Moderate engine vibration. Flywheel issues?

[Bill Podany #19567]

I have used Damper Doctor to replace the harmonic ballancer for my 55 Eldorado; high quality workmanship.

Bill Podany
Knoxville, TN

[Guidematic]

First, fix what you see broke. The additional work required to remove the cover is not all that simple. It all depends on what you want to get into. Often the "while you're in there" approach can snowball into a big project.

Depending on the mileage of the engine, and the service history, you will have to determine if you want to do this. Most all of the time, these old cars have zero for documented service history, so you'll have to go on your own whims.

Often, the Cadillac engines have the balancer bolted to the hub on the front of the crank, and can be removed without removing the hub. I'm not sure how the 429's are, but the 472/500 and the 4.x series engines are all that way.

Mike

[Chris McBride]

If you do need the flex-plate/flywheel, you WILL discover used ones in good condition are extremely hard to find for that year and model.  

I once noticed a vendor with an after-market product and bookmarked it for future reference; see

http://cad500parts.com/catalog/page031.htm

I haven't used that product and have no opinion on it and am simply forwarding the information.

Also, you can use the search function on the forum for info re: removing the harmonic balancer.  While not technically difficult, it's not a fun nor quick project.  Your decision to do it yourself will probably depend on the time, tools, and patience you have available.  It does require several hours of labor which promote back aches.

I did use the Damper Doctor and was also quite satisfied with his work.  

http://www.damperdoctor.com/

HTH and good luck!

[jim thomas]

   terry  g I don't thank that the starter was the cause of the vibration,   didn''t notice  any difference in the vibration after the starter was fix'ed, did you?       I thnk you are on to something  with the harmonic bal.  Be sure that the iinnner steel piece line  up with the outter  piece. mark it with a file. jim

[Hans1965]

Hello everybody,
I am pretty new to this forum. I have bought a 1956 Coupe de Ville a few months ago here in Germany in white and sonic blue. It has the Eldorado set up, which means two four barrel carburetors and 305 hp and this fantastic golden triangle air cleaner.

What a wonderful car! I enjoyed every second of driving it. The power and the elegance of this car, just magnificent. I get so many thumbs up here, it is huge fun and I used it as a daily driver in sunny Germany!

But, now I observed the first problem. The ballancer is shaking like crazy at low revs and I purchased a "new" one. My garage took of the old one from the crank shaft and realized that it was damaged due to the fact that there was no distancer between the ballancer and the engine, so it rubbed on the engine directly. I have not seen it, I was just told. So my garage tried to find such a thing to put in between the engine and the ballancer but with no success.

Could someone here explain me if there is such a thing usually on the crankshaft to give a bit of distance between engine and ballancer? If this is missing on my car, how is the part called, where could I purchase it or is my garage doing something wrong here?

I hope I could make myself understandable.
Any kind of hint is highly appreciated.

Thanks so much in advance.

Best regards,

Hans Henniges
Cologne, Germany

[carguyblack]

I'll add my bit of confusion to the mix. When I was experiencing bad vibration, I went through engine mounts, trans mounts, wheel bearings, rear end - besides the things already mentioned in this post. What ended up being the biggest culprit was my drive shaft tube. It was deemed warped or out of balance too bad to correct so I had it replaced with a new tube and re-balanced. Took care of the problem. Again, this was on a 56 so your 64 is a different bird, I know. Might be something to check?
Chuck

[Scot Minesinger]

Walt's post was short but right where I would check first too.

Consult the shop manual, it has a section on dealing with vibration, especially engine and isolating and identifying the cause.  I had a vibration in a 74 Caddy and it was a bent ps pulley, a vibration in a 75 Caddy turned out to be the fan clutch (no wonder the water pump failed earlier, replaced by previous owner).  Vibration on another was motor mounts, and on anther bad rear trans mount.  I think since a wobbling ps pump caused vibration so can a wobbling flex plate(or whatever you call the device with teeth that the starter engages).  Of course the starter is going to have issues if the flex plate is wobbling.

The cracked intake manifold is often caused by a closed heat riser on the passenger side of the Y pipe exhaust.  Check to make sure it is open (I would secure it so it never closes).

The drive shaft I think is a two piece 59-64 to get the car lower.  This can also be a cause of the problem as Chuck writes and easy to isolate as per shop manual (probably just put the car in neutral and race engine - if vibration is gone you know it is not the engine). 

Go thru the shop manual procedures, start with the basics.  Much of this testing can be done with little effort and very simple tools.

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

Hans,
The part you are looking for is called a shim.
Greg Surfas

[Hans1965]

Hi Greg, thanks for the answer.  Any idea where I could get such a thing. I just googled this for an hour and looked for a part number but I cannot find anything.

Thanks a lot!

Hans

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

What I would do is measure the distance the damper needs to move (be sure and check to make sure the pulleys line up correctly), and then make a shim out of sheet metal of the correct thickness.
Greg Surfas

[Roger Zimmermann]

Hans, have a look at the attached drawing. There is a spacer (Group 8.1544) between the crankshaft and the sprocket. Maybe this spacer is missing on your engine. I restored all my Cad engines, but I don't remember that there was a spacer there...Anyway, it's listed in the parts book.

[Hans1965]

Hi Roger, thanks a lot! I have forwarded your picture to my garage,  but my mechanic told me the engine does not really look like this. - I contacted a few parts provider in the US and someone let me know that in his opinion there is no spacer where we assumed one.

Now my confusion is at its peak.

Thanks a lot for sending me the picture! Highly appreciate that.

Best,
Hans

[Roger Zimmermann]

It may be possible that the engine was replaced by another one from a different vintage. Do a picture or two, it will help us and you!

[Hans1965]

Hi all, I do not have a single picture of the engine bay, but this pdf file. The engine is numbers matching. - The new balancer that I provided to the garage was put on by them but unfortunately destroyed in just a couple of seconds. A spacer is absolutely needed. Really strange story.

Thanks everybody for suggestions, hints whatsoever.
best,  Hans 

[Roger Zimmermann]

At first glance you have the correct period engine.
By looking in the shop manual, page 8-2, it seems that there is a spacer between the sprocket and crankshaft, like you can see on the page I attached yesterday (or the day before). Take a steel tube and let machine a spacer! How to get the thickness? Easy: put a rule on the sprocket from the camshaft and measure at the small sprocket the distance needed to have it exactly in line with the large sprocket.