1941 60S backup and nutral switch

[markcapen]

I am reconstructing a 41 60S and it appears that I am missing the nutral safety switch and the backup switch and brackets does anyone know what they look like and where I could get them ?

[Doug Houston]

Assuming you have a Hydra-Matic  moel, of course

You are looking for two different switches. the neutral safety switch is mounted to a bracket that bolts onto the steering column up, and almost against the firewall. You have a small crank-like arm on the selector shaft. It has a finger on it that engages the neutral safety switch.

The backup light switch is a switch on a bracket beneath the dash, and to the left of the steering column. Like a small heater switch, it has a white knob, with the letter "B" on it, and is lighted when turned on. This is the way it was done on the '41 models, and in later models, the backup switch was on a bracket on the end of the transmission, and was operated by a link from the shift linkage, whether Hydra-Matic or manual shift.

More convenient, the later model B.U. light linkage can be installed on a '41 car.

[markcapen]

thank you
I have a standard transmission I did find a switch knob with a B on it I think I am going to have to do some more  poking around to find the rest of the back up switch  what is confusing me it the wires that I labled for the backup are on the forward side of the fire wall ? 

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

G'day Mark,

I don't think there is any NSS on a Cadillac with Manual Transmission as there is no need for one.

In fact, I have never heard of one on any vehicle with a Manual Transmission.

Bruce.

[markcapen]

That makes sense to me  I found the switch and bracket for the backup and the fog lights I am going to have to go back to the wiring diagram and see if I can figure out what these four wires are this is a new harness that I am installing and when it showed up at the house nothing was labeled so I had to identify all the leads from the schematic and it is tough when you are partially color blind but the wife was nice enough to help me.. thanks for the sanity check.

[Doug Houston]

G'day Mark,

I don't think there is any NSS on a Cadillac with Manual Transmission as there is no need for one.

In fact, I have never heard of one on any vehicle with a Manual Transmission.



Bruce;
There had been backing lights on cars for many years, even before the '41 model cars. If you're backing the ca, it doesn't matter WHAT transmission is in the car; backing is backing. The backing light that was a 1941 Cadillac accessory was a sort of funny looking oval light that mounted to the body immediately above the bumper, and between the decklid and the rear fender. It would have been on the opposite side place on RH  drive cars.

I have a '41 Chevrolet convertible, and that year, Chevy had a chromium bullet shaped backing light as factory offering. It was mounted in the center filler pan between the bumper and the body. In 1946, they offered a pair of backing lights in a kit, that resembled the tail lights. I bought a set of them, and used one just below the LH tail light on the body.       

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

G'day Doug,

But, there was no NSS with a Manual Transmission.

Bruce.

[Steve Passmore]

I dont think Doug realized you were only talking about the Neutral Safety Switch.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

Probably all that food he ate.

I know just how much he can eat, and have the pictures to prove it.

Bruce.

[markcapen]

Well I have found all the backup and fog lite pieces, now I just need to figure out the wiring. I suspect Narraganset Wiring gave me a harness for an automatic because I have two extra wires on the firewall side that naturally fall close to the staring column.  I need to call them on Monday,  If they did than I just need to figure out how to hide the neutral safety wires  I haven't been too please with Narraganset between not labeling the leads and not sending me all the wiring schematics and now possible sending me the wrong harness and then sending me two termanal blocks   when I didn't order them.    never seams to end.

[Jay Friedman]

You can use the wiring for the NSS on a manual transmission car to hook up an anti-theft switch, as I have done on my '49. 

Install a hardware store toggle switch somewhere on the frame.  The best place is under the car, below the front door, in one of the many holes in the frame.  Connect the 2 NSS wires in the harness to this switch.  I used dark colored wire so the wires in the set up are not very visible in the under-hood gloom when the hood is opened. 

With the switch in the on postion everything will work normally.  When the switch is turned off, everything in the car will still work, but when you press the starter button nothing will happen.  A clever thief might figure it out eventually but, on the other hand, may decide the battery is weak and give up. 

[markcapen]

Excellent Idea thank you

[Jay Friedman]

Alternatively, if you don't want to hook up a switch, as the '49 shop manual wiring diagram says you merely connect the 2 wires permanently together.

[Barry M Wheeler #2189]

The 60S fog/back up lamp switch locations are slightly different. Somewhere, in my office downstairs, I have the factory diagram for the back up lamp installation. I will try to look for it tomorrow. I think I know where it is. I'd put a bunch of my '41 material on a computer that went belly up, but I think I kept out a paper copy. I will give myself a note to look when I get my clean clothes tomorrow and try to let you know ASAP.

[Bob Hoffmann CLC#96]

Mark,
Check the for sale ads. A guy has a 41 FW with the correct 41 B/U  light. Maybe he can help  you with some questions.
HTH, Bob

[Barry M Wheeler #2189]

I found the copy of the instruction sheet. However, I can't figure out how to attach it to this message. If you need it, please send me a PM with your e-mail and I will send you a copy. Sorry that a moderator isn't completely conversant with the mechanics of the site...Blush, blush.

[Doug Houston]

The connection for the backing light is pretty straightforward. The supply to the dash switch (the one with the "B" on it) can be simply put on the light switch on the terminal where the headlights are connected. that way, the backing light will work, through its switch, if the headlights are turned on.

One other thing to clarify an issue that isn't addressed here, is driving lights or fog lights. The generator in the Cadillacs right up to the advent of alternators, does NOT have sufficient current output for the operation of BOTH head and auxiliary lights of any kind.

If one examines the fog light switch, he'll find that the switch will select between either  the park lights, or the fog lights. On the '41 cars, the factory fogs have 50 CP bulbs in them, which is the low beam candlepower for sealed beam lights, as I recall. The generator can't handle both fogs and low beams on at the same time. so the fog light feed is connected to the PARK position of the light switch. This permits fogs ONLY to be used in place of the park lights . If the fog light switch is on, you have no park lights. If it's turned off, you have park, and no fogs. that way, you can't run sealed beams AND fogs together.

[Barry M Wheeler #2189]

As mentioned, I found the factoryinstallation sheet for the back-up light. On 60S cars only, with fog lamps, the switch must be moved clear over to the left on the instrument panel, to the left of the hand brake. Did you know that, Doug? ( Of course he did, Doug knows everything about 41s.)

[markcapen]

That is valuable info I think I have located all the parts and if I understand correctly the switch for the fog lights is next to the steering column and the backup light switch is outboard of that.  The heater has been running for about a 1/2 hour so it is time to get out there

thanks