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1960 Cadillac DeVille Air Condoning

Started by Tahoelover2002, March 08, 2015, 11:37:39 AM

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Tahoelover2002

Hello,

I have just purchased a 1960 Cadillac Sedan DeVille. The car came with the AC compressor disconnected, and the system opened up to the outside air for many months. I have just purchased a new receiver drier and the necessary amount of R12. However I wanted to see if anyone knows if there are any seals (possible o-rings) as there are on newer systems that need to be replaced before I reseal the system, evacuate the air and then recharge it. I have purchased a repair manual and master parts list but I do not see any mention of o-ring anywhere in it for the AC system. I'm taking a guess here and thinking they just used a specific type of fitting back in 1960 instead of o-rings like today. If anyone has taken apart or fixed their system and knows of what else I need to replace or change, part numbers, o-ring or seal sizes that would be great. Any tips would be much appreciated! Thank you

James Dodd Jr.
James Dodd Jr.

TJ Hopland

Disconnected and open?   Meaning some component was missing so there was literally an open hose or port?

What do you know about the AC systems history?   Why was it 'open'?  When did it last work?   

I have not worked on many systems that old were these ones were the compressor had its own oil so other than leakage there isn't oil in the rest of the system?     
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

76eldo

It's a very complex system.
You can use modern O rings but I'd get it checked out and possibly charged with nitrogen as a test before I would  sacrifice that R-12.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

Tahoelover2002

Yes, the compressor was removed and the hoses were just left hanging in the engine compartment. So the entire system was and has been open for over a year to my knowledge possibly more (which I wouldn't doubt). I have no clue the history of when it last work or why it was open. All I know it that the compressor was removed for some reason and never put back on. All the components are there, I just need to attach the compressor back onto the bracket and run a belt. However as Brian stated I absolutely do not want to just trow a new drier on there and charge it up. I wanted to see what should be inspected and/or replace before I go ahead and do that.

As for the O-rings, do you know for a fact they did use o-rings? I have no clue if they did or didn't. nor the sizes I would need.
James Dodd Jr.

76eldo

There are O rings on every hose connection.  If you buy a selection on one of those little plastic boxes you will have what you need.

I doubt that anyone would remove the compressor unless it was faulty.  It should probably be checked out by a shop that specializes in AC work.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

Scot Minesinger

The O rings should be no problem, buy a selection of sizes and you should be OK.  If not on line will be OK.  The green ones should work fine, and there is an O-ring at every connection -replace them all, lubricating each with refrigeration oil.  Probably be a great idea to replace the rubber hose sections to re-using and restoring the metal ends (Classic Auto Air or Cold Air products if not a local place).  Anything rubber should be replaced.  then also clean out system real good with solvent/solution and compressed air per instructions of solvent manufacturer.

If you do not have the means to recover R12 in the event of a leak, definitely a good idea to charge with another gas to be sure of no leaks at compressor seals, expansion valve and other potential leaks.  If the original components work and test OK, I would use them, except for anything rubber.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

n2caddies

I would bet that if it had been disconnected something more than the drier was not working. At the very least I would remove the compressor per the directions in the service manual and check the oil level. If it is empty good chance it is shot. You could send it off to old air products in Texas for a rebuild if its the original A5 or purchase a new A6. Carefully inspect all the hoses and connections there should be O rings at the connections that should be lubricated with mineral oil if using R12. Suspect hoses or connectors should be replaced. Contamination  in the sustem is the kiss of death for the compressor. Before I wasted the R12 find somebody that can charge the system with nitrogen and check the joints with soapy water or a sniffer for leaks. Very important to evacuate the system first and make sure again there is the proper amount of oil in the system. The hot gas bypass which is on your inner fender or compressor is likely to need to be rebuilt which is pretty straight forward and the kits are available from old air products and others on line.
Randy
Randy George CLC# 26143
1959 Series 62 Convertible
1960 Series 62 Convertible
1964 Deville Convertible
2015 SRX

Tahoelover2002

Thank you all for your replies and help with this so far. My next question for everyone is to see if anyone knows how to tell the difference between an A5 compressor and an A6 compressor for this 1960 Cadillac. I've attached some pictures of my compressor, as well as the model number stamped onto the body....luckily the Hot Gas Bypass valve was intact and attached to the compressor. If anyone knows of tell tail differences between these two compressors and can take a look at my pictures and tell me, that would be awesome. I am having a difficult time trying to figure out what mine is, thanks!
James Dodd Jr.

n2caddies

That's the original A5 compressor.
Randy
Randy George CLC# 26143
1959 Series 62 Convertible
1960 Series 62 Convertible
1964 Deville Convertible
2015 SRX

n2caddies

Randy George CLC# 26143
1959 Series 62 Convertible
1960 Series 62 Convertible
1964 Deville Convertible
2015 SRX

Tahoelover2002

Does anyone know of someone that rebuilds these original A5 compressors? Or is the A5 not rebuild-able at all and I need to buy this new A6? Or for that matter I don't even know if something it wrong with mine. The clutch engages when I shoot it 12volts so the clutch is good but internally I have no idea. Does anyone know of someone who could test mine? I would prefer to keep the original compressor at all costs. Thanks
James Dodd Jr.

J. Gomez

James,

From the picture on your earlier post that one is an A5 Frigidaire seal type, the only serviceable items on these are the clutch, pulley bearing, seals, gaskets, “O” ring and coil, the inside parts are all sealed.

Placing a +12V at the solenoid coil and having the clutch engage just isolates the coil.

Does the shaft turns with engine on and the +12V at the coil?

Two A/C places which others can chime in who may had done business with are;

http://www.oldairproducts.com/

And
http://www.classicautoair.com/

Good luck..!
J. Gomez
CLC #23082

35-709

#12
Those are the only ones I have heard of, both have good reputations.  Make sure that system is properly flushed and clean.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold - but still in the family
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod - Sold
1942 Cadillac 6269 - Sold
1968 Pontiac Bonneville Convertible - Sold
1950 Packard 2dr. Club Sedan
1935 Glenn Pray - Auburn Boattail Speedster, Gen. 2

Tahoelover2002

I have a call into a few places too see if I can get the compressor rebuilt. I have removed the EVAP and condenser to send them out to get pressure tested, fixed if needed and flushed/cleaned. However I have a few questions in regards to the EVAP. I was told to check the plate on the EVAP box for the serial number or build date to see if mine was a early or late model. I have attached pictures of the EVAP plate as well as the engine serial (I was told that it could also be told be the engine s/n as well). Also I plan on replacing all the hoses in the system (just as an added precaution) but it looks like three of the lines that come off the EVAP (the fourth being removable on the expansion valve) do not look like they can be removed and replaced. I saw that http://www.oldairproducts.com/ has new EVAPs that come with three hoses attached to them already. Should I not bother having the original EVAP cleaned out since the hoses can't be replaced and just buy a new assembly? Or is there a way for the original three hoses to be removed and replaced with new so I can keep the original EVAP with the car. Thank you to everyone who has helped thus far. It is much appreciated!
James Dodd Jr.

Dan LeBlanc

If you're going that deep into the system, the extra $ to spend for a new evaporator may well be worth it.  One less item to have to worry about.  New hoses are a good idea also.
Dan LeBlanc
1977 Lincoln Continental Town Car

Tahoelover2002

Okay so I take it the hoses cannot be removed from the original EVAP? Also can anyone tell me how to decipher these numbers on the EVAP plate to tell me if mine is a late or early model? Thank you!
James Dodd Jr.

n2caddies

If ordering a new evaporator I believe the hose lengths are slightly different depending on if your hot gas bypass is on the compressor or on the inner fender. In my town there is a hydraulic shop that works on equipment like forklift rams and such and they had all the crimping tools for making the AC hoses for me from my samples. There were also able to cut off the old hose tube connector and weld a new piece on enabling the new hose to be attached to the evaporator and elsewhere as needed. They had the correct hose in stock as well or you can get that from old air products in Texas if you can locate a local shop.
Randy
Randy George CLC# 26143
1959 Series 62 Convertible
1960 Series 62 Convertible
1964 Deville Convertible
2015 SRX