Cost for recharging an electric car?

[mgrab]

The only crash data I ever needed to read happened in 2019 when a physician in Florida crashed his Tesla into a tree causing an electrical fire.  Seems this disabled the high-tech doors and he burned to death in it while onlookers watched unable to get him out.  After reading that I don't think you'd get me to go for a ride in one.. let alone own one.  Not until I see footage of big rigs plowing into them and folks walking away....

[asavage]

Ugh.  Yes, Teslas roll down the window slightly before unlatching the door, but there's a conventional mechanical latch release so even if the car's 12v power is out, the door can be opened (though some window trim can be damaged that way).

From the outside, no the door will not open if the door is locked . . . just like every other car that doesn't have a functioning 12v power system that crashes.  In those cases, the glass has to be broken in order to open the door, again just like conventional cars.

[Big Apple Caddy]

No doubt there are other sides who would argue I should not be entitled to deduct "exploratory" costs associated with mining for inventory either. Doesn't mean they're right nor does it pass the logic test. Nobody calls it a "subsidy" when a business doesn't pay sales tax on property acquired that is be resold yet the same consideration if applied to an oil producer gets called a subsidy.

I can't speak for every single aspect where the subsidy epithet is applied to the petroleum industry but the Forbes article outlines the major ones which anyone who's taken Accounting 101 would not call it a subsidy.

Subsidies are typically considered any financial benefit a company or industry receives that are meant to be used to help them and their product or service be more competitive in the marketplace.  These can come in the form of direct cash payments, low interest loans, tax breaks, etc.  Some subsidies are directed more to the company/industry while others are directed more to the consumer although all are designed to help encourage use/purchase of particular products or services.

[asavage]

Charging: on-the-road charging (at anything other than a privately-owned Tesla Supercharging station) is much more expensive than charging at home.  Often three times as expensive.  But!  For people like me who charge at home -- in my driveway for my RAV4 EV, in the garage for our Model 3 -- every time we get in our cars, the "gas tank" is full, and its rare that we charge either vehicle anywhere but home.

On trips, we take the Tesla, and stop for 30 minutes at a SC station, grab a bite to eat, use the restroom, and have 200 miles of fast charging done in half an hour.  Not an inconvenience.

For those that aren't familiar with the tech: At-home charging is always feeding AC from your house to the car, which is changed to DC by the car's onboard charger (OBC) and also boosted to a higher voltage, typically ~400VDC.  This is "Level 1" (120VAC) or "Level 2" (240VAC) charging. 

My RAV4 EV has a higher capacity OBC than most, and can pull 40 amps @ 240v for a L2 charge rate of ~10kw, which equates to around 25 MPH charge rate.

Our Model 3 similarly can draw up to 48A @ 240VAC (~12kw) but because it's more efficient than my RAV4 EV (goes further on a gallon of electrons), it charges at 44 MPH.  At home.

"Level 3" is DC Fast Charging (DCFC).  L3 is different than home charging, as the conversion from AC to DC, and the boost to ~400VDC, is done by the charging station, and HV DC is fed to the car; the OBC is not used.  DCFC/L3, because it's already at the higher battery pack voltage, can feed a lot more energy to the pack, faster, than home charging.  A lot faster, and it's typically the way you'll charge your BEV when on a longer trip.

But when you get to your destination or hotel, you'll plug in to the L2 charge station there.

[Big Apple Caddy]

Has anyone seen crash test data on the ev’s. How do the battery’s do in a crash? Do they crush the occupants? Do they explode? Do they leak nasty stuff?

I am not aware of any overly concerning crash safety issues with EVs.  They've generally gotten pretty good crash test ratings but results can vary among cars/manufacturers just like with ICE vehicles.

The only way I see viable for long distance travel it to have replaceable battery’s. You would pull to a station and switch out battery’s in 5 min. I don’t see any company in the US working on this. You would to have standard size battery packs. Small cars would take 1 big cars and trucks 2,3,4 etc.

Fully electric (BEV) car battery packs are rather large and heavy and not something easily swapped out on the fly.  It will be interesting to see how battery charging (speed) technology advances in the coming years.

[TJ Hopland]

A new innovation in battery size vs capacity or a more efficient drive line so you didn't need the capacity would make it a lot easier to come up with some sort of a standard pack that could work with cars.   

I think with current technology like the 'DC fast chargers' the limitation is heat.   Right now I believe when charging at the higher rates you have active cooling of the pack going on.  I would imagine you could increase the cooling but that is more weight and equipment on the car not to mention energy needed to operate the system that isn't going into charging.   Maybe at some point the cooling will be part of the charging station?     But that sounds complex and expensive and a swap seems like a better direction to invest research in because if you can swap then the speed of charge is less of a factor. 

Anyone with a 'turbo' charge option on their phones knows about heat.   Its amazing how hot they get and you sure would think that can't be easy on anything involved in the process.   Even regular charging on a phone or laptop/tablet creates a decent amount of heat and the levels there are not even close to the mid and fast charging on cars is. 

Just for reference for those that don't know much about electric cars when the Tesla Model S came out laptops at the time used the same batteries, the 18650.   A typical laptop had 6 cells,  the model S had a little over 7,000.   Laptops to make them smaller went to flat packs which also is what many other cars are using except bigger of course.     The 18650 refers to the physical size of the cell,  18mm diameter and 65mm tall.    An AA battery is about 14x50.   A C cell is same height but 26mm diameter.   Full size cordless power  tools I think all use 18650's.     

[MaR]

The only crash data I ever needed to read happened in 2019 when a physician in Florida crashed his Tesla into a tree causing an electrical fire.  Seems this disabled the high-tech doors and he burned to death in it while onlookers watched unable to get him out.  After reading that I don't think you'd get me to go for a ride in one.. let alone own one.  Not until I see footage of big rigs plowing into them and folks walking away....

That crash was not as you describe it. The crash you are referring to happened when the teenaged children of the owner crashed the car at over 100 MPH into a tree and then it caught fire.

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

Subsidies are typically considered any financial benefit a company or industry receives that are meant to be used to help them and their product or service be more competitive in the marketplace.  These can come in the form of direct cash payments, low interest loans, tax breaks, etc.  Some subsidies are directed more to the company/industry while others are directed more to the consumer although all are designed to help encourage use/purchase of particular products or services.

From the cited article:

According to Dictionary.com subsidy can be defined four ways:

1. a direct pecuniary aid furnished by a government to a private industrial undertaking, a charity organization, or the like.
2. a sum paid, often in accordance with a treaty, by one government to another to secure some service in return.
3. a grant or contribution of money.
4. money formerly granted by the English Parliament to the crown for special needs.

The definition does not claim that a subsidy is defined as not paying a certain amount in taxes.

[mgrab]

That crash was not as you describe it. The crash you are referring to happened when the teenaged children of the owner crashed the car at over 100 MPH into a tree and then it caught fire.

Dr Omar Awan... whoever wishes can look it up.  Multiple news outlets covered.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

G'day all,

I realise that many Members have brought into the discussion of the cost to recharge an Electric Vehicle, but remember that this is a Cadillac and LaSalle Message Board, and there is not much point in discussing the subject until Cadillac Actually produce an Electric Vehicle for sale to the public.   

Talking about other well-known brands and their feature and faults should be discussed in their own Forums.

Therefore this thread has been locked.

Trust you understand.

Bruce.