1970 Deville general questions

[chrisntam]

As always, I'm trying to educate myself on how these cars came equipped, so I have a few general questions. I've looked in both the owners manual and a repair manual, but both appear to be silent on the questions I have.

1) Why do some cars have two braces from the firewall to the top of the fender well and some don't have any and some may have one brace?  The ones that don't have the braces appear to have rubber plugs on the fender wells, sealing off the holes.  All cars came with them and they were removed over the years?

2) Why the different style air cleaner lids?  Some are smooth top, some have ridges. Why the difference?

3) Why does the VIN tag tell some of the optional equipment that came on the car but not all?

4) Why do some cars have a single door jamb switch and some have two (at each door)?  I assume one activates the interior lights, what does the second one control?

Are there any other "little known facts" about these cars that would make good discussion in this thread?

Thanks in advance for sharing your expertise!!

chris.

[Scot Minesinger]

Chris,

In answer to some of the questions:

1.  The convertibles did not have the braces and the closed cars included them.  The braces are often added to convertibles (I added them to mine for body rigidity, but noticed no improvement in drivability), but they are not correct.  When self leveling was ordered as an option on a convertible one of the braces was mounted on driver side to support the tank and compressor unit serving rear air shocks.

2.  Never notice the different lids, presume they are from another year if smooth and incorrect

3.  The VIN tag info - I do not know, perhaps it was items that had to be known when car was being made, like dual comfort seats had a floor pan bracket welded, trunk pull down required different trunk pan welding, color (had to sprayed early on), where as a tissue dispenser could be added easily afterwards.

4.  The second switch allows lights that normally are operated by door opening can also be turned on by passengers when car is moving.  It is a second switch wired in parallel with the interior switch.

I have been around 1970 Cadillacs for a while, don't be shy about asking.

Scot

[76eldo]

I have seen on two completely original 30,000 mile 70 Devilles two different styles of air cleaner lids as you describe. It's possible that they made a change during the year or changed vendors for this part, different assembly plants, etc.

Ill have to check on my 70 to see, but on some cars the second door jamb switch activates the seat back release so that when the door is open the seat folds forward without having to manually release it.

The previous poster answered the fender to cowl support rod question.
Seems like the convertible would need additional support but they have no support rods.

Brian

[chrisntam]

The 2nd door jamb switch makes sense with power door locks.  Mine does not have that option and only one door jamb switch.  Of course, I want two switches!!

As a side note, it took me about 6 months to figure out why some front seats had a latch on the side (exterior) and some did not.  It was only after I got an owners manual that I figured that out.

Here are pics of the two air cleaner lids, haven't seen why they are different.  All the '70s on eBay now have smooth lids, as does mine.  Some pics are convertibles, some are not.  My car's production date is January, 1970.

[76eldo]

Either lid style is correct for 1970.

Brian

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

I am pretty sure that the second switch on the door pillar is for a two door car and operates the solenoid that releases the seat back locking mechanism.

It is extremely important as a safety item that the seat back be retained in position when the vehicle is moving.   As in the event of a crash, and the front seat occupants are wearing their seat belt, if the rear passengers weren't, they were thrown forward, therefor applying great pressure on the back of the front seat resulting in killing the restrained persons.

Bruce.

[Scot Minesinger]

You are right about those two door switches, one is for lights, other is for interlock on seats to keep from moving forward when door is closed.  I have the two switches and always thought my catch was defective because when door was open seat tilted forward without activating lever.  I got in the back this morning, shut door and viola - the seat would not move forward.  Opened door and hear a solenoid make, and the seat then was unlatched and moved forward for rear seat exit.  Never knew that - thanks! 

[speach]

Well I just learned some cool stuff. I have a 68 Deville and thought someone had removed the fender braces.

[Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373]

Yes, the 2nd door switch is for the seatback release.  These are with power locks.  You can tell if a car has power locks by looking at the seat.  If the switch is a button on the outboard side, no power locks.
Now I will just point out 1 thing here. Watch that relay if you have the doors open for an extended period of time. My seatbacks just click so there is something wrong somewhere which I still need to troubleshoot.  However if I leave the doors open for a long time while working on the inside, the relay under the seat gets quite warm.  I don't know if it is because mine do not work and it is getting warm due to resistance in the circuit, or if there is another reason, but it is warm none the less.  I unpluged mine as it doesn't work anyway.
So, if you just got the car and have the doors open for a while such as cleaning the carpet, etc.  Check under the seat.  It  will be the relay that is warm.
Jeff

[speach]

This is interesting. Is this true about the seats on earlier cars too. I have a 68 that has the buttons on the side of the seat. I also have 67 backs that I want to use that do not have the holes for the buttons. What will I need to hook up power locks on my car? Im doing vent motors so I mine as well have those too. I don't want to cut  a hole in my 67 seat backs if I don't have to

[Scot Minesinger]

Jeff,

Battery disconnect switch is how I fix that problem on doors being open for a while.  Since I went to the snap ring cables that represent original, did not want to be fooling with them if needed to disconnect negative for electrical work so added the disconnect switch.  It is more handy than anticipated, great for when you want to detail car and etc with door open for extended periods.

On another subject your hub cap is on the way, shipping was $13.90, so how about $15?  When you receive it if you feel that is too much $14 is OK, just kidding it is not horrible, but say a #3 or # 4 out of the 1 to 6 scale.  The part that secures to rim is good.

[Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373]

Perfect!!

[cadillacmike68]

This is interesting. Is this true about the seats on earlier cars too. I have a 68 that has the buttons on the side of the seat. I also have 67 backs that I want to use that do not have the holes for the buttons. What will I need to hook up power locks on my car? Im doing vent motors so I mine as well have those too. I don't want to cut  a hole in my 67 seat backs if I don't have to

Let me know how the power door locks and power vent conversions go, and where you got the parts. Those are two things I sorely miss on my 1968. I can't even See the passenger side door lock, let alone reach over to move it.

[Scot Minesinger]

Power door locks were vacuum on 67 and 68(not 100% sure on 68, but positive on 67).  Adding power locks will be a pain especially if vacuum, but nice to have.

The seat regulations were in effect in 1969 with head rests and all.  I think it was normal for the seats to swing up without a safety catch until 1969.

[cadillacmike68]

Power locks are vacuum actuated on 1968 as well.   

[76eldo]

By 1970 they were electric. I assume 69 too.

Brian

[speach]

Let me know how the power door locks and power vent conversions go, and where you got the parts. Those are two things I sorely miss on my 1968. I can't even See the passenger side door lock, let alone reach over to move it.

Well I have most of the parts for the vent windows, not sure when I will get to them as its not top priority right now. I will be sure to post about it when I do. I got the vent windows and motors from a parts car but i do see them pop up on Ebay from time to time.

[cadillacmike68]

Vent windows themselves are the same. It's the motors, regulator gears and switches (and bezel!!) that are different. That and the wires to control the passenger side. 

It's Royal PITA, You need a pair of bezels from a DeVille, because a Fleetwood 60 series will have a bigger opening for the rear power vents, and a Fleetwood 75 will Not have the opening for the lockout / Bypass switch.

When you couple that with power door locks (another opening in the bezel), you are looking for the needle in a haystack, but you don't even know which farm to go to.

[speach]

I never knew that those funky little windows in the back of the fleet woods were power vents. Neat to know. That makes sense. If you put power vent windows in a car that doesn't have them you also have to eliminate the window crank hole on the door panels.

[Scot Minesinger]

Also, don't forget you need to replace door panel because of the hole for vent window crank.  Given the work, cost, and potential problems involved:

1.  Vacuum power locks - not worth it
2.  Power vent windows - beyond not worth, probably easier to replace the car with one that has them in comparable condition.