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Bent wheels on a 75 eldo convertible

Started by Doug Spingelt, February 07, 2011, 06:13:24 PM

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Doug Spingelt

I just got new tires installed on my 1975 Eldo Convertible and I got the American Classics witht he 5/8 white walls.  very exciting.  However, I am informed that the wheels are all bent a bit making balancing very difficult.  I asked them to put the weights on the inside of the wheels so that the hubcaps do not get interfeared with and fall off.  Long story short, they are balanced as best they can but it is hard to overcome the bent wheels.  ( Ialso think i can feel it a low speeds.)

Can they be repaired?  Are there relaible replacements for them?  Is that crazy expensive?  I also just did new brake lines, callipers, front wheel bearings, axles, boots, and resonator so I am feeling tapped out!  new paint soon too.  yikes.  summer here we come! 

Thanks.   
Doug Spingelt

The Tassie Devil(le)

G'day Doug,

A good Wheel Shop or an Engineering Shop can straighten wheels.   Using bent wheels for an extended period will create an uneven  wear on your new tyres, and when you fit good wheels to the tyres, the tyres will not run properly, because of that initial unevenness. 

But, with the correct CAX Wheel Weights, that were designed for the Cadillac rims on the outside, the caps will never fall off.

Bruce. >:D
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

markl

Doug,
Don't know where you are located, and I am ignorant of what material the 75 Eldo would have for stock wheels.  However, if you are in California, or anywhere close, this sounds like the sort of job that Rite-Way Wheels Specialist in Walnut Creek can handle.  You might give them a call to discuss, (925) 933-4046.

They did an alloy wheel wheel for me a few years ago (Peugeot) and it went from "unbalanceable" to balanced, and okay to run even on the front axle.  It was not a mechanized process, and looked to take a lot of skill and experience on the part of the fellow doing the work.  Anyhow, they made their name in the industry working on spoked wheels, which they still do (Borrani's etc.) but they work on other types, and I would imagine even steel wheels if that is what you are dealing with.

Mark Lowery, CLC#25216

Richard Scot Minesinger

Hi,

The same thing happened to my friend's 1974 Eldorado.  The most economical and successful solution can be a salvage yard.  Don't have the time?, who does?  Try places that specialize in finding them, such as Cadillac King, D'bears, USA parts and Cadillac Tim.  There are others.  He paid under $200 for all four including freight from Cadillac Tim, and they worked out great.  Failing this, you may have to have the ones you have straightened and that will be very expensive.  Obviously, retain the the one you have if you buy good used replacements, just in case.

The other replies were absolutely correct don't ignore this problem, it is critical.

Best of luck,

Scot

TJ Hopland

#4
Here is what the weights (and wheels look like).



I have spent money on and off trying to get rid of the vibration in my 73 eldo vert over the last 15 years and from time to time I get a shop that tells me they found the problem and can fix it so I get excited and spend more money usually with very little if any change.  Over the years I have replaced most of the suspension parts, wheel bearings, brakes, several cv axles, 2 transmissions and 2 engines.  I own a total of 23 wheels (4 cars) and have been through the bent wheel thing a few times and brought others in that they said were good and again with no real difference.  2 of the cars are not roadworthy so I have not really driven em so its just this one and a 75 hardtop that I have put a lot of miles on.  The 75 does not vibrate like the 73 does and has Kelly tires on it that are at least 10 years old, I even took some weights off 2 of the wheels to fit the caps.  I have never had both cars together at the same time to be able to swap parts around to see if I can move the problem. On the 73 I have had em balanced on standard machines, special machines that load the tires, and on the car. The latest is supposedly my 'new' 2 tires are bad.  I say new because they were a discontinued model when I bought them about 3? years ago.  Im not sure if I believe it or not because the vibration did not change that much between the tires I had had on the car most of the time I have owned it and these 2.  The 2 tires I replaced had some odd wear and broken cords (likely due to age and abuse).

Let me know if you get it figured out, I would love to get mine running smooth.   If money is alright in the spring I was thinking of buying a cheap set of store brand tires and see what happens.   I have not had the best of luck with big names lately so I have been running store brands that cost sometimes 1/2 the price, so far results have been great.
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

76eldo

I may have some used rims available.

You can email me at 76eldo@comcast.net

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

"Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364

Doug,
With all that rotating mass in the driveline, the front end of (at least) first generation Eldorados are prone to vibrations and wheels/wheel balance is critical.
First of all a wheel that is true (not bent and straight) is needed, as well as one that is balance both inside and outside, using the correct, recessed tang weights to clear the hubcaps.  They are available but you have to look for them (Cad USA is where I bought my last stash). 
A previous response recommends replacing the wheels with good used ones, and I second that.  The wheels on these cars don't bend easy and if they have been damaged, chances are you will be better off with a used, undamaged one.
In a previous thread (on this forum I believe) there was a discussion regarding the necessity of exact alignment to achieve drive line balance and I will suggest you look at that as well.
Greg
Cadillac Kid-Greg Surfas
Director Modified Chapter CLC
CLC #15364
66 Coupe deVille (now gone to the UK)
72 Eldo Cpe  (now cruising the sands in Quatar)
73 Coupe deVille
75 Coupe deElegance
76 Coupe deVille
79 Coupe de ville with "Paris" (pick up) option and 472 motor
514 inch motor now in '73-

Doug Spingelt

Thanks for the great advice.  I have to say that I picked up the car last night and took it for a nice drive out to dinner on the freeway for the first time in over a year.  She purred like a ktten and was silky smooth.  I don't think I properly estimated how bad the previous tires made the car feel, as well as the bad wheel bearing and axle.  I also replaced the resonator which seems to have elviated some roughness in the engine and carb stutter.  I may drive it a few more times when I can really pay attention to it and see about the wheels.  previously there was significant wobble at low speeds and a bit of a shudder at freeway speeds.  noe smooth as can be.  I am very happy. 

Of course I lost a hubcap last night too and was unable to find it!  crap.  I knew Ishould have double checked those things after the shop put them back on!  This has happened before, but I was able to find it. 

Thanks again.  this is the best forum around for any car.  I will have many more questions as spring rolls around!   
Doug Spingelt

76eldo

I have some used rims and a decent used cap.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

TJ Hopland

So at this point the 'bent wheels' dont seem to be effecting the ride quality?   

Im my case swapping the bent ones for ones that the same shop determined were not not bent did not change my problem. 
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

TonyZappone #2624

I was told my '76 convertible  had bent wheels also.  The car vibrated at highway speed.  Everyone looked at this car.  I put new radial tires on it, the service manager in west palm beach kept the car in his stall for two or three days, and tried everything he could to fix the problem.  It was kind of a critical problem here in Florida, for this was my every day driver.  Finally, a bright young tech at a local garage, discovered my problem.  The right hand driveshaft from the factory was two piece.  The replacement was one piece, the installation of the replacement driveshaft solved the problem.  I owned this car until about 7 or 8 years ago.  A young man expressed his desire several times for this car.  I finally gave in and sold it to him.  I owned several of these convertibles, most of which I bought to resell, except for the one I have been discussing, this was a black car, white top, red interior.  I took delivery of this car Christmas week, 1975.   The car was really a pretty car.  Mechanically, I don't think they were very nice cars at all.
Tony Zappone, #2624
1936 Pierce-Arrow conv sed
1947 Cadillac Conv cpe
1958 Cadillac conv
2016 Cadillac CT6 Platinum
2022 Chrysler Pacifica Pinnacle

76eldo

There's a big difference between a ding in the rim on the outer edge and a truly bent rim.

When the rim and tire are on a spin balancer you can see the wheel or tire wobble.  These are VERY heavy cars and on older radials, the belts in the tire sometimes shift or even break.  Proper wheel weights are a must on these too.

Brian

Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

TJ Hopland

So the damper in the shaft was causing the problem?  Or finding a shaft with a good damper got rid of the problem?   

My 73 started out with a damper but at some point got changed to one without.  No change in the issue.  I cant remember which of my cars have the damper, I may have one that still does.   If the damper is needed where do you find them?  I have never seen one for sale and the ones I have seen or have myself have pretty big cracks in the rubber so I did not want to use them.   Didnt the factory even quit using the damper the last couple years?
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

TonyZappone #2624

No.  There was no replacement available with the damper.  We assumed that the worn damper was causing the problem, hence the new one were made without the damper.
Tony Zappone, #2624
1936 Pierce-Arrow conv sed
1947 Cadillac Conv cpe
1958 Cadillac conv
2016 Cadillac CT6 Platinum
2022 Chrysler Pacifica Pinnacle

TJ Hopland

That is what I thought but wanted to be sure.    At least now I dont have to go out and start hording shafts with dampeners (or finding the ones I already own) and hope to find a good one.


It is interesting that parts stores still have a L and R part number even though none of them have a shaft with a dampener in it.  Sometimes they dont have the dampener side in stock so I have to argue with them to get them to sell me 2 of the other side that is in stock.   I have never worn out a shaft, just had the boots fall apart and destroy the shaft.  Sometimes they are already cracked just from being on the shelf at the parts store so long.  They also no longer charge a core which is a sign that they are no longer rebuilding them.  Sometimes that means that there are new cheaper 'import' parts but I dont think its the case for us, my guess is not enough demand.     
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

Glen

My 68 ELDO had the same problem.  I finally found the problem was the right hand drive axle.  The damper was loose and allowed the shafts to get out of alignment.  With the front on jack stands I stared the engine and put in gear.  Then from underneath I could see the damper moving up and down as the shaft rotated.   

A different axle solved the problem.  If I need a new RH axle I will install a LH axle on the right side. 

I normally just replace the boots as I catch the problem before there is any damage to the joint. 
Glen Houlton CLC #727 
CLCMRC benefactor #104

TJ Hopland

I bought a replacement inner boot several years ago.  I think I paid $45 for it.   Rebuilt shaft assy was $60 at the time.  When the new boot cracked they said sorry they dont make em any more, when the boot on the shaft cracked they gave me another shaft assy.  I have not checked lately, seems like I read someone is making the inners again and the outers are apparently the same as the more recent chevy trucks so they are easy. 
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason