Cadillac Obituary

[Peter Gariepy 26457]

Webmaster Note:  I got this email today. Thought I'd share it here.

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Through my associations with the Society of Automotive Historians and the CCCA, I have become friendly with many CLC members over the years. I
thought CLC club members might be interested in my recent "Cadillac obituary."

It's available at: http://automotivetraveler.com/jump/3162

Thanks! I hope all is well!

Sam Fiorani
Automotive Editor, Automotive Traveler Magazine
samf@automotivetraveler.com and fiorani@ptd.net

[C.R. Patton II]

I disagree with the author. I believe Cadillac has evolved with the passing of the years but continues to be the Standard of the World

[Aaron Hudacky]

I agree with the author. New Cadillacs just don't do it for me, and a lot of it has to do with the idea of paying a Cadillac price for a Chevrolet engine. That's not to say the current engines aren't amazing; they are. But I want to feel like there's some advantage to a Cadillac like the 425 c.i. and prior engines make me feel, and paying extra for the excellent DI 3.6 that is standard in the much more affordable Camaro but optional in the Cadillac doesn't make any sense to me.

I hope Cadillac lives to one day get its own outstanding engine design again. Maybe next time it will be hydrogen powered. A 2015 fast, efficient, Cadillac exclusive hydrogen car would be a great way to commemorate how outstanding the 1915 V8 was. I would love to see Cadillac leapfrog every other manufacturer again. To reestablish themselves I think they will have to.

No matter what they do down the road, I will always love and want 1979 and prior Cadillacs.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

I totally agree with the Author.

When each section of GM was made to use one engine across a range, they lost the plot.

Back in the late '50's, in Australia we got Pontiacs with Chevrolet frames and drive trains, and that was the beginning of the end.

People were disgusted when they found out that the Pontiacs weren't even the same size as the American ones.

I think the real demise of Cadillac was the re-badging of the German Opel as the Cimmaron.   Next thing we will see is Cadillac badges of Wheel Chairs.

Bruce.

[Terry Wenger]

- During the thirties Cadillac offered as many as 4 of their own engines each year, now they don't even offer one of their own.

- During the fifties Cadillac offered 23 or more colors which could be combined to make more than 500 two-tone combinations and colors not standard could be special ordered. Now you have you choice of three or 4 standard colors and three optional for only $995.00 each.

- During the 50's and 60's multiple interiors were offered for each body style, including leathers, various types of cloths, brocades and combinations of both in a rainbow of available colors. Now you have two or three choices, leather in black, tan or gray.

Somehow, in my opinion, Cadillac doesn't seem to fit the" Standard of the World" description any more, and needs to be no longer concerned with "The Penalty of Leadership".

I am glad that I had the opportunity in my lifetime to own and drive many of these Cadillacs from the past.

Terry Wenger
CLC #1800

[76eldo]

Right now, Cadillac is making a more diverse collection of cars than ever before.  They make a high performance coupe and sedan, a de-tuned version of the same, a large SUV, a smaller crossover vehicle, and a large sedan for the more traditional Cadillac buyer.

Everything changes in time.  Collector cars are rolling anachronisms and are curiosities and oddities because they are everyday objects, that made complete sense in a different time.  Cadillacs were always an extreme example, like the 59 or the 76 Eldorado convertible.  During the Classic era of the 20's 30's and 40's, high end cars were prized objects of status, especially when wearing a custom body.  The differences between a fully outfitted high end Classic and a Ford or Chevy were 10 times the value.  That type of differential changed as the cheaper cars got better and better and the medium priced cars came into play.

GM and all other car makers have always built cars for profit.  What was important to car buyers in the 50's and 60's is not important today.  Each year the cars got bigger, lower, longer, and faster.  More chrome, more gadgets, and outlandish styling and colors.  These are the most highly prized collectibles today. 

In 1959, there was a big difference in a Chevy 283 and a Cadillac 390.  The current CTS is a 3.6 V6 engine with 300 hp.  The Chevy Malibu also has a 3.6 V6 engine with 247 horsepower.  Is it the same engine?  I don't know.  The difference to me, under a the big plastic engine cover is minimal.

It's the ride, the electronics, the features, and the other luxury that makes a car a Cadillac.  The performance has gotten to an over-the-top level anyway.

Cadillac and GM are fighting for survival and the whole American auto industry has come a long way in quality since the lackluster 70's and 80's when they all got lazy and complacent and the Japanese kicked butt.  As collectors, we are fortunate to own cars that are still being manufactured today, and also luck to have a network of Cadillac dealers that support collectors and sponsor car shows. GM and all of the other automakers have to stay on the cutting edge or go out of business, especially right now.  If that means using a "Corporate" engine, rather than a unique Cadillac engine to remain viable, so be it. 

I wouldn't count Cadillac out just yet, but you can't compare our collectible Cadillacs with modern day production because the game has changed so much.

Brian

[CEC #20099]

Well, 76eldo, I guess the current crop of cars, (refrigerators with touch screens & ipods on wheels) suit you just fine. Sorry about that. Cars of the 50`s & 60`s had character, & you could go into a GM showroom & ORDER a fantastic set of wheels. I ordered 2 Pontiac`s with all kinds of HD stuff in a plain blue wrapper. I wanted  a Pont with 3 spd stick, V8, rubber mats, & radio delete. GM said YES SIR, & I had my car. Will they do that today ?

GM sure dropped the Oldsmobile parts fast, after the division shut down. My friend`s 93 Delta 88 is a perfect example. Cadillac will be the same.

At least I can still ORDER a Chry Hemi stick. Something to think about, there.
CEC #20099

[Chris Conklin]

At least I can still ORDER a Chry Hemi stick. Something to think about, there.
CEC #20099

You can order a six-speed manual in a supercharged "V" Cadillac also. Sweeeeet 

And I'm still wondering what happened to my jet-pack?!? Shouldn't we have those by now?

[76eldo]

I think I am going to refrain from getting involved with opinionated threads like this one.  CEC seems to know what kind of cars I like.  I don't know how, but yeah, I would take a CTS coupe in a second.  It's a great looking and performing car.  Would I go drop $60K for ANY new car, NO.  i don't want one that badly.

The original post discussed an article in which the writer said that Cadillac is dead because they are building cars with a engines that are not Cadillac only and because of that, Cadillac is dead.  I was dis-agreeing with that.  I'm not a GM stockholder, and I am not trying to say that people should run out and buy new Cadillacs.

All you can tell about me and what I like is that I own the Cadillacs listed on my ID signature on this message board.  Lately, I have been reading a lot of posts and people using their keyboard muscles.  not just on this post, but others. 

I think a good way to conduct yourself on any message board is not to type something that you wouldn't say face to face to someone you just met at a car show.

I think I will just read instead of getting involved and answer any technical questions that i am dead sure about the answer if i feel like assisting someone looking for info.

If you guys want to kick GM and Cadillac around, maybe go buy a Mustang.

Brian

[markl]

Bruce,
Don't want to dredge up too many unpleasant memories, but want to clear up one statement you made about the infamous Cimmaron;  It was a re-badged (and slightly re-trimmed) Chevy Citation.

It was the Catera that was the rebadged Opel.  Though the initial models had some severe short comings, they eventually got it sorted out.  More than anything, the Catera was a public relations disaster (the Caddy that Ziggs), but in final analysis, it was a very sophisticated well built German car.  Part of why it died was almost complete lack of dealer support. However, it just never seemed like a Cadillac, and it was built in Germany, w/ the exception of the engine which was made in Opel's plant in England.  That same engine ended up in Saabs and the Saturn SUV.

I put a 93 Opel V-6 in my daughter's 98 Catera, and the result is a very tractable car.  Cadillac? No, but a desirable car in its own right.  Of course what do I know; I think they lost the touch in the late 30's!

Mark Lowery, CLC #25216

[Rick Payton]

I have a new CTS V sport wagon and I think it is fantastic. I sold my Mercedes E63 for the new V-Wagon. If Cadillac keeps up with this trend they are again going to be the standard of the world not just the fastest production sedan in the world.  On a side note I don't get why this forum has taken such a turn. If you don't like Cadillac don't post.

[markl]

Bruce and all,
A correction!  I put a 2003 engine in my daughter's Catera.  Slightly greater displacement  and very nice engine.  Just have to keep ahead of any issues w/ the valve covers (plastic) and it seems they cured the heat exchanger/oil cooler issue.  I guess my reason for bringing all this up is that the Cimmaron could never have hoped to be a Cadillac, but the Catera was indeed a sporty luxury car.  Just didn't fit the then current demographic for Cadillac owners.

Mark Lowery CLC #25216

[Roger Zimmermann]

Mark, the Cimarron was not a rebadge Citation. The Citation was a "X" body, like Buick Skylark, Olds Omega and Pontiac Phoenix.
The Cimarron was a "J" car, like Chevy Cavalier and Pontiac Sunbird.

Roger

[Rich S]

Brian (76Eldo) gave a great summary of the current situation! Although we love our collector Cadillacs, the new model Cadillacs are great contemporary vehicles. Unfortunately, everything does change, and I am confident the still un-named replacement DTS model, whose concept vehicle was the "XTS," will be a fine car and worthy of Cadillac's legacy for luxury vehicles. I have owned two CTS models (an '03 and an '08,) and they have been American made, well-built, trouble-free, comfortable and safe cars for today's urban driving needs. Of course, I still sorely miss the large personal luxury coupes, but those were not selling and one by one, the manufacturers have dropped producing them.

[markl]

Roger,
I defer to your superior knowledge.  Just shows what happens when one works from memory!  But you do agree that it was the Catera that was the re-badged Opel?  As I recall, you are located in Switzerland, so you must see the Opel progenitor on occasion.  In England, this car was sold as a Vauxhaul.  Do you agree that it was a decent car in its own right?

Mark Lowery, CLC#25216

[Roger Zimmermann]

I defer to your superior knowledge.  Just shows what happens when one works from memory!  But you do agree that it was the Catera that was the re-badged Opel?  As I recall, you are located in Switzerland, so you must see the Opel progenitor on occasion.  In England, this car was sold as a Vauxhaul.  Do you agree that it was a decent car in its own right?
Yes Mark, the Catera was an Opel/Vauxhall Omega. In Switzerland, we have only the Opel brand; anyway, Vauxhall models are rebadged Opels. In my opinion, the Omega was not suited for the US: no torque at low RPM, you have to go up in the rpms to have some engine response, quite the contrary of the US habits. Furthermore, Opel (and Vauxhall) had big quality problems at that time, thanks to Lou Hughes. The Catera was a temporary fix until the CTS came on the market.

Roger

[Fleet]

The author does make some good points. Both of my Cadillacs ('69 Fleetwood Brougham and '76 Fleetwood Seventy-Five Limousine) have Cadillac engines!

In the '60s, you could buy a Cadillac as a two-door hardtop, four-door hardtop or sedan, a convertible, a front-wheel-drive, a 9-passenger sedan and a limousine. Many choices.

And in 1968, for example, there was a choice of 21 different exterior colors, 5 vinyl top options and 147 upholstery color and fabric combinations.

Tony Gaudenti
#12310