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Stuck '71 Distributor

Started by wbdeford, December 01, 2014, 07:37:27 PM

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wbdeford

Any advice for freeing a stuck '71 distributor?  I am removing it to install a Pertronix Ignitor.  I can't pull it out or get it turn in either direction.  I sprayed a little Liquid Wrench around the base, a little gentle prying, and a little heat....stopped the heat as the fringes of the gasket were catching on fire.
1958 Sedan de Ville

Past:
1956 Fleetwood 75 Sedan
1957 Fleetwood 60 Special
1958 Miller-Meteor Futura Landau Duplex
1960 Coupe de Ville
1966 De Ville Convertible
1970 De Ville Convertible
1971 Eldorado Convertible
1979 Sedan de Ville
1980 Seville

TJ Hopland

It won't turn at all?    Can you put it back together and still run it?   Maybe trying it with a hot engine?   

Also a good idea to take timing readings before you move anything just so you know where it was set when you started. 
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

Bobby B

William,
I've never heard of a distributor from that era being stuck. Sometimes they feel kinda tight between the gears and a pull-twist motion will get it up and out.   I guess you've never had to fuss with the distributor before when doing a tune-up? I've never removed a distributor to install a Pertronix Kit. Maybe a good idea to do in situ and leave well enough alone before something snaps and the next thing you know the engine's coming out. :o Good Luck!
                                                                                                   Bob
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1968 Mustang Convertible
1973 Mustang Convertible
1969 Jaguar E-Type Roadster
1971 Datsun 240Z
1979 H-D FLH

Scot Minesinger

Oh yes these get stuck.  The aluminum distributor housing that inserts into cast iron block bond over time and it is difficult to free up when stuck.  This happened to me on a 1968 Eldorado and a 1970 SDV, both low mileage (under 40k) original cars.

Aluminum does not hold up to heat and there are bearings inside with grease, so heat is not a great idea unless you are going to replace the distributor entirely.

I freed mine by tapping from below when front engine cover was off the car and replacing timing chain.  If you have not replaced timing chain that is a good idea.  From underneath the distributor I tapped on it lightly and it came free. 

With all engine components intact get a piece of steel rod or some item about 2' x 1/2" dia that can transmit force without bowing.  Try to have the rod parallel with distributor shaft as close as possible.  Position end of rod so it is underneath distributor cap base that is part of the casting that goes into engine block.  From underneath the car tap lightly on the end of the rod so that the force is directed to knock the distributor out of the penetration into the block (parallel to dist shaft is important or unwanted sideways force is exhibited).  After light taps you should see the dist start to move free.  The distributor is delicate so no real hard taps, this is like you are trying to drive a small brad thru a narrow piece of trim and you don't want to split it. 

Do not twist it will break the distributor if you use an oil filter wrench or some means of that nature.  These can get really locked in.  On my 1970 I removed the clamp that holds dist and it held while driving for 200 miles.

Not to insult but mark position of rotor and dist base in relation to block so it can be reinstalled easily in correct position.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

wbdeford

Thanks for the responses, guys.....I was removing it because that is what the Pertronix instructions say, but since it seems that isn't really necessary, I will get it running and see where the timing is before fighting with it any more.
1958 Sedan de Ville

Past:
1956 Fleetwood 75 Sedan
1957 Fleetwood 60 Special
1958 Miller-Meteor Futura Landau Duplex
1960 Coupe de Ville
1966 De Ville Convertible
1970 De Ville Convertible
1971 Eldorado Convertible
1979 Sedan de Ville
1980 Seville

Scot Minesinger

The bond grows stronger over time.  While you are at it highly recommend that you free it now even if timing is close.  Timing chains stretch and vacuum leaks (unfixable such as slight leak in intake manifold) and other issues often require a timing adjustment.  If original timing chain with nylon coated cam sprocket, that should be changed too.  Distributor, oil pump and fuel pump have to be removed to take chain off car. 

I went too far on precautionary repairs maybe.  I see a lot of benefits from the don't fix it if it is not broken school too.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373

I never did get mine out.  Had it on the engine stand, turned upside down and hit it from below (or above) depending on how you look at it.  I tried tension between the base and the block, soaked it for a week with acetone and ATF.  Heated it and everything.  The damn thing finally broke.  Engine shop got it out.  I got another one from a salvage yard.
Now that I think about it, I will ask the shop to put some anti seize on the shaft,  It may help for the future.
Jeff
Jeff Rosansky
CLC #28373
1970 Coupe DeVille (Big Red)
1955 Series 62 (Baby Blue)
Dad's new 1979 Coupe DeVille

Bobby B

#7
Scot,
I wasn't paying attention when he said he couldn't move it in either direction also, which really wouldn't work because the timing will most likely need to be tweaked as you mentioned. I was just being a little pre-cautious because it could turn ugly real fast, and we all know that feeling. I've never bothered removing it for the conversion which is pretty simple, straightforward, and worth every penny.  Good luck!
                                     Bob
1947 Cadillac Series 62 Convertible Coupe
1968 Mustang Convertible
1973 Mustang Convertible
1969 Jaguar E-Type Roadster
1971 Datsun 240Z
1979 H-D FLH

wbdeford

Fought with it some more today, but still no luck.  I looked to see if I could whack it (not too hard) with a 2 foot rod as was suggested, but there is no way to get one in there except at an angle....so that will have to wait till a later date when the water pump is off.  Continuing to blast it with penetrating oil.
1958 Sedan de Ville

Past:
1956 Fleetwood 75 Sedan
1957 Fleetwood 60 Special
1958 Miller-Meteor Futura Landau Duplex
1960 Coupe de Ville
1966 De Ville Convertible
1970 De Ville Convertible
1971 Eldorado Convertible
1979 Sedan de Ville
1980 Seville

J. Skelly

I had the same problem with my '71 Eldorado.  I tried applications of penetrating oil and waited a considerable length of time before trying to rotate it.  Since it was an aluminum case, I didn't heat it.  It wouldn't budge and I ended up breaking it off.  Then it was easy to carefully drill out the remainder and pick out the few bits of metal.  I cleaned the opening thoroughly and put in another distributor.  That was in the late 70s!
Jim Skelly, CLC #15958
1968 Eldorado
1977 Eldorado Biarritz
1971 Eldorado (RIP)

aod92

Mine is stuck on my 70 Deville too. I hope I don't break the thing!

"Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364

William (and Phil),
With the distributor that has "welded" itself to the block, the prognosis for "one piece" removal is only minimal.  My suggestion is that you get a replacement distributor (or upgrade if so chosen) and do what ever is necessary to pull the old one out.  That way if (and when) the old one breaks there are no tears to shed, but just a new replacement.  I have used a pipe wrench applied at the neck of the distributor just above block with great success.
Greg Surfas
Cadillac Kid-Greg Surfas
Director Modified Chapter CLC
CLC #15364
66 Coupe deVille (now gone to the UK)
72 Eldo Cpe  (now cruising the sands in Quatar)
73 Coupe deVille
75 Coupe deElegance
76 Coupe deVille
79 Coupe de ville with "Paris" (pick up) option and 472 motor
514 inch motor now in '73-

Scot Minesinger

Both times I was removing the dist. that was welded to the block, the main objective was timing chain replacement with front engine cover off, so the tapping worked real well and the distributors were re-used.  Replacements are not expensive, so if I was not replacing timing chain, probably would do as Greg suggests.  The tapping exercise took less than a minute, I use my two foot 1/2" socket drive extension.

It seems that is the way these repairs go, you want to change to electronic ignition and this can of worms presents itself.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty