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Author Topic: What the heck is going on now?  (Read 1132 times)

Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
What the heck is going on now?
« on: June 01, 2016, 03:05:16 PM »
Now where do I begin to resolve this problem?
Started with the starter not engaging fully a few times, then all was fine with the starter. Started the car and drove it to my friends house. Would not start when time to leave - I mean all gauges were responding when I turned on the key but nothing happens now when I press the starter button. Had to kick start the engine every time I had to start the car - rolling down the hill for just a revolution or so and the car starts right up. Now, went out this morning and the battery is absolutely dead -can hardly turn over the electric fuel pump. I can find nothing that was left on over night.

Stuck solenoid, bad regulator, bad starter button, bad key ignition, loose wire somewhere - what?
Ty Stinson
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline Jon S

  • Posts: 2559
  • Name: J. Schapiro
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2016, 03:09:07 PM »
For starters, I would check my battery connections.  Take each one off and clean well and vasoline.  Could also be a bad generator, but I would start at the battery.
Jon

1958 Cadillac Sedan De Ville
1973 Lincoln Continental Coupe
1981 Corvette
2004 Mustang GT

Offline Steve Passmore

  • Posts: 5768
  • Name: Steve Passmore - Sadly Deceased
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2016, 03:30:31 PM »
Do you have a 'Master Battery switch' Ty?   These have been known to fail allowing only a small amount of power through but not enough for the starter.        It could also be the battery or the generator failing.   Car would easily start with a jump because whats left in the battery only has to power the coil.  If its the battery failing the generator will run the coil once running.
 Your drive home could have finished the battery off.  You need to do a votage check on the battery to be sure whats happening.
If it is flat I would disconnect and charge it then check the voltage next day.  If it holds and  starts the car OK then check what the ammeter is saying when its running. If it shows a discharge its either the generator or regulator.
 If it keeps its charge but will still not start the car then look to all the connections from starter up to ignition and back to solenoid and relay.  Bet its something simple.
Steve

Present
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1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
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Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2016, 05:32:18 PM »
Okay, thanks guys. I will try all your suggestions.
Thanks,
Ty Stinson
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline Glen

  • Posts: 2789
  • CLC Number: 727
  • Name: Glen Houlton
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2016, 02:23:04 AM »
Check the easy things first, but I think you will find something stuck in the starter/solenoid.  Main clues, nothing happens when the starter button is pressed and battery ran down. 
Glen Houlton CLC #727 
CLCMRC benefactor #104

Online TJ Hopland

  • Posts: 10188
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2016, 10:01:48 AM »
So this has a low current starter switch and solenoid?   Is the solenoid on the starter or in a remote location?

I too have seen a lot of issues with those battery disconnect switches.  An old one could be worn out by now (especially if its on a 6v system) and the new ones just don't seem to be built worth a darn.   

I was just dealing with a tractor that had something stuck in the regulator that was drawing down battery power.   I didn't try to take it apart to see if it could be fixed yet, its got rivets in the case which makes me think its likely a more recent solid state unit rather than an original mechanical one.  We just disconnected it and charged the battery and are getting by like that for now. 
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

Offline Bill Ingler #7799

  • Posts: 1651
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2016, 10:08:24 AM »
My bet is a bad battery. How old is the battery Ty?   Bill

Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2016, 12:07:21 PM »
Okay, I have charged the battery overnight (an new battery as of last year). I think I did leave the dash lights switch turned on some over night when we drove it home the night before. Had some previous starter grind noise a few times but that had cleared up. Started the car several times before washing the car. Went to start the car and there was no sound when pushing the starter button. Roiled the car down the driveway a few feet and let out the clutch and the engine starts immediately when ever I need to start the car.

So, I will clean the battery terminals and hook up the battery. Thinking I may have a bad generator as the halogin head light bulbs will dim when driving a little while and the solenoid may be bad but need to know how to check them both.
Ty
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2016, 01:38:27 PM »
I charged the battery overnight and just cleaned the battery contacts as you suggested. Well, the lights are bright and the starter works just fine now.

The problem then may be the generator. Reason: the generator gauge was always pegged to the right when driving the car. Today, (having a fully charged battery) the needle is just barely off center when running. When I turn on the lights the needle moves various positions as I turn on different lights. So, it appears that the generator is not working because it never goes to the right of center now, but I have not driven the car - just ran it for a few minutes.

Some one had told me that I could remove the "S" wire from the generator to see if it was functioning correctly and that if not it could be the relay. However, I don't remember the procedure.
Ty
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline 76eldo

  • Posts: 6651
  • CLC Number: 22443
  • Name: Brian Rachlin
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2016, 02:22:05 PM »
If you check the standing battery voltage with the car not running and then check it again with the car running the voltage should be higher when it's running.

Charging problems can be cables and connections, regulator, battery or generator.

Brian
Brian Rachlin
Huntingdon Valley, Pa
CLC # 22443
I prefer email's not PM's rachlin@comcast.net

1960 62 Series Conv with Factory Tri Power
1970 DeVille Conv
1970 Eldo
1970 Caribu (?) "The Cadmino"
1973 Eldorado Conv Pace Car
1976 Eldorado Conv
1980 Eldorado H & E Conv
1993 Allante with Hardtop (X2)
2008 DTS
2012 CTS Coupe
2017 XT
1956 Thunderbird
1966 Olds Toronado

Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2016, 03:35:35 PM »
Can I check the battery as you suggest with gaiter clips in place, and the battery charger not plugged in, or do I need a dedicated meter?
Ty
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline Steve Passmore

  • Posts: 5768
  • Name: Steve Passmore - Sadly Deceased
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2016, 03:53:20 PM »
If you have a fully charged battery Ty the needle on the ammeter should not move to the right.   If you put the headlights on the needle should discharge, then with some revs it should move back to centre. If it does this then the generator is charging or it would stay on discharge all the time.   It will only go to the right if battery power is low.   Halogen bulbs will put huge pressure on a 6 volts system. I used to have them on mine and removed them as the engine had to be reving high to compensate.
My guess is you had a low battery and poor connections and havnt done enough miles to recharge the battery.
Steve

Present
1937 60 convertible coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe
1941 62 coupe

Previous
1936 70 Sport coupe
1937 85 series V12 sedan
1938 60 coupe
1938 50 coupe
1939 60S
1940 62 coupe
1941 62 convertible coupe x2
1941 61 coupe
1941 61 sedan x2
1941 62 sedan x2
1947 62 sedan
1959 62 coupe

Offline Stinson

  • Posts: 872
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2016, 04:11:46 PM »
Thanks Steve. I will take the car for a spin and see how it does with the lights on.
Many thanks,
Ty
Ty Stinson
'37 Cad 8519 Touring Sedan V12
CLC22330

Offline Tye_Cowan

  • CLC Member #29469
  • Posts: 62
  • Name: Tye Cowan
Re: What the heck is going on now?
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2016, 04:35:15 PM »
Lead/Acid batteries nominally produce 2.1V per cell, so your 6V battery should read ~6.3V on a volt meter with the engine off, and more with the engine running.

If you've been noticing lower and lower starter performance over time, it may be time for new starter brushes.  If you do open up the starter, make sure all the field windings are insulated from the case too.

Good luck.

Tye Cowan
Tye Cowan
1953 Series 75

 

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