Electric fuel pump in a 1962 390...

[Edward Kenny]

I have 4 questions about the possible installation of an electric fuel pump in my 1962 CDV:

1) What kind of electric fuel pump is recommended in this case?
2) Is it difficult to install so that it becomes the main operating pump?
3) Can it be hooked up to the ignition switch so that when the key is turned, the pump starts before engaging the starter to turn the engine?
4) Here's the tricky question: Does the original fuel pump need to be retrofitted (perhaps by gutting it and inserting a bypass hose inside it) to let the fuel go through it while not affecting the "original" look of the fuel system in the engine?

Thanks in advance for the due diligence.

[Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373]

Why are you wanting to install an electric pump?
Jeff

[Dan LeBlanc]

I've had a few 61/62 cars and all have run flawlessly on the mechanical pumps. My current 61 had an electric pump installed  (instead of doing the 20 minute job to replace the failing original. First thing I did was ditch the electric and replace it with an original.

[Edward Kenny]

Earlier today, I was driving my CDV when suddenly I lost power while driving down the highway. After I drove off the highway and got the car restarted, it ran VERY roughly and would not hold an idle unless I revved the engine while in neutral. The engine continued to run roughly when I tried to start it a few hours later, which eliminated the possibility of a vapor lock while on the highway. Thus, I can only believe that the recently installed fuel pump is now defective.

[Scot Minesinger]

I could not agree more than an electric fuel pump is not the way to go.  They can be dangerous, and the cars run well on the mechanical pumps.  There is an old saying in the carbureted car owners "90% of our fuel/carb problems are electric".  It could be your filter, bad gas, dirt inside tank, fuel lines, coil, and etc. beside just fuel pump.  It could be fuel pump and then it should just be replaced. 

The fuel pump cannot be just ignition interlocked because then someone will turn the ignition on to lower the windows.  It could be ignition with time delay (say 10 seconds max) and then in parallel with oil press switch so it would only run during initial start up and when car is running.  The original pump would be removed. It would need to be near tank, as these are much better pushers than suckers.  Again, highly recommend you do not do it.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

The only reason I run an electric pump is that my cars sometimes stand for a long time, and the capability of priming the system in place of cranking for what seems like hours on end, saves the engine internals, especially the bearings, etc.

I had a pulse pump on my '60 CDV, and had that car for over 20 years, both with a 454 and then the 390, and never had a problem.

I am going to fit an electric pump to my '72, to reroute the fuel line away from the front of the engine to keep the fuel temperature down.   I am running a Predator Carby, and I want cleaner fuel than the filter in the pump can deliver.

Bruce.

[n2caddies]

Somewhat related to this thread I learned a trick from Cadillac Ken regarding these mechanical fuel pumps. Before you replace one that you think is bad take out the 4 screws on the top of the pump body open it up and look down inside and chances are one of the diaphragms has popped out of its seat. Put it back in the seat and peen the edges with a hammer and screw driver to lock into place and the pump will work. After he told me about this I opened two boxes of "defective " pumps I was saving for cores to rebuild and they both had that condition. Just to pass along a very good tip that may save a tow home from an outing.
Randy   

[Glen]

There are a number of horror stories about electric fuel pumps.  But the fact my father put one on his 38 series 7519 and drove it thousands of miles with no problems.  He installed it to stop vapor lock, and he hooked it up to the ignition, so it ran all the time. 
The most important is to be sure the pump output pressure is not too high for the carb.  If it is it will over power the float valve and flood the engine. 
The mechanical pump has check valves that will open when the electric pump is running so there is no need for any bypass plumbing.           
To me the only reason for putting in an electric pump is to prime the mechanical pump and the carb after the car has been sitting for a long time.   

[Dan LeBlanc]

Randy is spot on the money about taking the top off.  The two diaphragms he's referring to look like metal discs.  You'll probably find one floating around in the pump.  Put it back in, peen it like he said, and you should be good to go again.

[russ austin]

White knights aplenty in here.  The question was about electric pumps, not should I run one.

I have been running electric pumps for years on both of my 63's.  Pump; Carter P60430  This pump is used with a non return line system, and is self regulating to 5-6 psi (I think, memory thing here)

Fuel Pump safety Switch; must be used for safety. Order through Revolution Electronics, P.N. 12003
The switch is wired to the coil, and senses RPM's.  On initial start, a timed relay operates the pump for about 3 seconds before shutting off the pump, if it doesn't sense RPM's.

I gutted the fuel pumps to retain the stock look, and they work great.  The electric pumps NEEDS to be mounted as close to the gas tank as possible. These are pusher pumps, not puller pumps. You will burn out the pump if it has to pull fuel from a distance.  Easy to wire up.

[TJ Hopland]

I like that controller.  Its in a neater package than doing the oil pressure version and has the prime feature.

Here is a link to their site.  They have some vendors and apparently an ebay and amazon store. 

http://www.revolutionelectronics.com/Fuel_Pump.html

[Edward Kenny]

Attached find the exploded diagram from the shop manual of a 1962 390 fuel pump for 1962. Am I under the impression that the diaphragms need to be re-seated or is it the inlet and outlet valves that do?

Thanks in advance for the due diligence.

[Dan LeBlanc]

It is the inlet and outlet valves.

[Edward Kenny]

This is why you guys are the BEST. This morning I removed the 4 screws that held the fuel pump lid in place, removed the top rubber diaphragm, and found that the check valve that sits closest to the front of the car was unseated just as Randy and Dan said it might be!! I preened the valve back into place and now I hope it will stay there (I think it will).
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THAT TIP GUYS!

In opening the lid, I found 2 tears (rips) in the diaphragm that sits directly underneath. See the attached photos. Will these rips present a problem on the road in the future? If so, is a new diaphragm by itself easy to come by?

Thanks again for everything.

[russ austin]

The rubber diaphragm is the vacuum and push that moves the fuel. If you go with the electric pump, and decide to gut the mechanical pump, I recommend making a  metal backing plate that goes behind the rubber diaphragm. If the rubber diaphragm splits (yours did), fuel will be pushed into the crank case.

[Bigvx5]

White knights aplenty in here.  The question was about electric pumps, not should I run one.

I have been running electric pumps for years on both of my 63's.  Pump; Carter P60430  This pump is used with a non return line system, and is self regulating to 5-6 psi (I think, memory thing here)

Fuel Pump safety Switch; must be used for safety. Order through Revolution Electronics, P.N. 12003
The switch is wired to the coil, and senses RPM's.  On initial start, a timed relay operates the pump for about 3 seconds before shutting off the pump, if it doesn't sense RPM's.

I gutted the fuel pumps to retain the stock look, and they work great.  The electric pumps NEEDS to be mounted as close to the gas tank as possible. These are pusher pumps, not puller pumps. You will burn out the pump if it has to pull fuel from a distance.  Easy to wire up.

.   I realize this is an old post but I have a question about the Carter pump..where the heck did you mount this thing?my car is a 61 Park Ave that’s lowered(really low) and has duals..I can’t for the life of me figure out where to put this thing..only thing I’ve come yup with is on the inside of the frame,which will be away from exhaust and well well..any suggestions or pics of where you have yours mounted?thanks in advance Russ

[Dan LeBlanc]

My suggestion would be above the rear axle on the "floor" where it comes down from the trunk area to under the back seat.  Plenty of room there.

[Bigvx5]

Thanks Dan..I’ll check that out in a bit

[TJ Hopland]

Do these gas tanks have the flange around the middle where the 2 halves were put together?  If so that can be a good place to mount a fuel pump.    If not maybe there is some other place you can clamp on using a device called a beam clamp.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Superstrut-1-4-in-Strut-Beam-Clamp-Silver-Z500-25/100149960

[russ austin]

I mounted the pump on the wall where it comes up for the back seat, and transitions into the floor to the trunk.  Just above the upper control yolk.
I already had power in the trunk for the stereo amp, so that is where I drew power from.