freeing up 41 engine.

[Quentin Hall]

I've turned my attention to the engine on the 39. It's got a 41 engine. I filled the pots with oil ages ago. Today I put a bar on the fly wheel and managed to get it back and forth easily about a quarter turn. Before it locked up again and now I can't seem to crack it again. I refilled the pots with a little oil and the plugs are loose. I don't want to force it further forward and can't get good purchase on the flywheel with the bar to go backwards. Any ideas.?

[joeceretti]

Oil in the cylinders won't free up stuck valves because they are up top. Taking the heads off is risky. Maybe as a start, pull the valley covers off and check for stuck valves, broken valve springs etc. You have easy access to the lifters and valve stems there.

[Quentin Hall]

Thanks Joe, I am not well versed in side valves. I need to get a manual and study them. Always played with OHVs. I appreciated your prior comments.

[walt chomosh #23510]

Quentin,
  You did remove the spark plugs before attempting to turn the motor? Without removing them you could be getting"liquid lock" in the cylinders which won't allow one to turn the motor plus will lead to damage....walt...tulsa,ok

[Quentin Hall]

Plugs are in but loose. I was excited when I got it to move back and forth easily initially. But try as I might can't budge it. I am not using a big lever just a big screwdriver on the flywheel.

[James Landi]

I've successfully used "BLASTER" to free up stuck engines (Liquid Wrench and loads of kerosene work too--- fill the cylinders with kerosene) --- I urge you to buy multiple cans of this spray and spray, spray, spray.  As was mentioned in the thread, you must be careful that you're not forcing rusted and locked up valves and the valuve train that you have not sprayed with penetrating liquid.  Spray the valve train... soak everything well, then soak everything again.  In my experience(s), moving the flywheel back and forth and, in doing so, gradually widening all of the stuck parts and then spraying everything as you go, will eventually get you over the rusted areas which are, alas, high spots on the metal that are being overcome by force.   I have successfully freed several much later model engines, and had they run successfully without any major rebuild, but I suspect you're just hoping to get the engine freed up to rebuild it... in any case, as was mentioned in the thread, you need to use plenty of penetrating liquid, and again, do especially spray upper and lower ends of the valves and cam followers-- you don't want to break anything.

[Jon S]

As Walt suggested - remove the spark plugs totally.

[Steve Passmore]

Chances are its values stuck.

[Quentin Hall]

Yeah Steve, my values have been stuck for a long time too.
So if the "valves" are stuck. . .what are my options?

[gary griffin]

I have freed stuck engines by filling the crankcase to the top with ATF or light oil with solvent. You are working on the top end only. Be patient and get the oil up into the engine as far as you can from the bottom. This will get the bearings and the bottom of the cylinders and the piston skirts. Of course you should remove the spark plugs and fill the cylinders also. Wait a few days and then start working it back and forth.  Since it is a flathead I would even consider pulling the intake manifold off and flooding the valley. That is a small job. The secret is to get the penetrating oil to as many of the moving parts as you can and then wait. I would even consider putting an electric heater in the engine compartment at the same time.

[tozerco]

Quentin,

Are you going to pull the heads anyway? If so, take the valley covers off and remove as much of the valve gear (springs, retainers etc) as you can then you might as well get to the removal of the heads now. You will be able to see/bash any stuck valve back once the heads are off. You will need new valve guides anyway, most probably.

Removing the heads takes a LOT of care and you are almost certain to break one (or, more likely, more than one) of the head bolts off because they hang down into the water jacket, rust at the ends and swell up.

You should also check these side valve engines for cracks once the heads are off because that can be their achilles heel.

[joeceretti]

Although I have dismantled two of these engines so far and have had no trouble, the stories I have read about breaking head bolts is the one thing that scares the heck out of me.

[Quentin Hall]

This 39 is my away from home , low budget after hours, fun build , whilst I am billeted away in Perth every couple of weeks. I was hoping, in a perfect world just to get it up as a runner and have some fin without it turning into another $$$ rebuild. The rest of the car is absolutely rust free. So I know it wasn't left out to the elements. I'll fill it up with atf and acetone and see what happens gently.
The bare minimum rebuild will be $5000 won't it?
Has any one brought a flathead back after long non use with any luck?

[joeceretti]

If you have the engine on a stand maybe you could turn it over and fill it to get some of the atf/acetone to soak into the valve guides? Still, I think you might be able to free up stuck valves through the top end by removing the valley covers. I am hopeful at least.

[tozerco]

Quentin,

I have done two now, one in Canberra and one in Sydney. $5,000 is tops including buying lots of new bits. Just talk to me before you go near anyone in Sydney because my lawyer is STILL trying to sort out a particular engine re-builder on that one!

[Steve Passmore]

[quote author
Has any one brought a flathead back after long non use with any luck?
[/quote]

It can happen Quentin, I have one here that runs beautifully that was left outside for 25 years, another stored inside for the same time with the bores sized solid with water, theres no rhyme or reason.
My first job would be to remove the heads, that way everything will be on view. I have dismantled 9 of these engines to date with two more waiting and my first job is always to remove the heads, only three of them had big troubles with head bolts breaking and they were wrecking yard cars. As Bob said the bolts do swell up in the water jacket but thats not to say they cant be removed with care by working backwards and forwards. You get to feel if their going to give you problems.
At the end of the day if the engine is not freeing up easily I personally would not want to run one without seeing what had caused the trouble, OK to start it up in the workshop but not to depend on it for 1000s of miles.  If its rust in the bores it will eventually destroy the rings and the same to the guides if its the valves.
As a side note with all this doom and gloom about breaking head bolts any worthy machine shop will drill them out and replace with a 'Helli-coil'  On one of the bad engines I spoke of I had 16 bolts broken! A local machine shop repaired them all and that engine runs in a car today 16 years later. I have since bought my own kit, the coils are not expensive and I have no fear of these bolts anymore.

[Quentin Hall]

Well. . . I figured I'd have another go since it turned the 1/4 turn last night so easily. I got the tire lever on it this time. Back and forth one tooth and suddenly got it to turn 360 like a dream.
Lying on my back with a big bar in my hand and breaking a sweat never felt so good.
Every rubber is shot so next up I'll pull the water pump and Gen and starter. . I should be so lucky.

[Steve Passmore]

Thats good news that its moves so easily. was obviously just a valve. It would lock up like that when the cam lobe came around to lift the valve and couldn't move it. Result.

[harry s]

Good news Quintin. We were all cheering for you.    Harry

[Quentin Hall]

I'm happy for you all to cheer . . .but I don't want any one rooting for me.
Sorry, my  juvenile, twelve year old humor just won't let up.
Found really cool "Daddy long legs" and."BGR 61 " on the intake.