Author Topic: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?  (Read 1996 times)

Offline chrisntam

  • Posts: 3472
  • Dallas, Texas
  • CLC Number: 29206
  • Name: Chris Jessen
Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« on: November 17, 2021, 07:03:37 PM »
It would never cross my mind to place aftermarket gauges there.  I suppose to fix it, all you'd need is a trim piece.  Other than that, it looks like a good car.  Here's an eBay link to it.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/304229065100?hash=item46d577218c%3Ag%3AQ4sAAOSw9URhlVNG&LH_ItemCondition=3000%7C2500

How about that hood ornament?
1970 Deville Convertible 
Dallas, Texas

Offline The Tassie Devil(le)

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  • Name: Bruce Reynolds
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2021, 07:58:45 PM »
The placement in that part of the dash looks really tacky.

With the availability of really compact gauges, like Digital ones, they should be in front of the driver.

When I fitted an Oil Pressure Gauge to my '72, when I first purchased it, I fitted it into the dash next to the radio which didn't matter as the dash had already been butchered to fit an aftermarket radio.

Now I have changed the radio, using a replacement panel, I have removed the gauge, as the Idiot Lights do their job.

Bruce. >:D
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

Offline V63

  • Posts: 1408
  • Name: W Link
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2021, 09:35:00 PM »
I put a set in the drawer of the smoke center ☺️
« Last Edit: November 17, 2021, 09:39:20 PM by V63 »

Offline Roger Zimmermann

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  • Switzerland
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  • Name: Roger Zimmermann
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2021, 02:51:34 AM »
The VIN from the ad is wrong: they took the designation from the body plate...
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Offline Wbostoen

  • Posts: 28
  • Name: Willem Bostoen
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2021, 11:04:12 AM »
I used to have round analog gauges hidden in the glove compartiment, as I really dislike the look of these in a classic car. Not as functional as they were out of direct sight, but I would have a look every now and then to check temps/pressure.

But now, I have been experimenting to create aftermarket gauges myself, trying to obtain a more integrated look for my '76. I have placed two of these gauges in the location where the 'ACRS' and 'fuel economy' indicator lights used to be. It is fully custom designed, so virtually any sensor reading can be displayed. I specifically chose yellow + a 'rough' digital font, to make it sort of period correct. Altough it looks more kind of 80's, I am happy with the way they turned out.

For the moment, it is operating but I am still working on some annoying bugs. Other than the bugs, they read very accurately. At the moment I can read battery voltage, oil pressure, oil temp and water temp (all units can be displayed in metric/imperial). RPM reading is present, but needs some finetuning, and speedometer (KMH/MPH) is on my to-do list.

« Last Edit: November 18, 2021, 11:17:17 AM by Wbostoen »

Offline Big Fins

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  • Name: John Serio
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2021, 01:29:47 PM »
I like the digitals in the information bar. Functional and totally unobtrusive. Great job!

Cutting holes in the dash is so 60's and ugly as hell.
Current:
1976 Eldorado Convertible in Crystal Blue FireMist with white interior and top.
1969 Fleetwood Brougham in Chalice Gold FireMist with matching interior and top.

Past and much missed:
1977 Brougham de Elegance
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1972 Fleetwood Brougham
1971 Sedan de Ville
1970 de Ville Convertible
1969 Sedan de Ville
1959 Sedan deVille

Offline The Tassie Devil(le)

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  • Name: Bruce Reynolds
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2021, 08:43:18 PM »
Those '76 dashes really lend themselves to fitting gauges out of sight.

Just got to find a way of being able to dim the output so they aren't too distracting, especially at night.

The new radio in my '72 can only be dimmed to a set level, which is still too bright for me.

The good thing about the Older gauges is that the illumination lights can be added to the vehicle dash lights, and controlled by the head light switch.

Bruce. >:D
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

Offline Big Fins

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  • CLC Number: 22631
  • Name: John Serio
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2021, 07:37:18 AM »
I don't know how some people can drive these new cars at night with the bright screens. I especially ordered mine without the navigation so I wouldn't have it in my eyes all of the time. Even in dark mode and dim it's too much for me.
Current:
1976 Eldorado Convertible in Crystal Blue FireMist with white interior and top.
1969 Fleetwood Brougham in Chalice Gold FireMist with matching interior and top.

Past and much missed:
1977 Brougham de Elegance
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1972 Fleetwood Brougham
1971 Sedan de Ville
1970 de Ville Convertible
1969 Sedan de Ville
1959 Sedan deVille

Offline 71 Fleetwood

  • Posts: 128
  • CLC Number: 33342
  • Name: Richard Alexander
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2021, 06:06:46 PM »
John I share your feelings about bright screens.  I cut a transparent film sheet for my Tahoe.  My backup screen is ultra bright so I use a dark film. 
1971 Fleetwood Sixty Special Brougham

Offline Big Fins

  • Posts: 1802
  • CLC Number: 22631
  • Name: John Serio
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2021, 05:59:03 PM »
That's a great idea! It sure bets having to flip up and hold a piece of cardboard while you fumble with the touch screen.

I like being able to simply feel my controls and know what does what.
Current:
1976 Eldorado Convertible in Crystal Blue FireMist with white interior and top.
1969 Fleetwood Brougham in Chalice Gold FireMist with matching interior and top.

Past and much missed:
1977 Brougham de Elegance
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1972 Fleetwood Brougham
1971 Sedan de Ville
1970 de Ville Convertible
1969 Sedan de Ville
1959 Sedan deVille

Offline 79 Eldorado

  • Posts: 824
  • Name: S Kent
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2021, 12:08:51 PM »
But now, I have been experimenting to create aftermarket gauges myself, trying to obtain a more integrated look for my '76. I have placed two of these gauges in the location where the 'ACRS' and 'fuel economy' indicator lights used to be. It is fully custom designed, so virtually any sensor reading can be displayed. I specifically chose yellow + a 'rough' digital font, to make it sort of period correct. Altough it looks more kind of 80's, I am happy with the way they turned out.

For the moment, it is operating but I am still working on some annoying bugs. Other than the bugs, they read very accurately. At the moment I can read battery voltage, oil pressure, oil temp and water temp (all units can be displayed in metric/imperial). RPM reading is present, but needs some finetuning, and speedometer (KMH/MPH) is on my to-do list.
Hi Willem,
Can you elaborate a little more regarding what you did to create the gauge? Is there a starter kit for something like you're showing or did you build everything from scratch? I would really like to have an actual temp gauge on my '79 Eldorado. I wanted to even make it appear like an original gauge. There's an area where a gauge could be placed where the idiot lights for temp are now but I wasn't certain how to build a gauge from scratch. I would even like it to be a "needle" gauge like the mechanical speedometer. I'm pretty good at finding ways to create the mechanical items but I'm not certain how the temp gauges work... resistance fairly sure but translating resistance into the proper movement I mean. I thought possibly I could start with another temp gauge and create a new face but finding something like a starting kit would be great. I will attach a mock-up which was really pretty close. I used a mid 89-92 Buick Century temp gauge. The numbers are covered by the Eldorado trim but I could live without numbers if I got it to work.

Pretty cool work especially if you were able to match a font which I gathered you did.

Scott

Offline Wbostoen

  • Posts: 28
  • Name: Willem Bostoen
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2021, 12:50:49 PM »
Hi Willem,
Can you elaborate a little more regarding what you did to create the gauge? Is there a starter kit for something like you're showing or did you build everything from scratch? I would really like to have an actual temp gauge on my '79 Eldorado. I wanted to even make it appear like an original gauge. There's an area where a gauge could be placed where the idiot lights for temp are now but I wasn't certain how to build a gauge from scratch. I would even like it to be a "needle" gauge like the mechanical speedometer. I'm pretty good at finding ways to create the mechanical items but I'm not certain how the temp gauges work... resistance fairly sure but translating resistance into the proper movement I mean. I thought possibly I could start with another temp gauge and create a new face but finding something like a starting kit would be great. I will attach a mock-up which was really pretty close. I used a mid 89-92 Buick Century temp gauge. The numbers are covered by the Eldorado trim but I could live without numbers if I got it to work.

Pretty cool work especially if you were able to match a font which I gathered you did.

Scott

Hi Scott,

It is completely made from scratch, so unfortunately no starter kit. That is why it took me a LONG time to figure everything out. My gauges are little OLED screens, driven by an arduino which is a (very basic) programmable chip. In your case, it should be possible to accurately drive an analog needle gauge, but that takes some programming off course.

I even made a start-up screen with the cadillac script and crest, I had to create these pixel by pixel  :D  but it surely was worth it.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2021, 12:53:21 PM by Wbostoen »

Offline 79 Eldorado

  • Posts: 824
  • Name: S Kent
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2021, 02:51:12 PM »
Wow, Willem very impressive! I have Arduino on my computer from setting up my Raspberry pie with Octoprint to control my 3D printer or possibly when I set-up the "BL-touch" for bed leveling. That was about 3-4 years ago and basically just following the instructions after a lot of reading; half of which I don't recall at all anymore. I wouldn't know where to start now.

Is there a small board which you can attach small components including something electro-mechanical which rotates at an angle based on the programming (I guess)? I'd love to learn more about it if there's a good starting point. I'm good with logic type things required for programming but only the experience as mentioned above with Arduino.

When I saw your pixel-by-pixel it reminded me of one of the first cell phones I used where they had a pretty impressive rose created pixel-by-pixel which was one of the symbols you could use.

Scott

Offline Wbostoen

  • Posts: 28
  • Name: Willem Bostoen
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2021, 05:30:22 PM »
Scott,

To position the needle you could use a servo motor, typically used RC toys and drones. It is very accurate with an angle resolution of about 0.26 degrees per step. These are cheap and work well with arduino/raspberry pi, loads of tutorials too  :)

Offline 79 Eldorado

  • Posts: 824
  • Name: S Kent
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2021, 01:03:35 AM »
Hi Willem,
I checked out the Arduino set-up and it reminded me of the Raspberry pi pico I saw a while ago. I watched a couple of videos including one for the pico in which they controlled a servo motor using a potentiometer but the output from the pot is the same type as the temp sensors I saw described on one of the Arduino videos. It looks like it's probably pretty straight forward. The pico video had a sample of the programming which also seemed understandable.

I just started looking for info when I saw your reply but the Arduino video tried to show "all" of the temp sensing devices but the easiest to integrate, smallest, was variable voltage output and it required power and ground. I was hoping they could read something like NTC or PTC temp sensor which changes resistance to a known value based on the temp. Maybe it can read resistance. If it can then I suspect it could be converted if you know the reference. I'd like to use something simple, like a PTC or NTC variable resistor, because it would be easier to integrate into a housing and the position in a vehicle.

This is not my priority project right now but it seems I need to do more reading.

Thank you,
Scott

Offline 79 Eldorado

  • Posts: 824
  • Name: S Kent
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2021, 02:59:20 AM »
Willem,
It looks like there are instructions for making an Ohm meter with an Arduino. Considering formula are possible it seems like using a sensor which varies resistance with temperature would be possible. I took a look at the instructions quickly and it seems they use a known resistor and then compare the resistor in question.

Thanks for sharing your install. When I have time I'll likely do something further on this as it would be great to have an actual temp gauge.

Scott

Offline dochawk

  • Posts: 627
  • Name: Richard Hawkins
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2021, 05:10:55 PM »
an ohmmeter for an Arduino would be silly-simple:  Vcc to one end of the resistor, the other to an analog input, and a known resistor from that input to ground.

The voltage drop across each resistor is proportional to its resistance, and total to Vcc.
1972 Eldorado convertible,  1997 Eldorado ETC (now awaiting parts swap from '95 donor), 1993 Fleetwood but no 1926 (yet)

Offline 79 Eldorado

  • Posts: 824
  • Name: S Kent
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2021, 06:36:43 PM »
an ohmmeter for an Arduino would be silly-simple:  Vcc to one end of the resistor, the other to an analog input, and a known resistor from that input to ground.

The voltage drop across each resistor is proportional to its resistance, and total to Vcc.
I didn't want to hijack the thread so I created another. I got everything working so the output moves a needle. The hardest part was figuring out whether the Arduino uses assigned pin numbers or labelled pin numbers and then realizing that only certain outputs are PWM. Here's the other thread:
https://forums.cadillaclasalleclub.org/index.php?topic=166883.0

I still need to design a holder and integrate it into the dash. It's a back burner project but everything technical is working. You can also see in the other thread we were discussing doing it without needing to add an additional sensor but that would only work for the 1979 and 1980 CA models of the 1979-1985 generation.

Obviously using a dedicated sensor, or other vehicle specific signal proportional to the coolant temp, the gauge can work in anything but the dash integration would be specific.

Scott

Offline 35-709

  • Posts: 5347
  • The most valuable antique is an old friend.
  • CLC Number: 4719
  • Name: G. Newcombe
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2021, 07:08:19 PM »
Reading this foreign language thread gives me a headache.   :) 
1935 Cadillac Sedan resto-mod "Big Red"
1973 Cadillac Caribou - Sold - but still in the family
1950 Jaguar Mark V Saloon resto-mod - Sold
1942 Cadillac 6269 - Sold
1968 Pontiac Bonneville Convertible
1935 Glenn Pray - Auburn Boattail Speedster, Gen. 2

Offline dochawk

  • Posts: 627
  • Name: Richard Hawkins
Re: Aftermarket gauge placement - 1970 Deville - thoughts?
« Reply #19 on: January 18, 2022, 09:51:09 PM »
If I put fins on an Arduino, would that help?
 ::)

the Arduino forums are quite helpful.

Well, to those that think out the question ahead of time, that is.

One other thought for this project:  you might want to include a calibration table in the ROM, and feed your raw voltage reading into the table, and output *that* value to the needle.

Of course, a GM with an accurate fuel gauge would be almost as shocking as one in which the clock actually worked.
 :P
1972 Eldorado convertible,  1997 Eldorado ETC (now awaiting parts swap from '95 donor), 1993 Fleetwood but no 1926 (yet)

 

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