Because its only money....

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Ordered all new springs/isolators for The Ark from Detroit Spring, being shipped direct to the WORLD FAMOUS Hyannis
Vintage Auto, $533. Due Friday or Monday.

I'm nuking the air shocks, torn between Monroe's and Gabriels (since I'm a snob). Monroe's are highly
recommended by the 69-70 body experts, even the Delco shocks. The DeVille shocks will probably work since when you
click Fleetwood all they show are the air shocks. Michael said NAPA... Michael can also swap an engine in the time it
takes me to put on make up.

The new shiny tranny pan, new cork gasket, new WIX filter and enough Ford ATF are still trip hazards in my den.

Michael can knock this all off in a morning, he's good like that. As SO many of you know.   

[James Landi]

Yes, those original leveling shocks used that infernal vacuum actuated air compressor. I was able to rebuild them back 45 years ago when there were parts.  Living near the ocean truly limits the service life.  When i first took my pump apart, the salt air corrosion caused the internal parts to look like they were immersed in salt water.   Interesting side note-- the next generation electric pump on Cadillacs were very durable and rarely fail.  Should be interesting, Laurie, to see if you can detect any changes in the ride after you've changed out these parts.  On Cadillacs of yore, like the Ark, the recommended tire pressure was in the low 20 psi, so when I still owned a 72 Eldorado (Big MaMa), I inflated the tires to factory specs.  Made a world of difference for ride and comfort.    Happy day to you,   James

[fishnjim]

I don't see any issue with Monroe "gas" shocks.   I put them on the '58.   

[GBrown #8092]

I don't know about just dumping the air shocks and going to standard gas ones.
That had been done on my 65 Eldo. They rode fine, but the car sunk big time with rear seat passengers or significant weight in the trunk. May I suggest replacing what you have with air shocks with a hidden air fill. I've been running both the 65's that way with no problems for many years.

G Brown

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

I have air shocks with a "hidden"
Filler (behind the liscence plate) on all 4 of my cars. That way when the car is lightly loaded I can appreciate the comfort of the variable rate springs and pump up the shocks when conditions require.
Greg Surfas

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

Not sure if this applies to all Cadillacs with the ALC, but with mine, the factory states that the ALC fitted cars are built with softer rear springs than the non ALC cars.

Removing the Air Shocks in an ALC car will result in a lower ride attitude in the rear, even when there are no passengers.

Bruce.

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Detroit (Eaton) Spring has an app for that...

I'm not the first one nuking the air ride in a '70 Series 60, they knew exactly which rear springs to send to keep
The Ark's a$$ up and level. They even put it in writing that the car would be level. They recommended Gabriel shocks,
"Mike" at DS gave me the model number of shock for the rear too, he's done this to a couple of his cars plus what customers have told him worked. I cross referenced his number, yep, those be them!

In case anyone is keeping score -
rear springs #MC1357
front springs #MC5220 (MC1418 is specified but not in stock, 6-8 weeks backlogged, "Mike" said "trust me, these
interchange. He should know, he's Detroit Spring)
4 spring isolator kits as well.

Shocks - Gabriel
Front - #82601
Rear - #82040
Shocks came from Rock Auto, how do we survive without Rock Auto. Cheapest prices anywhere, ordered at noon,
FedEx shipping info at 4pm, due on Thursday. Springs 'should' have arrived at HVA Friday or today. If they hadn't,
I would have heard about it from the shop today. $86 from Rock Auto- anytime you get parts/shipped, for under $100 you WON so be grateful.

Fingers crossed Michael can thrash this weekend, unless they're going racing again, I should check the Epping calendar. He still has to replace the tranny pan, (yes I already red 721'd the drain plug in place after a cleaning with
brake fluid), cork gasket, WIX filter, Ford ATF fluid too, all still trip hazards in my den. When this is done, The Lair gets
another power wash of the floor, this should END the drips. I hate drips. "If it ain't dripping, its empty." - M. Amster
PHHTTTTT! she said.

I got sick of screwing with the air ride, after nearly 4 years, always having to set up my compressor to add air, or
at the shop. This last time the car was slightly "lop sided" when air was added, DONE. Enough, make it stop. This
isn't a Concours level restoration, this car is a driver. *DRIVE IT LIKE YOU STOLE IT* - M. Amster
Scot Minesinger did this with his DeVille and he carries a tow truck in his trunk when on the road for a long trip, no
sagging. So....

I *RARELY* have pax in the back, I think once since I've owned the car. Other than a full tank of fuel in that brand
new fuel tank, spare tire, Ark make up, showboard, a very small bag of parts and jumpers, my portable restaurant/bar, chair for shows that's all that's in the trunk.

If for some reason its not level, 'Mike' at Detroit Spring has a problem since its in writing that it would be.

REALLY hoping this is all done before July 15th, weather permitting its the next cruise in at Gillette Stadium and I haven't been there this year. They had "Cadillac Day" on June 3rd but it was raining here, here is 70 miles away and
a screaming ride on 495. They had 3100 cars show up 2 weeks ago. Jeez. What's really cool is the Mass Cruisers
(who run this event) request/don't demand, a non-perishable food donation of all exhibitors upon entrance. Food is
donated to a local vet pantry and regular food pantry. Nice touch.

Stay tuned, I'll post when its all done with pictures and my reaction to the new ride feel. Even with Michael completely rebuilding the entire front end, and it tightened up quite a bit believe me, The Ark still gets a little 'floaty' at 85mph+ and I understand this is not a McClaren. Hope this helps a bit.

[James Landi]

Laurie,

NO need to be anxious--- the ELdorado definitely required the air shocks because it was designed with a SINGLE leaf spring, and with that compressor not functioning, the rear end "hard axle" was nearly resting on it rubber bumper body stops, so that when one drove down the road, your rear view mirror was focused on the pavement or the convertible top, and any substantive road bump would bang the axle into the body stops. As mentioned by other members, a simple fix involved air shock inflator valve mounted somewhere for convenient  access at the rear of the car.  My 72 Eldorado would hold the inflation for approximately a month, so since we drove her only occasionally, it was hardly an inconvenience --- I thought about converting the vacuum actuated  pump to the much more durable electric pump that would simply work off a dash switch and be monitored with a gauge, but never "got to it." ALl this said, I think you;ll be fine because on your car the self levelor was certainly not "as necessary" trucking around normal loads  (aka- you and one passenger) .   Happy day,   James

[scotth3886]

Can I get the contact info for this Mike at Detroit Spring? 

I'm doing similar.  The Monroe MA728 air shocks I installed in the rear, along with replacement springs, is just entirely too soft.  I don't like the ass of my 66 Fleetwood twerking at cars behind me.  I generally don't carry much weight in the back or the trunk, except the time two or three weeks ago that my friend's 59 Lincoln vapor locked so we all went to lunch in my car while waiting for his to cool off.   That was 7 guys in my car including one really big one.  However, since I didn't have a compressor with me, increasing the load carrying via the air shocks didn't do me much good.

I ordered and received, but not installed yet, Gabriel extra heavy duty shocks for the rear from A1 Shocks, but I know it's gonna be saggin so I'll need to do taller rear springs.  I don't really want much firmer, just taller.  I'll let the damping do its job controlling the ride motions, sort of like a S-class Mercrudes Benz that has soft rear spring rates, but very firm damping.  Anyone who has spent any time in or owned a S-Class, knows what I'm talking about.  I want slow very controlled ride motions in the rear.  Front is fine. 

And then I overcooked it with the modified rebuilt steering box.  It is way too firm, but greatly increased feedback while cornering hard, such as chasing some snot faced, loud mouth ricer punk home from Cars & Coffee.  I did similar on my 63 GP with a late 70s T/A box and it broke-in over time so it feels just right now.  I'm giving the Cadillac box time to do the same.  I can't quite yet do a freeway flyover ramp marked 45mph at 90, but getting there.  GM didn't offer a FE3 or F41 suspension option on any Cadillac, let alone the Fleetwood, but I'm trying to 'engineer' one.   

All of the new GM B and C body cars I ordered new throughout the 60s were ordered with the optional 'handling' suspension and it transformed the cars with little degradation in ride quality.  The fly in the ointment in ordering anything 'off the shelf' for the Fleetwood is that they're about 100 - 150lb heavier than a sedan Deville and all that extra weight is over the rear axel. 

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Can I get the contact info for this Mike at Detroit Spring? 

I'm doing similar.  The Monroe MA728 air shocks I installed in the rear, along with replacement springs, is just entirely too soft.  I don't like the ass of my 66 Fleetwood twerking at cars behind me.  I generally don't carry much weight in the back or the trunk, except the time two or three weeks ago that my friend's 59 Lincoln vapor locked so we all went to lunch in my car while waiting for his to cool off.   That was 7 guys in my car including one really big one.  However, since I didn't have a compressor with me, increasing the load carrying via the air shocks didn't do me much good.

I ordered and received, but not installed yet, Gabriel extra heavy duty shocks for the rear from A1 Shocks, but I know it's gonna be saggin so I'll need to do taller rear springs.  I don't really want much firmer, just taller.  I'll let the damping do its job controlling the ride motions, sort of like a S-class Mercrudes Benz that has soft rear spring rates, but very firm damping.  Anyone who has spent any time in or owned a S-Class, knows what I'm talking about.  I want slow very controlled ride motions in the rear.  Front is fine. 

And then I overcooked it with the modified rebuilt steering box.  It is way too firm, but greatly increased feedback while cornering hard, such as chasing some snot faced, loud mouth ricer punk home from Cars & Coffee.  I did similar on my 63 GP with a late 70s T/A box and it broke-in over time so it feels just right now.  I'm giving the Cadillac box time to do the same.  I can't quite yet do a freeway flyover ramp marked 45mph at 90, but getting there.  GM didn't offer a FE3 or F41 suspension option on any Cadillac, let alone the Fleetwood, but I'm trying to 'engineer' one.   

All of the new GM B and C body cars I ordered new throughout the 60s were ordered with the optional 'handling' suspension and it transformed the cars with little degradation in ride quality.  The fly in the ointment in ordering anything 'off the shelf' for the Fleetwood is that they're about 100 - 150lb heavier than a sedan Deville and all that extra weight is over the rear axel.

Just call Detroit Spring, Mike usually answers the phone. Check their website, put in your data, look at the available springs they have. For me, there was standard, heavy duty and a choice of springs 1", 1.5" and 2" taller. I listed the part numbers I got. Which arrived at The House of Amster last week.

[scotth3886]

Just call Detroit Spring, Mike usually answers the phone. Check their website, put in your data, look at the available springs they have. For me, there was standard, heavy duty and a choice of springs 1", 1.5" and 2" taller. I listed the part numbers I got. Which arrived at The House of Amster last week.

Just talked to Mike.  He's recommending the same rear spring for me, the MC1357.  He says 29% higher spring rate, but an inch shorter and he says compressed, ride height will be about an inch higher.  That's the calculation I don't know how to do.   Their listings aren't as complete for 66 as they are for 70, but it shows the MC3107 as extra heavy duty for the 70 and heavy duty for the 66 so it's the same spring fitment best I can tell. 

I know you said before the 15th on installation so I'll be watching to get your reaction before I order mine.                                                           

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Just talked to Mike.  He's recommending the same rear spring for me, the MC1357.  He says 29% higher spring rate, but an inch shorter and he says compressed, ride height will be about an inch higher.  That's the calculation I don't know how to do.   Their listings aren't as complete for 66 as they are for 70, but it shows the MC3107 as extra heavy duty for the 70 and heavy duty for the 66 so it's the same spring fitment best I can tell. 

I know you said before the 15th on installation so I'll be watching to get your reaction before I order mine.                                                         

"extra heavy duty" might equal a pretty harsh ride. An inch higher is fine, springs and shocks all 'settle' at some point.
I'm hoping before the 15th, that shop is busy. I just re-read your other post, your car is twerking, that was hilarious.

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Laurie,

NO need to be anxious--- the ELdorado definitely required the air shocks because it was designed with a SINGLE leaf spring, and with that compressor not functioning, the rear end "hard axle" was nearly resting on it rubber bumper body stops, so that when one drove down the road, your rear view mirror was focused on the pavement or the convertible top, and any substantive road bump would bang the axle into the body stops. As mentioned by other members, a simple fix involved air shock inflator valve mounted somewhere for convenient  access at the rear of the car.  My 72 Eldorado would hold the inflation for approximately a month, so since we drove her only occasionally, it was hardly an inconvenience --- I thought about converting the vacuum actuated  pump to the much more durable electric pump that would simply work off a dash switch and be monitored with a gauge, but never "got to it." ALl this said, I think you;ll be fine because on your car the self levelor was certainly not "as necessary" trucking around normal loads  (aka- you and one passenger) .   Happy day,   James

Hi James,
The Ark has a valve under the rear plate to inflate the rear end. Like I said, the last straw was when I added air recently and the car was "lop sided" a bit. Done. Fini. Gone.

Scot Minesinger neutered the rear end on his DeVille, no sag issues at all and he loads up his car.

[scotth3886]

"extra heavy duty" might equal a pretty harsh ride. An inch higher is fine, springs and shocks all 'settle' at some point.
I'm hoping before the 15th, that shop is busy. I just re-read your other post, your car is twerking, that was hilarious.

My Pontiacs may be cheeky, but they don't twerk.  My Cadillac is more like this. 

https://youtu.be/PUzdDXizRe8

[tmdeturck]

OMG
Now that I've opened that link, I can't "un-see" it.  I think my brain has been scarred.

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

Argh... Now FedEx has delayed my shocks until Saturday "by end of day". This was enough to nuke the coils and shocks job for Saturday, now rain in the forecast nukes doing the tranny pan instead as well. Hopefully we can get with Michael next Saturday, Gillette will have MANY cruise in's this summer, twice a month, sometimes 3 times like this month. AND THERE WAS A TIME when an event I really wanted to attend would be negatively impacted by either weather or mntx would trigger an hysterical whining female response. Now? Meh, we'll get the next one. Maturity on my part? I highly doubt it.