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Grand National - less Cadillacs at show field - a developing trend?

Started by Scot Minesinger, June 18, 2018, 09:11:17 AM

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Scot Minesinger

There is no GN without Cadillacs and Lasalles on the show field.  That is the main reason I attend GN's.  Lately, I see less show cars:

At GN DC which I helped to run, we had over 300 cars, but space for 400 plus and in organizing the show, I was worried we would be turning away cars, but we dd not not.  In the NE in the DC, PA area it is center of population area, so I would expect to see cars all within a one day drive, which includes OH, PA, MA, down to Atlanta, GA, which certainly includes 500 plus classic cars.

At 20018 GN in TX, clearly the show field would have accommodated more then twice the number of cars that attended.

My rule on attending a GN with a car is that if it is within a day's drive (say ten hours or less) then I will drive my 1970 Cadillac.  So will be seeing you all in KY with my 1970 Cadillac.

In interviewing GN attendees that live within a day's drive I hear:

1.  The cost of gas...really, why even bother to own a classic Cadillac if gas cost is an issue.
2.  I don't want to drive on highway...really, these cars were engineered to  be amazing highway cruisers and this is least abusive type of driving, BTW drive with the flow assuring a safe distance, not 50mph in right lane - a sure way to make it miserable.
3.  I'm too old...understand that our club is aging, but this will keep you young.
4.  My Cadillac is not good enough spoke the man with a 1974 Eldorado convertible...I replied you have a 500 cubic inch engine and it is a convertible - that is the ultimate - bring the car.
5.  The judging?...just enter it for display only, that is what I do now.  I'm not going to stand there anymore and suffer thru the radial tire deduction, the hose clamps, and other "authentic mechanical items" criticisms that if executed render the car less roadworthy.
6.  I'm worried about a breakdown...the biggest insurance against that is to drive it on some longer trips now and get it roadworthy.  The 50 year old transmission that has never been sealed, the original hoses, belts, and many other obvious issues that should be addressed before a road trip need to be cured now and tested via long drives.  Also, consider driving in a caravan of sorts, that way if you suffer a breakdown, at least there is some help to rely on.

Please everyone, get your Cadillac road worthy or put it in a trailer and drive it to KY!  Let's try and reverse this developing trend.

Scot

Fairfax Station, VA  22039 (Washington DC Sub)
1970 Cadillac DeVille Convertible
1970 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1970 four door Convertible w/Cadillac Warranty

chrisntam

Quick reply, have to head out to work...

Having the GN in Texas in June with temps in the high 90s was a tough decision.  I did not plan, assist or volunteer, so I  will not judge (that decision).  The hotel was GREAT!  Actually, I'm a little worried the 2019 GN Host Hotel won't live up to the Texas Embassy Suites (no b'fast, no fridge in the room, no "suite" to stay in, no free happy hour.  Again, I won't judge, I'm just comparing.  If a fridge in the room is wanted, that'll be $20/day.

From others who attended Texas, the lack of cars was noted.  The prevailing reason was the heat and that the hot bed of Cadillac activity / ownership is in the northeast, which I agree, as nearly every Cadillac that is for sale and I'm interested in is in the northeast.
1970 Deville Convertible 
Dallas, Texas

35-709

To Scot's original post ---

Absolutely right!  I drove my '35 Cadillac (with a '70s Cadillac drive train) from my home in Florida to the St. Augustine GN, the Boston GN, and the Lake George GN.  All trouble free trips.  I also drove my '73 Cadillac Caribou to the Boston GN and the Lake George GN --- yes, I drove one up and flew back to get the other and reversed the process to get them home.
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold - but still in the family
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod - Sold
1942 Cadillac 6269 - Sold
1968 Pontiac Bonneville Convertible - Sold
1950 Packard 2dr. Club Sedan
1935 Glenn Pray - Auburn Boattail Speedster, Gen. 2

Cadillac Jack 82


Last year was a great event and although I fully understand the work that it takes to get these events ready it would have been nice to participate in some way.  Perhaps offer a way for those who cannot make it to sell their space to members who can?  It would ensure member participation and encourage locals to show up with their Cadillacs.  Just my .02.
Tim

CLC Member #30850

1959 Cadillac CDV "Shelley"
1964 Cadillac SDV "Rosalie"
1966 Oldsmobile Toronado "Sienna"

Past Cars

1937 LaSalle Cpe
1940 Chevrolet Cpe
1941 Ford 11Y
1954 Buick 48D
1955 Cadillac CDV
1955 Packard Clipper
1957 Cadillac Series 62
1962 VW Bug
1962 Dodge 880
1966 Mercury Montclair
1967 Buick Wildcat Convertible
1968 Chevy Chevelle SS
1968 Plymouth Barracuda
1977 Lincoln MKV

gkhashem

I did notice that the amount of the cars on the show field looked small. Also early June is not exactly vacation time for people still working. I know Texas and the climate may dictate that, but the June time frame is not optimal for many people.

I drove my 1978 Coupe DeVille 650 miles to DC from NH. I did stop overnight in PA.

The air was on and I cruised at 65-70 MPH most of the way.

I understand that the biggest reason may be age. The CLC is not a young persons' club in general.  As people age, they do not want inconvenience and I get it. Also there is a fear factor with driving my 1959 Coupe Deville with all the crazy drivers on the highway. It's not my car, it's the cars around me. I toyed with taking my car but the distance did deter me with a 58 year old car.

People are going 70-75MPH and texting as they drive.

I can't agree with the gas thing did you not know you would get 12MPG?
1959 Oldsmobile 98 Holiday Sports Sedan
1960 Cadillac Coupe Deville (CLC Sr #72)
1964 Oldsmobile 98 Town Sedan (OCA 1st)
1970 GMC C1500
1977 Oldsmobile 98 Regency Coupe
1978 Cadillac Coupe Deville (CLC Sr Crown #959)*
1992 Oldsmobile 98 (OCA 1st)
1996 Oldsmobile 98
*CLC Past President's Preservation

Past Cadillacs
1959 Coupe Deville
1966 Coupe Deville (Sr #861)*
1991 Eldorado Biarritz (Sr #838)

Jay Friedman

To hot to  drive my '49 to TX, but I will drive it to Louisville.
1949 Cadillac 6107 Club Coupe
1932 Ford V8 Phaeton (restored, not a rod).  Sold
Decatur, Georgia
CLC # 3210, since 1984
"If it won't work, get a bigger hammer."

marty55cdv

 Myself and another member flew in Friday afternoon, saw the lack of vehicles on the show field and thought there must be a parking lot full of trailers with cars still in them somewhere. Saturday we found out that was not the case, what we saw was what we got. The 2017 GN was amazing for the amount of vehicles , I spent hours  looking at them all week in the evenings after the tours .  Maybe a incentive needs to be put in place for car owners who bring their car to be judged or just to display , a free awards banquet ticket or a free tour ticket if you register a car.   If distance is a issue just keep them in the east where the density of vehicles is much higher.  Looking forward to Louisville  and hoping for the best.
Marty Smith
  CLC #22760
41 60 Special http://bit.ly/1Wm0GvT
55 CDV http://bit.ly/1G933IY
56 Fleetwood
1958 Extended Deck http://bit.ly/1NPYhGC
1959 Fleetwood  http://bit.ly/1OFsrOE
1960 Series 62 Coupe
1960 Sedan DeVille  4 window Flattop
63 Fleetwood http://bit.ly/1iSz17J
1964 Eldorado http://bit.ly/1Wm17GA  (Living in California now)
1988 EBC http://bit.ly/1iSACKz

Caddyholic

It seems to me that the TX GN had a lot of no shows. Empty spaces. I would like to know how many paid for a car and did not show?
I got myself a Cadillac but I can't afford the gasoline (AC/DC Down Payment Blues)

1961 Series 62 Convertible Coupe http://bit.ly/1RCYsVZ
1962 Coupe Deville

chrisntam

I was late to the dance (to register my car), I did it Friday afternoon, I was #120.

I didn't count the cars while there, but I thought there would be more there.  I was disappointed there were no '57 or '58 Broughams.

I quickly counted the pics I took, though I didn't take pics of the cars of '80s & '90s & newer ones, I'd say there were between 90 to 100 cars in the show field.
1970 Deville Convertible 
Dallas, Texas

G Pennington

Personally I was thrilled the GN was held in TX.  Easy 4 hr drive.  But I was disappointed at the number of cars on display.  I'm sure the heat was a factor.   Around here, most car shows held in the spring or fall.  If the show's during the summer it's held in the evening.  How was the turnout in 2016 in Vegas?
The biggest cause of the low turnout was of course the location.  It's well known the CLC member population center is in the NE, Midwest, and east & west coasts.  Just too far for some folks
Same reason I didn't make DC or Vegas. 
Gary Pennington
   1953 6267X Convertible
   1941 6267D Convertible (2 door)

Cape Cod Fleetwood

#10
I have a lot of nerve commenting here since I'm,
1) new
2) a girl
3) not even a member of the CLC <yet>

but I have experience with a similar hobby.

Only HQ @CLC knows where the majority of members are clustered in the country,
hold the annual event in that area. There's nothing to 'sell' so rolling the event across the country is pointless.

Have the event in the spring or fall. Old cars and old folks (I'm including myself at 58) don't like the heat. Fall is probably the ideal, now you have the spring and summer to get your car 'right'.

Anyone who says the price of gas was a deterrent to participation is a bad BS artist.
I understand the hesitance of the highway, try to remember you're a steel battleship in a sea of aluminum kayaks.
We're all old/getting older. Do this now while you can still drive safely at some level.
If its a Cadillac, its good enough, its the "Cadillac Grand National".
We all worry about breaking down, even with our newer daily drivers. Maybe the CLC could strike a deal with a national carrier in exchange for advertising, etc. so older cars could be hauled. Maybe a deal with JetBlue (depending on the hub) for discounts for members...

*Judging - here is where you can double (or more) your attendance at the National as well as club membership:
Not everyone has the money, time, money, level of dedication, money to own/create a 100 point car. Just as USPSA learned, not everyone has 3K to spend on a full race pistol or the 50 hours a week to dedicate to practicing in order to be a contender for the prize table. They created a limited/limited 10/stock/etc classes - then added ladies/seniors/youth/military/LEO in each of those new classes. And the organization simply exploded with new blood.

How about judging for cars that have worm screws instead of tower clamps, a DieHard battery instead of a "period correct" battery? A "cruiser class", for every 10 years? The "barn find" class, "daily driver", "don't laugh it still rolls" class...  Are brand new Cadillacs invited? Those people have the money... Ladies division, "youth class" (16-21), military/first responder owned... in each division.

Give the people across the spectrum who own these cars a 'reason' to go... Even if that reason is a chance to win a $5 plaque from "Grand National" with their cruiser.

The hotel is CRUCIAL, especially with an older base. In-room fridges for that Boost or insulin is not negotiable.
For the younger members you're trying to draw, we want the high-tech and gym access, etc.

Just some random thoughts from someone who saw first hand how an org can quadruple their membership in just a few years and bring in a LOT of new blood. I'll go back to sitting in the corner now.

\m/
Laurie
There are 2 kinds of cars in the world, Cadillac and everything else....

The Present -1970 Fleetwood Brougham

The Past -
1996 Deville Concours
1987 Sedan De Ville "Commonwealth Edition"
1981 Coupe De Ville (8-6-4)
1976 Sedan De Ville
1975 Sedan De Ville

The Daily Driver and work slave -
2008 GMC Acadia SLT *options/all

Cape Cod Fleetwood

File under: I had too much coffee too late in the day

Imagine if you will (Rod Serling) the:

Class 1970 -
Division - Sedan (must have 4 doors from the factory)
Division - Coupe (must have 2 doors from the factory)
Division - Misc (hearse, ambulance, etc)

Group - Stock (tower clamps and bias ply's where applicable)
Group - Cruiser (worm clamps, radials, DieHard batteries, change of color, vinyl roof add/delete, interior
             changed from upholstery to leather, etc)
Group - Modified (bring 'em, people love them. Bagged, lowered, LEDs, body changes, crate Hemi, etc. As long
            as the data plate says its a 1970)

Let the 3 Group winners compete for Best In Group - 1970, can you see where I'm heading here? Then let all the Group winners from each decade compete for Best In Show (not the movie, no rubber ducky's).

You've just blanketed EVERY Cadillac owner in America. The 100 point frame off restoration to perfection to the 19 year old in central PA stuffing a crate Hemi into grandpa's '69 Coupe that he inherited and he's lowering it too. That's your next generation.

And the CLC might have to adjust who they use as judges too. I can see the purists curling their noses and making duck faces at the modifieds. So have a 'guest judge' for those, and maybe "Best In Show" as well. Dana Mecum, Chip Foose, Ryan Friedlinghaus. You don't think cocktails/seminars with those guys would be a 'draw' for the event?

Going back to my corner...

\m/
Laurie
There are 2 kinds of cars in the world, Cadillac and everything else....

The Present -1970 Fleetwood Brougham

The Past -
1996 Deville Concours
1987 Sedan De Ville "Commonwealth Edition"
1981 Coupe De Ville (8-6-4)
1976 Sedan De Ville
1975 Sedan De Ville

The Daily Driver and work slave -
2008 GMC Acadia SLT *options/all

D.Smith

HEAT.   Definitely a factor.

I live in CT and was registered to bring my 61 Cadillac to the DC GN.     But as the date got closer the realization that driving a car full of people 6-7 hours on the highway without A/C would be too much for all of us.     Sure enough, as we got closer to the beltway the afternoon traffic turned to 5 lanes (each way) of gridlock in 95*F temps.     So I was glad to have driven us down in my newer daily driver with ice cold A/C.

So I can understand why there are no-shows at some of the GNs.    Timing is everything.   You want to hold them during nice weather months, but you gotta be careful not to have them during peak heat months.    Despite all the heat, the DC event was a blast and I was pleased with the turn out.

D.Smith

Oh!  To boost attendance for local members who don't know they can attend until the last minute,  I'd recommend that future GNs offer a day pass.     I've seen club members turned away on show day who didn't know they'd be able to go until the last minute.    Obviously a day pass couldn't include a banquet dinner as meal numbers must be provided for well in advance.    BUT I see no reason why local CLC members who can attend just on show day can't be allowed to park on the field in the overflow area.  Charge a smaller show day only fee and let them enjoy the show.  I guarantee you they will enjoy the day and want to try and make sure they can attend a full even in the future.

metalblessing

Quote from: gkhashem on June 18, 2018, 10:34:34 AM
I can't agree with the gas thing did you not know you would get 12MPG?

Man I would be so happy if I could get 12MPG in mine. I probably get 7 or 8
1968 Cadillac Miller-Meteor Hearse/Ambulance Combination

Barry M Wheeler #2189

#15
There has never been a "charge" for wandering the show field and "looking at the cars" at our GNs. Parking your collector car is another thing. Getting over one hundred years of Cadillacs and LaSalles in year order is a difficult task. And many times, we have no "over flow parking." You can attend "at the last minute" free of charge, attend the swap meet, and even park yourself in the lobby to chat with friends, old and new. Adding to the confusion in getting everyone on the show field by the appointed time by allowing anyone with their Pride and Joy to show up and "park somewhere on the field for ten bucks" would be very counter productive and in many cases, simply impossible.

Again, there is NO CHARGE for attending a CLC GN on show day if all you wish to do is "look at the cars." If we had "extra" cars on the field, judges would wonder why they had no placard in the window, why they were parked out of year order, ad infinitum. It's very easy to present "Monday morning quarterback" solutions to things that make it "easy" on those who do things at the last minute. Please rest assured that our Meet committee discuss everything that they can think of relative to putting on a show that will entertain and please MOST of our members and guests.
Barry M. Wheeler #2189


1981 Cadillac Seville
1991 Cadillac Seville

gmurph

I drove my '72 to the GN in San Marcos this year. It is the first time I have brought a car. For me it is just over 1000 miles to drive directly, but I made it a vacation and drove just over 4300 miles by the time I got home. I knew the gas would be expensive, so I just didn't worry about it. I spent well over a year making sure everything was ready for a long trip, and the trunk was packed with tools and parts - just in case. I was told that "we are not driving to Texas in June with no A/C", so I had to make sure that was at the top of my list

I chose to stay off of the interstates as much as I could so that I could actually see some of the country. I made sure I had plenty of buffer 'just in case', or just to stop and see or do something along the way. CO-KS-MO-AR-OK-TX.

Haven't decided about Louisville, but KC is a for sure.
Greg Murphy CLC#24416

1941 60S
1952 Dodge B3F
1972 Coupe de Ville

chrisntam

Quote from: gmurph on June 19, 2018, 09:50:00 AM
I drove my '72 to the GN in San Marcos this year. It is the first time I have brought a car. For me it is just over 1000 miles to drive directly, but I made it a vacation and drove just over 4300 miles by the time I got home. I knew the gas would be expensive, so I just didn't worry about it. I spent well over a year making sure everything was ready for a long trip, and the trunk was packed with tools and parts - just in case. I was told that "we are not driving to Texas in June with no A/C", so I had to make sure that was at the top of my list

I chose to stay off of the interstates as much as I could so that I could actually see some of the country. I made sure I had plenty of buffer 'just in case', or just to stop and see or do something along the way. CO-KS-MO-AR-OK-TX.

Haven't decided about Louisville, but KC is a for sure.

Was yours the blue one with the bubble covers over the headlights?
1970 Deville Convertible 
Dallas, Texas

chrisntam

Barry has a point, I registered late, there was no way to fit my '70 in with the other '70s as they had already assigned spaces for the cars.  That I understand!

As far as an "overflow" area, that may be tough to do as well.  The show field was in a hotel parking lot, a part of which was cordoned off for our cars.  The rest of the parking lot was used by other hotel guests.  I suppose you could intermingle our Cadillacs in the "overflow" area, but you'd have to walk past Hyundais and Kias to see the next good car...
1970 Deville Convertible 
Dallas, Texas

Jason Edge

I have read the complaints about the number of cars in San Marcos, but there were some very nice examples of both Cadillacs and LaSalles. Yes, there was only one 1959 Cadillac. Imagine that! There was no sea of 59's like we saw in Lake George,... but, there was the most pristine 1934 LaSalle on that show field I have ever seen. (see picture below)  I could have stood and stared at that car for days on end if my ears would not blister from the Texas Sun. As far as cars representing our 1963/64 Cadillac Chapter I was impressed. We had 6 1963/64's, including 3 63's and 3 64's, with the following nice mix of body styles: 63-6257, 63-6357, 63-6267, 64-6267, 64-6367, 64-6339.

I believe last year, the one GN I have missed recently, had a sea of 1964 Eldorado's, and no 63's other than a converted wagon parked over to the side.  While everyone loves an Eldorado, I was very happy to see some sedans and coupes in the mix in San Marcos.  I was very thrilled to see a very nice survivor 1963 Series 62 Coupe.

As far as number of cars on the show field, demographics is key. Population density, location/distance, and weather are all factor's contributing to one's decision to drive or fly. I wanted to drive my 2002 Escalade EXT, but even from North Carolina it would have been an 18 hr drive... and that would be a straight drive with no stops. To realistically drive, I would have needed 2 days getting there and 2 days getting back with extra hotel expense for one day coming and going. That is 4 days traveling to a 4 day event. For me that is fine, I am retired, however, my wife works and it did not seem worth the effort to spend 4 days of her vacation trying to drive to and from Texas. Next year ... different story. We will definitely be driving.

   


Jason Edge
Lifetime Member
Executive Vice President
CLC 1963/64 Cadillac Chapter Director - www.6364Cadillac.com
CLC Carolina Region Webmaster - www.CRCLC.org
CLC MRC Benefactor
email - jasonedge64@outlook.com
1964 Coupe DeVille - Sierra Gold - http://bit.ly/1WnOQRX
2002 Escalade EXT - Black
2013 Escalade EXT Premium Edition - Xenon Blue
2022 XT5 Luxury Premium - Dark Moon Blue Metallic