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That time my friend ordered a new 96 fleetwood Brougham

Started by Tonyv_73, April 02, 2018, 12:20:59 AM

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Tonyv_73

Here’s a story for ya,

On October 11th 1995 my close friend, Phil, ordered a brand new Fleetwood Brougham, after he took delivery of the car he received a survey from cadillac asking about his experience receiving the car as well as statistics from him etc.  The treasurer of North Jersey Cadillac Club was at the time, a sales rep at the cadillac dealership where he bought the car, she asked him if he could fill out that survey. In the survey it had an optional comment space and he wrote “you finally build an automobile worthy of the name cadillac, and what happens? You discontinue it, outrageous”. a few weeks later he received a phone call from Detroit, the cadillac zone office.  They asked how he likes the car, he said he loved the car and was sad that it was discontinued. The person on the other line said “yeah about your comment” (phil clarified how he felt) and the person replied “well it was an economic decision, they sold more trucks then they did fleetwoods”
The Next Phone call came from  the cadillac office in Linden New Jersey, they also asked about his remark, in the conversation phil asked “what was the median age for this vehicle” and they replied “well let’s just say, you’re one of the youngest people who bought this car” (phil was 46 at the time)

Today Phil still has the car, it’s a 1996 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham in carmine red with black leather interior, a factory “Astro” sunroof, delivery package, and Full size spare tire

I should also note that when phil bought the car the dealership pushed for an aftermarket sunroof rather than factory because they made more money with the aftermarkets than the originals. 
1963 Series 62 Convertible
1965 Eldorado
1966 Calais Sedan
1970 Fleetwood Brougham
1970 Wildcat
1970 Coupe Deville
1973 Eldorado Convertible
1974 Coupe Deville
1976 Coupe Deville
1981 Eldorado Biarritz
1985 Eldorado Commemorative Edition
1991 Brougham
1993 Eldorado 4.9
1996 Fleetwood Brougham
2006 XLR
2006 DTS
2014 XTS

Ken Perry

 I cringe :-[ every time I see a truck with a Cadillac emblem on it ! A full size Cadillac Fleetwood is way better than a truck.Just to think, there are no Fleetwoods anymore and havn't been for a long time is Sad!!! I think they dropped the ball,,,BIG TIME ! It would be nice to see a rear wheel drive,V8,old school plush Fleetwood again,with some (Cadillac) only style !People are Bigger than ever,why can't we have a nice (BIG) car? We get a kick out of when someone pulls up in a Giant SUV,making our 60 Cadillac look small and says (look at the big car,Honey)!!! I know,,,,people want less and want to pay more, just ask the Corporations  >:D My 73 Chevy truck has a 49 Cadillac Goddess on the hood,a 76 Cad headlight knob and a Cad cigarett lighter,,,doesn't make it a Cadillac. Nice storie Tony,thanks for posting. I guess old people Money dosn't count,also funny,when I see a 93-96 Cadillac Fleetwood,they have a young person driving and they look like they dig their car 8)          Ken Perry   
Cadillac Ken

64\/54Cadillacking

Unfortunately from a business side of things, big cars just weren’t selling as well even back then. So Cadillac/GM did what was in their best financial interest by discontinuing the Fleetwoods.

It sucks, as Caddy enthusiasts, and it’s sad to know that there will never be a Fleetwood like these again.

At least we can hold on to history by still driving our classics.

Screw what the media and society thinks we should accept and buy. If you love your Caddy that much, drive it until the wheels fall off.

I sold my 94 Fleetwood Bro about a month ago, and there’s times where I do miss that car, it rode so smooth, was reliable and was a tank on the road, but it was time to let it go. I have too many cars now and the Fleetwood just sat most of the time.

Maybe someday in the future I’ll own another one. 8)
Currently Rides:
1964 Sedan Deville
1954 Cadillac Fleetwood 60 Special
1979 Lincoln Mark V Cartier Designer Series
2007 Lexus LS 460L (extended wheelbase edition)

Previous Rides:
1987 Brougham D' Elegance
1994 Fleetwood Bro
1972 Sedan Deville
1968 Coupe Deville
1961 Lincoln Continental
1993 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series
1978 Lincoln Continental ( R.I.P.) 1978-2024 😞

Scot Minesinger

Yes, I bought a 1995 Fleetwood, triple black used in March 1997 for 23k and it was perfect.  In 1998 I removed the vinyl top and painted the roof black to match and I got a lot of compliments.  I did not care for the top at all, and cost to remove and paint was $1,500, so worth it.  I was 36 at the time and my friends did say "Why did you buy an old person's car?"  I would floor when they were riding with me and that was the end of that.  Then some of my wife's mini van driving friends made a derogatory comment or two, and my reply was that "Federal Sates that people who drive mini vans are not permitted to criticize cars".

Amazing car, 25 mpg highway at 70mph with a/c on, seats 6, gobs of power (best part), and stunningly beautiful.  I was upset when it was discontinued, and so was the public, in 1999/2000 the car with say 80k miles was at peak value and people offered me 30k for it, which I turned down.  Drove the car until 2005 and it had 254k enjoyable trouble free miles on it (sold it for 3k).  Had to replace it because a ten year old car with a quarter million miles was not my idea of an ideal daily driver anymore.  Wish they still made them, there would be one in my driveway now.  Instead got a CVPI. 

But hey the CT6 is getting a V-8, so maybe....
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

jdemerson

A 2019 Cadillac CT6 Platinum Edition with the new V8 may turn out to be today's Fleetwood Brougham. It should be a magnificent car and I think it looks really great (the Escala styling) although opinions will differ. Some features of 2018 version:

20-way adjustable Extended Comfort driver and front passenger seats:
Includes 15 massage settings, 4-way power pneumatic lumbar, 4-way manual adjustable head restraints, Semi-Aniline full-leather surfaces with chevron perforated inserts

40/20/40 rear seat with outboard positions heated, ventilated, massaging, and reclining
Quad-zone climate control with dual control settings for front and rear passengers

Rear Seat Package:
Includes rear seat infotainment with dual 10-inch diagonal HD screens, tilting with Blu-Rayâ,,¢ capability, remote control, auxiliary input jack, HDMI input, dual USB† ports and 2 wireless dual channel headphones and noise control with engine sound enhancements


But in spite of all the pleas in recent years for the revival of a Cadillac like this one, I'll bet the the truck models will outsell it by a lot. Cadillac will respond to the market, and I fear that the market won't sustain a car like this no matter how outstanding it turns out to be.

John Emerson
1952 Cadillac Sedan 6219X
John Emerson
Middlebury, Vermont
CLC member #26790
1952 Series 6219X
http://bit.ly/21AGnvn

David King (kz78hy)

The CT6 mid cycle is fine car.  Check the LTA box as that is the engine code.
David
David King
CLC 22014  (life)
1958 Eldorado Brougham 615
1959 Eldorado Brougham 56- sold
1960 Eldorado Brougham 83- sold
1998 Deville d'Elegance
1955 Eldorado #277
1964 Studebaker Commander
2012 Volt
CLCMRC benefactor 197

Director and Founder, Eldorado Brougham Chapter
Past President, Motor City Region

Rare Parts brand suspension parts Retailer via Keep'em Running Automotive

64\/54Cadillacking

#6
The refreshed CT6 with that super powerful V8 under the hood could be the modern day Fleetwood, but the major difference between the old Fleetwood and a  CT6 is not only size, but seat comfort, interior room and one focusing mainly on tight handling, and a sporty ride vs the Fleetwoods which are all about comfort and a soft ride.

The Fleetwood seats were made for total comfort with a medium firm/soft padding and they were big seats too, while the CT6 seats are designed for more performance oriented driving. Plus the rear seats are still too hard for a Cadillac for customers to be truly comfortable  for long trips without getting a cramp in their legs or their back hurting.

Also nothing today honestly compares to a BOF Cadillac as far as riding comfort goes. Every unit-body car I’ve driven still transmits more road noise and small vibrations into the car than any of my big full size Cadillacs and Lincoln’s did.

The isolation one receives from driving one of these Fleewoods is amazing when all the suspension components are in good shape. Plus the heavy curb weight of the Fleetwoods makes these cars ride over the rough stuff with ease.

I know a lot of Caddy owners were upset when Cadillac stop making their big cars, so some of the problems lied with the lack of sales and on the other hand, the big wigs at Cadillac trying to lure in younger customers decided to abandon their older base for youth instead which hasn’t worked out so well for the brand in recent years.

So a lot of changes are made out of FORCE from the top “just because”. The executives at Cadillac probably wanted the Fleetwood dead since it gave the brand a stodgy image even if sales were brisk.

Cadillac abandoned their base years ago, and have been paying the price ever since, but let’s hope this a start in a new direction for the brand and that they better learn to compete with the best of the best luxury makes in the industry with the new V8 and a new halo vehicle in the near future to give them a leg up.
Currently Rides:
1964 Sedan Deville
1954 Cadillac Fleetwood 60 Special
1979 Lincoln Mark V Cartier Designer Series
2007 Lexus LS 460L (extended wheelbase edition)

Previous Rides:
1987 Brougham D' Elegance
1994 Fleetwood Bro
1972 Sedan Deville
1968 Coupe Deville
1961 Lincoln Continental
1993 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series
1978 Lincoln Continental ( R.I.P.) 1978-2024 😞

Big Apple Caddy

Customers simply weren't buying the very large sedans like they once did.  Sales for the first year Fleetwood (1993 model) were over 40% less than those of the Brougham from even just five years prior (1988 model) and sales only continued to decline from there.  The smaller DeVille sold MUCH better than the Fleetwood.

Maynard Krebs

Quote from: 64CaddieLacky on April 02, 2018, 06:18:00 AM
Maybe someday in the future I’ll own another one. 8)

.. Yeah.. good luck finding one that's NOT painted BLACK!!!   All that color does is show dust & dirt... and makes it HOT as hades inside!!   Who needs that?    For all the saints, WHY couldn't Cadillac have made a higher proportion of these RWD Fleetwoods [there is no other kind than RWD] in lighter colors??   I've seen precious few that were the beautiful "Adriatic blue", for example.   Besides, black is depressing... and it's impossible to keep 'em clean.

cadillacmike68

Quote from: Maynard Krebs on April 09, 2018, 06:40:31 PM
.. Yeah.. good luck finding one that's NOT painted BLACK!!!   All that color does is show dust & dirt... and makes it HOT as hades inside!!   Who needs that?    For all the saints, WHY couldn't Cadillac have made a higher proportion of these RWD Fleetwoods [there is no other kind than RWD] in lighter colors??   I've seen precious few that were the beautiful "Adriatic blue", for example.   Besides, black is depressing... and it's impossible to keep 'em clean.

Sorry, No. Most of us Like big black Fleetwoods. I had one, a 1995. Dark Adriatic Blue is a cvery nice color, plus it looks black at night.

As far a getting hot inside. I did some tests in FLORIDA where it is HOTTTTT using a digital thermo in the car. Even a moderate light green, blue or silver car will get to 140-150F inside. A black car, maybe a degree or two hotter. A BIG thing is a dark tint and cracking a window, but it still will climb to to 130-140F. Even a white car will get that hot. it's the sun going through the windows that does, it not hitting on the hood or trunk.

Now a dark car Paint WILL be hotter and if its not waxed it will suffer more than a light color paint, but that DOES NOT translate into hotter inside temps.

As far as the sad story of the discontinuation of the Fleetwood, Roadie and Caprice / Impala; not only was GM selling more trucks / suv, than these cars, they were MAKING A LOT MORE PROFIT ON THE TRUCKS PER UNIT SALE than the cars. That was the big bottom line.

Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

Maynard Krebs

#10
Vince... I know my eyes aren't perfect... but I dare say that said Fltwd B. in your photo.. is not Adriatic Blue.   It's some other shade of blue.. and obviously darker.

UPDATE:  Maybe I spoke out of ignorance; maybe Cad offered both a dark Adriatic blue and a light Adriatic blue.   The lighter version is MUCH better.

Maynard Krebs

#11
Quote from: cadillacmike68 on April 09, 2018, 11:56:22 PM
As far a getting hot inside. I did some tests in FLORIDA where it is HOTTTTT using a digital thermo in the car. Even a moderate light green, blue or silver car will get to 140-150F inside. A black car, maybe a degree or two hotter. A BIG thing is a dark tint and cracking a window, but it still will climb to to 130-140F. Even a white car will get that hot. it's the sun going through the windows that does, it not hitting on the hood or trunk.

Mr. Santos.... Admittedly, where I reside, in Southern New England, is a "world" of difference in sun strength compared to some parts of this nation.   However, it was my experience a few decades ago, that my wife's dark green car would get hot here on a cloudy day.   On the other hand, my beige car would only get warm on a sunny day.   IMO, there is NO comparison:  a dark-painted car WILL get hotter inside than a lighter-paint color car.   I've experienced it!

I'm not bothered in the least to be in the minority in terms of preferred paint colors for "formal" cars like (real) Fleetwoods.   I want RWD, long wheelbases and light colors..... and no substitutes, thank you.   Who wants to drive an 'oven' with tires on it?

Vince Taliano #13852

Vince Taliano
CLC Potomac Region
www.clcpotomacregion.org (view over 3,000 pictures!)

Maynard Krebs

Thanks for this, Vince.

Though I like the lighter version, there were a few other LIGHT colors available, I think... such as a beige / light brown.   But they're all scarce, it seems to me.

cadillacmike68

#14
Quote from: Maynard Krebs on April 11, 2018, 05:39:30 PM
Mr. Santos.... Admittedly, where I reside, in Southern New England, is a "world" of difference in sun strength compared to some parts of this nation.   However, it was my experience a few decades ago, that my wife's dark green car would get hot here on a cloudy day.   On the other hand, my beige car would only get warm on a sunny day.   IMO, there is NO comparison:  a dark-painted car WILL get hotter inside than a lighter-paint color car.   I've experienced it!

I'm not bothered in the least to be in the minority in terms of preferred paint colors for "formal" cars like (real) Fleetwoods.   I want RWD, long wheelbases and light colors..... and no substitutes, thank you.   Who wants to drive an 'oven' with tires on it?

Put the same digital thermo in each car on the same day and you will see for yourself. The cars need to be next to each other, getting the same sun. Put the thermo in the lighter car for an hour, look at at and transfer it to the darker car. Maybe a couple degrees hotter in the darker car, but 137 vs 140 - no discernible difference for me.


As for an oven... that's what Climate Control is for.
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

Maynard Krebs

No... that's what WINDOWS are for........ especially VENT windows.

Barry M Wheeler #2189

This thing is MUCH better looking than the ones with a vinyl roof. I didn't care for the way they made the break on the C pillar to separate the roof from the rest of the body. It didn't look "finished." Instead it was "just there." When I was selling Cadillacs, I think I only sold two of these in white to a repeat customer. I did have one "jerk" that wanted to drive one to be sure it would fit in his old one car garage. But it had to be in the color he "wanted." I don't think he ever did anything further than ask dumb questions about the car. I've never really been a fan of these as they were "too big" to suit me. But this one is certainly a gem.
Barry M. Wheeler #2189


1981 Cadillac Seville
1991 Cadillac Seville

cadillacmike68

Quote from: Maynard Krebs on April 15, 2018, 02:30:38 PM
No... that's what WINDOWS are for........ especially VENT windows.

Windows only for the first minute or so to blow out the hot 140 deg air and replace it with 95 deg air.

Then, windows up and climate control on AUTO.
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike

Scot Minesinger

Barry,

I could not agree more with you about the Fleetwoods looking way better with no vinyl roof.  My 1995 started life with a vinyl roof and after one year I had it removed and painted - got many compliments after it was removed. 

However, it was the right size for me, never liked a smaller car much.  The smallest car I own and drive in the last 35 years is a Crown Vic Police Interceptor.  The size and weight are a huge safety advantage.

Also on the subject of interior being hot, my black leather interior was fine.  Kept the climate control always on 72'F and drove the car, never changing the setting, lowering windows and the like - stayed that way for 8 years and a quarter million miles.  Sometimes the a/c came on when it was really sunny during winter at 45'F outside.  I had things to do, no time to be fussing with the climate control - enjoyed the luxury of just starting the car and have the climate control and lights come on as needed.

That was by far the best car I ever owned.
Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

cadillacmike68

Quote from: Scot Minesinger on April 16, 2018, 02:34:49 PM
Barry,

I could not agree more with you about the Fleetwoods looking way better with no vinyl roof.  My 1995 started life with a vinyl roof and after one year I had it removed and painted - got many compliments after it was removed. 

However, it was the right size for me, never liked a smaller car much.  The smallest car I own and drive in the last 35 years is a Crown Vic Police Interceptor.  The size and weight are a huge safety advantage.

Also on the subject of interior being hot, my black leather interior was fine.  Kept the climate control always on 72'F and drove the car, never changing the setting, lowering windows and the like - stayed that way for 8 years and a quarter million miles.  Sometimes the a/c came on when it was really sunny during winter at 45'F outside.  I had things to do, no time to be fussing with the climate control - enjoyed the luxury of just starting the car and have the climate control and lights come on as needed.

That was by far the best car I ever owned.

That's the way a Cadillac should be operated; Climate control on Auto (unless the top is down!) & Twilight Sentinel ON and sent for a medium delay so you can see where you are walking when you get out at night, Lastly,  Guidematic ON if so equipped.

I like mine between 72-75 depending on outside weather. It's a fine system even the vacuum controlled ones from the 60s (when its all working nicely).
Regards,
"Cadillac" Mike