Super Clipper

Fred Zwicker #23106

#7
Also when car is sitting on level pavement and you measure from ground to the under-side of left and right front and rear fender wells (or under-sides of car), it is not likely that any car will sit dead-level.  Most cars (even newer ones) might vary by an inch or so.   Some older cars will be even worse, but not always noticeable unless measured. The driver's side is usually the side that sits lower, due to the weight of the driver over thousands of miles of driving over the years.

I have a restored slightly modified 1955 Pontiac Safari that was sitting about 1.5" to 2" low on the left-front side, which I corrected by installing new front coil springs and later increasing the length of the left-rear shackle by 2 inches. (Rear springs are leaf springs). The right-rear shackle was not changed. This raised the left rear and the right front dropped down and the left front raised - it now sits within 1/4" of being dead-level. It is hard to explain the theory, but it worked and was done as a result of someone's post on the AACA Forum when the question came up.  

Most cars eventually "sag" over the years, but it is gradual.  I like them sitting normal, but it is not always possible without major spring/shackle work and by someone who is very experienced.  I took my car to a company called, "Altitude Adjustment" in Brookfield, Ohio who changed the front springs to bring up a previously low front-end.  The first time, it seemed to be perfect, but after a little driving, the car settled down a bit, necessitating a second set of heavier front springs.  Even after the two tries to get the correct lift in the front, it was still too low on the driver's side, so I then changed the shackle as described above and the problem is now solved.

I know this is a Cadillac forum, but here is a side view picture of the Pontiac, showing how the car now sits.


Fred
1930 LaSalle Convertible Coupe, CCCA Senior
1939 LaSalle 2-Dr. Conv.  CLC Senior in 2008
1940 Cadillac Series 75 4 Dr. Convertible
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1948 Cadillac Convertible - modified by Holly (driver)
1966 Cadillac DeVille Conv. Restored - Red
See Pictures at www.tpcarcollection.com

Jeff Maltby 4194

Fred. Can you send me the link on the AACA forum about longer shackles ? Sounds interesting.

Thanks
Jeffo 49er chapter

CLC 1985
Honda Gold Wing GL1500

Fred Zwicker #23106

Sorry Jeff, I cannot locate the link. (It was part of a discussion about something else originally, not specific to this problem).  As I recall I was trying to figure out how to raise the left front (driver's) side ,as the car sat about 1.5" lower than the right side. With a driver and no passenger, the difference was about 2". Someone mentioned that it is not always the front springs that need adjustment or shims; instead came up with an idea of working from the rear.  If the left rear comes up, the right front goes down and if the right front goes down, the left front comes up. The amount is small, but combined adds up to a substantial difference.  The good thing, is that it is very easy to make up a longer shackle and do some testing.  We were experimenting and hit it perfectly the first time - I could hardly believe it, as was really struggling to get it right and the previous owner of the car admitted that he had "struck out" in his attempt to get the front of the car up and level.  I do not have the exact dimensions, but the original shackle was about 4" long from center to center of the bolts.  We left the right rear at this 4" dimension and changed the left rear shackle to 6".   It worked and even the rear side elevations are the same (wiithin 1/4" of being level).

Fred
1930 LaSalle Convertible Coupe, CCCA Senior
1939 LaSalle 2-Dr. Conv.  CLC Senior in 2008
1940 Cadillac Series 75 4 Dr. Convertible
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1948 Cadillac Convertible - modified by Holly (driver)
1966 Cadillac DeVille Conv. Restored - Red
See Pictures at www.tpcarcollection.com

35-709

Lovely (and rare) Pontiac, Fred.
Geoff N.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold - but still in the family
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod - Sold
1942 Cadillac 6269 - Sold
1968 Pontiac Bonneville Convertible - Sold
1950 Packard 2dr. Club Sedan
1935 Glenn Pray - Auburn Boattail Speedster, Gen. 2

The Tassie Devil(le)

I know this is a Cadillac and LaSalle Website, but that Pontiac is just plain beautiful.

Bruce. >:D
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

Jeff Maltby 4194

#12
Fred. Do the pontiac shackles flip like a Cadillac ? I called Ron Metcalf at RPM Engineering about the shackle problem and he was wondering if a longer shackle would cure the problem to get them past center permanently , so that is my interest in your post here.
Jeffo 49er chapter

CLC 1985
Honda Gold Wing GL1500

Fred Zwicker #23106

Jeff,  I don't know, but tomorrow I will crawl under the car and try to take a picture or two and post them tomorrow night.   I checked the car again today and it is sitting nice and level.

Fred
1930 LaSalle Convertible Coupe, CCCA Senior
1939 LaSalle 2-Dr. Conv.  CLC Senior in 2008
1940 Cadillac Series 75 4 Dr. Convertible
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1948 Cadillac Convertible - modified by Holly (driver)
1966 Cadillac DeVille Conv. Restored - Red
See Pictures at www.tpcarcollection.com

Fred Zwicker #23106

#14
Here are pictures of each shackle.  The shorter shackle is 4" long between bolts (was this way originally).  This is the rear passenger side.
The longer shackle is 6" long between bolts (We added exactly two (2) inches in shackle length to this side to level the car in both front and rear.  This is the rear driver's side.

Car now sits dead level with this setup, even though somewhat non-conventional.  Raising left rear dropped the right front of the car and at the same time, the left front of car lifted slightly.

Fred
1930 LaSalle Convertible Coupe, CCCA Senior
1939 LaSalle 2-Dr. Conv.  CLC Senior in 2008
1940 Cadillac Series 75 4 Dr. Convertible
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1948 Cadillac Convertible - modified by Holly (driver)
1966 Cadillac DeVille Conv. Restored - Red
See Pictures at www.tpcarcollection.com

Jeff Maltby 4194

Fred. Thanks for the pictures. So the Pontiac has a reversed leaf eye design from Cadillacs and while very interesting, do they flip?

I'm trying to design a shackle holder like Bill's mechanic did to stop the flipping.

Jeffo
Jeffo 49er chapter

CLC 1985
Honda Gold Wing GL1500

Fred Zwicker #23106

I don't know if the shackles flip.  This Pontiac was modified by the previous owner and the rear end and rear springs are from a Nomad - no other information is available.

Fred
1930 LaSalle Convertible Coupe, CCCA Senior
1939 LaSalle 2-Dr. Conv.  CLC Senior in 2008
1940 Cadillac Series 75 4 Dr. Convertible
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1948 Cadillac Convertible - modified by Holly (driver)
1966 Cadillac DeVille Conv. Restored - Red
See Pictures at www.tpcarcollection.com

Olmike

I doing some work on A 41 series 62 for A customer. The shackle end of the rear spring rests forward of the upper shackle mount on the frame rail. I tried to flip the shackle rearward,but it's like the spring is too short. Can you guys help me out?
The car has no bounce in the rear because of this. Thanks, Mike   

Bobby B

Quote from: The Tassie Devil(le) on May 25, 2010, 04:00:12 AM
I know this is a Cadillac and LaSalle Website, but that Pontiac is just plain beautiful.

Every Day of the Week  >:D..........
                                      Bobby
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1968 Mustang Convertible
1973 Mustang Convertible
1969 Jaguar E-Type Roadster
1971 Datsun 240Z
1979 H-D FLH

Steve Passmore

#19
Quote from: Olmike on February 11, 2019, 04:49:55 PM
I doing some work on A 41 series 62 for A customer. The shackle end of the rear spring rests forward of the upper shackle mount on the frame rail. I tried to flip the shackle rearward,but it's like the spring is too short. Can you guys help me out?
The car has no bounce in the rear because of this. Thanks, Mike

Standard Problem covered many times on this forum. jack the rear up. Use a long bar in the shackles and pull back as far as you can while someone else slowly lowers the jack, keep on pulling and use a wooden wedge next time you want to lift it.  I keep mine in the car in case it has to be jacked up out on the road.


I have covered this before but its strange how Cadillac HAD a cure for this on the earlier cars and abandoned it. There was a bracket attached to the chassis which prevented the flip.
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe