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Author Topic: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing  (Read 830 times)

Offline Highwayman68

  • Posts: 631
  • 68 Fleetwood Brougham
  • CLC Number: 29574
  • Name: Mark Demyan
1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« on: May 04, 2021, 08:58:23 PM »
I have to help sell a friend's 1959 Coupe converted to Convertible. This was professionally done many years ago and it was done well. Fully functioning top with the front window frame replaced to lock the top in place. The coupe interior was replaced with non-1959 interior which was later replaced with more modern Cadillac convertible interior with a center console. The rest of the car is in great condition.

I am working on getting pictures to help. There isn't any references out there that I can find for pricing this fairly. I could use some guidance with this. Please keep the comments constructive, the car is what it is and it is what I have to deal with.
1968 Fleetwood Purchased in 1981

Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2021, 01:19:30 AM »
You might find the attached thread of interest:
http://forums.cadillaclasalleclub.org/index.php?topic=149829.0

As you might imagine, this topic has been discussed
on the Forum previously.

Mike
1955 Cadillac Eldorado
1973 Cadillac Eldorado
1995 Cadillac Seville
2004 Escalade
1997 GMC Suburban 4X4, 454 engine, 3/4 ton
custom built by Santa Fe in Evansville, IN
2011 Buick Lucerne CX
-------------------------------------
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Past: VP International Affiliates, Museum Board Director, President / Director Pittsburgh Region

Offline James Landi

  • Posts: 2383
  • 2007 XLR
  • Name: James Landi
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2021, 07:46:20 AM »
In my judgement, in the present market, a seller only requires one person with a passion and the bucks to come through for a sale--and there are a bunch of people with appreciated stocks who can afford to spend some money on something fun.  Clearly, an entirely honest presentation will permit any potential buyer to understand the significant difference among present day available examples.   So my thinking is that some significant discount in price between the "numbers matching resortation," "an extraordinary low mileage unmolested show car," and this well engineered and perfectly serviceable conversion are parts of the calculus for the seller, and certainly for the potential purchaser. If I wanted one, I'd be mightily attracted to the conversion IF it is well engineered, attractive, and has some safety features that are not available on the "real thing."   I think I'd feel that such a car would be far more "useable" and fun to own, rather than owning an expensive "objet d'art" that rarely sees sunlight.  Thanks for posing this interesting question,  James

Offline cadillac ken

  • Posts: 701
  • Name: k caskey
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2021, 08:11:16 AM »
Modified cars are a funny thing.  Some actually bring more money than a well done restored car.  There is a company called Revology here in Florida that sells completely modernized versions of the 60's Mustang.  It is a legit company that actually has the blessing of Ford and issues new VIN's for the cars.  They sell for over 100K dollars-- well above what the stock restored versions would bring at auction.

With that said, I agree with James.  If the car is done professionally and operates flawlessly than it may very well have a bit of interest to the right person.  Especially since original '59 convertibles are quite pricey.  In my business I see cars like this often.  Those well done usually find a legit buyer for a decent price.  It will take a "car guy" to appreciate it.

Photos are a must to even get close to a price I would estimate for the car. It's all about the quality of it all.  Paint, upholstery, overall condition of the frame and suspension (was the frame properly reinforced when the top was cut off(?) all are in consideration when factoring a sale price.  Most folks interested in the car will be looking at all of it not just the top conversion.

Regards, Ken

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

  • Posts: 7039
  • Name: Eric DeVirgilis
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2021, 09:17:28 AM »
As I posted on FB: It depends on how well the car presents, ie condition/quality, colors etc. All things equal I would estimate 50 to 60% of the value of a factory built Series 62 convertible identical in all other ways - assuming stock appearance was retained in all areas with no visible signs of the car having been converted.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline Lexi

  • Posts: 2004
  • CLC Number: 28634
  • Name: C.R. Foley
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2021, 09:23:31 AM »
Ken is dead on. Questions pertaining to whether the frame was reinforced & it's present condition, could make or break the deal, (and significantly impact value). Too many unknowns to speculate on value at this time. Clay/Lexi

Offline Highwayman68

  • Posts: 631
  • 68 Fleetwood Brougham
  • CLC Number: 29574
  • Name: Mark Demyan
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2021, 11:00:35 AM »
I'm glad I asked the question here before I went over because I never would have thought about taking pictures of the frame.
1968 Fleetwood Purchased in 1981

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

  • Posts: 7039
  • Name: Eric DeVirgilis
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2021, 11:48:56 AM »
The "non-1959" interior alone will likely invoke a significant value penalty.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline 55 CDV Fan 82

  • Posts: 1128
  • CLC Number: 30850
  • Name: Tim Neumann
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2021, 01:23:17 PM »

I never understood why someone would change the interior on a 59.  I LOVE the hardtop interiors and think the drop top ones are swanky.
Tim

CLC Member #30850

1955 Cadillac Coupe Deville "Evelyn"
1967 Buick Wildcat Convertible "Joyce"

Past Cars

1937 LaSalle Opera Coupe "Adeline"
1940 Chevrolet Coupe "Scarlett"
1941 Ford 11Y truck
1954 Buick Special 48D
1955 Packard Clipper Super Panama
1957 Cadillac Series 62 Coupe
1962 VW Bug
1962 Dodge 880
1966 Mercury Montclair
1968 Chevrolet Chevelle SS
1968 Plymouth Barracuda
1977 Lincoln

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

  • Posts: 7039
  • Name: Eric DeVirgilis
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2021, 02:22:32 PM »
I never understood why someone would change the interior on a 59.

Usually done as a cost saving measure more than anything else.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline Highwayman68

  • Posts: 631
  • 68 Fleetwood Brougham
  • CLC Number: 29574
  • Name: Mark Demyan
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2021, 02:40:57 PM »
I never understood why someone would change the interior on a 59.  I LOVE the hardtop interiors and think the drop top ones are swanky.

My guess is the convertible top and mechanisms wouldn't fit with the coupe rear seat and actual 59 convertible interiors are very expensive, too expensive for a non original convertible.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 02:46:20 PM by Highwayman68 »
1968 Fleetwood Purchased in 1981

Offline Highwayman68

  • Posts: 631
  • 68 Fleetwood Brougham
  • CLC Number: 29574
  • Name: Mark Demyan
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2021, 02:43:14 PM »
I got some pictures of the frame and it was reinforced with additional plates and tie-ins.

1968 Fleetwood Purchased in 1981

Offline rwchatham CLC 21892

  • Posts: 552
  • CLC Number: 21892
  • Name: R. Waligora
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2021, 04:54:06 PM »
Half the price of a coupe 15k
R. Waligora

Offline cadillac ken

  • Posts: 701
  • Name: k caskey
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2021, 08:24:36 AM »
Well to be honest the interior leaves a lot to be desired-- or at least the rear seats you show.  Baggy and ill fitting.

The reinforcment of the frame is in some places looks OK but I can tell you my '58 Biarritz has 1/2" thick bar stock welded to the bottom of the frame all the way back.  It looks like in one photo the piece under the frame is only about a quarter of an inch.  And to be sure the '59 is a heavier car (I would assume).  Now I'm not a '59 expert so not sure what Cadillac did as factory.  But someone here could probably post some photos of their OEM '59 Cadillac convertible frame to compare. 

Not to put too fine a point on it but this frame thing is important as it will effect the flex (or non flex) of the body that affects the door gaps and closures and even the alignment of the windshield frame to the top.  The car may run out fine with no issues.  Just something I would want to check as a buyer.  Having those issues can take the joy of ownership right out of the car.

But with that said, more photos of the body, chrome-work, and engine compartment (original 390 ci ?) would be in order to truly access the value of the car.  In my mind every car has it's price point.  Probably will sell just fine but the big question is, of course, at what price?  We have to see more photos to reach that point.

Plus have to ask; Is it a running and driving car that's road ready?  Or has it sat for some time.  All are "price factors"

Regards, Ken

Offline 55 CDV Fan 82

  • Posts: 1128
  • CLC Number: 30850
  • Name: Tim Neumann
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2021, 10:38:13 AM »

TBH I say throw it on Bring A Trailer.  You'd be surprised what some cars go for.
Tim

CLC Member #30850

1955 Cadillac Coupe Deville "Evelyn"
1967 Buick Wildcat Convertible "Joyce"

Past Cars

1937 LaSalle Opera Coupe "Adeline"
1940 Chevrolet Coupe "Scarlett"
1941 Ford 11Y truck
1954 Buick Special 48D
1955 Packard Clipper Super Panama
1957 Cadillac Series 62 Coupe
1962 VW Bug
1962 Dodge 880
1966 Mercury Montclair
1968 Chevrolet Chevelle SS
1968 Plymouth Barracuda
1977 Lincoln

Offline dinhnguyen57

  • Posts: 324
  • CLC Number: 31841
  • Name: DNguyen
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2021, 01:47:36 PM »
I've never used Bringatrailer.  Are they selective on what is advertised/auctioned on they webpage? 

I think the seats, particularly the bulging seat belt housing on the front seats would be a big no-deal for me.
1941 Series 62 coupe
1959 Eldorado Seville
1970 Deville convertible
2007 Mercedes S550
2009 STS
2018 Chrysler Pacifica

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

  • Posts: 7039
  • Name: Eric DeVirgilis
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #16 on: May 06, 2021, 01:54:22 PM »
I've never used Bringatrailer.  Are they selective on what is advertised/auctioned on they webpage? 

Supposedly they are according to their website.
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline cadillac ken

  • Posts: 701
  • Name: k caskey
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2021, 09:24:59 AM »
I say yes to BAT.  I've deduced that it is a great place to sell but no so great to buy.  Deep pockets seem to bid even questionable cars up to silly prices.  How's a restored Fiat Jolly selling for $146K.  Yikes!

As for the select-ability issue of Bring a Trailer... I recently saw a 1938 Studebaker Express Pick up that looked like someone dragged it out of a mid west desert after 40 years of sitting.  Rust, rust through, no interior, missing most of the chrome, lights, etc. and the last time I checked it was at $7100.  Kinda shocking.

just my 2 cents worth.

Offline Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

  • Posts: 7039
  • Name: Eric DeVirgilis
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2021, 09:59:43 AM »
For consignments Bat seems to be looking for examples that fall into either of two basic categories: 1, Cars not particularly rare/sought after (generally speaking) but in high grade (esp) original condition and 2, extremely rare and/or blue chip collectible status but acceptable in "barn find" or restorable condition.

So for example a 1976 Sedan deVille would have to be in pristine as-new condition, but a 1953 Eldorado could be a basket case.  If this '59 was a genuine 6267 body style convertible they would likely accept it no questions asked, possibly a conversion with a correct high quality interior but between the combination of a modified body style + the poor quality and wrong interior might be a leap too far. And that's assuming the body is in presentable condition which is still unknown.

Ebay would be the best place to list this car. 
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Offline Highwayman68

  • Posts: 631
  • 68 Fleetwood Brougham
  • CLC Number: 29574
  • Name: Mark Demyan
Re: 1959 Coupe/Convertible Conversion Pricing
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2021, 10:38:02 PM »
So here are some pictures of the car for reference.
1968 Fleetwood Purchased in 1981

 

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