Thoughts on future popularity/collectibility

[BL14869]

 I know its a subjective thing,and motors notwithstanding wondering what people think will stand the test of time better the 80-85 eldo/bairtiz or the seville of the same vintage.no one has a crystal ball just looking for thoughts.Thanks Bill

[Dick Heller]

I know its a subjective thing,and motors notwithstanding wondering what people think will stand the test of time better the 80-85 eldo/bairtiz or the seville of the same vintage.no one has a crystal ball just looking for thoughts.Thanks Bill

[Johnny]

I know its a subjective thing,and motors notwithstanding wondering what people think will stand the test of time better the 80-85 eldo/bairtiz or the seville of the same vintage.no one has a crystal ball just looking for thoughts.Thanks Bill

I would say they both would be equal in the future.  They both have classic styling of earlier vintage classic cars.  The Eldo is more sporty, while the Seville is more formal.

[Brian Rachlin]

My thought is that the Eldos seem to be picking up value for nice clean examples, especially the convertible.

The Sevilles seem to have a "love it" or "hate it" styling.  I like em, but I have an Eldo Convert (85) that I have owned since 1990 that I plan to hold onto.  The 4100 has been rock solid, and with 115K, I hope that I am past the danger point.

I have pulled these engines and re-installed after a rebuild, and its a job, but a backyard mechanic can handle it.

I think that a 79 or 80 with the 368 steel motor would be the way to go, if you can find a clean one.  The must run better than the 4100s.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Brian

[Art #22010]

85 eldo convertable, only 2300 made I think. In actual inflation adjusted dollars at least when produced and up till at least 1990, the most expensive production automobile ever made in America. I did read that.  85 eldo conv, with out question.  Also, last factory authorized production convertable , i believe   Art

[Johnny]

[ I did read that. 85 eldo conv, with out question. Also, last factory authorized production convertable , i believe Art]

Always an interesting subject. Orginally the 76 Eldos were supposed to be the last of the Cadillac convetibles until the 85s came along.  Then came the Allantes and now we have the XLRs!

[Johnny]

That last post subject should have read:
Last Production Convertible Cadillac?

[Brian Rachlin]

I have the remains of the original invoice on the 85 Convert.  I remember it was about $40,000 new, after the dealer added on some extras like Vogues, RR style grill, and a few other goodies.

I bought the car from friends of my family, and they bought it new.  It had about 70,000 miles on it at the time in 1990.
They traded in a 1982 Hess and Eisenhardt conversion on this "factory" car.

Unfortunately, I had it outside, and time took its toll on the paint, which needs to be re-done.  I am in the process of building a garage behind my house, and this car will be treated to a full cosmetic restoration over the coming winter.  I purchased all the exterior chrome from Caddy in the early 1990s and have everything exept the belt line mouldings that go around the convertible top opening.  I will be getting them re-chromed.

I plan to take lots of pics of the car as I re-do it.

I also have a 76 Eldo Convert.  They made 14,000 of the 76s but only 2300 of the 85s.  The 85 is rarer, but the 76 makes such a statement, and is SO much more of a car in every way.  Its engine size is exactly double.

The 85 is much more nimble to drive, handles great, and is MUCH better on fuel.  The HT4100 should have an EPO rating (engines per ownership)instead of the MPG rating, which is pretty good.

The HT4100 chapters message board has been a big help and should be joined by anyone with a HT4100 powered car.

Regards,

Brian

[Art 22010]

   I owned one till 3 years ago. Serial number, 1g6el6788fe633372, sticker price, 35,076. had to sell it to restore my 49. Sad when that car went.

[Art322010]

I believe, as my post stated, last factory authorized convertable. I believe all 85s were produced as coupes. Cadillac authorized to their specs conversion by a few companies. Maybe Yann will chime in.

[Johnny]

I believe, as my post stated, last factory authorized convertable. I believe all 85s were produced as coupes. Cadillac authorized to their specs conversion by a few companies. Maybe Yann will chime in.

I dont mean to be argumentative, but you bring up an interesting point as to what is the last "authorized" Cadillac Convertible.  It is my impression from your posts that you consider the 85s as the last "authorized" Cadillac convertibles, is this what you think?  If so, I then ask you how about the Allantes and the SLRs?  Wouldnt they both be "authorized" Cadillac Convertibles?

[Art #22010]

Sorry John, not argumentative at all. I appreciate your response. Actually, my first response had mentioned that in my opinion, the 85 Eldo was the collectable car of the period the original inquirer had asked for. So the response preceded the others. The following comments by me were already prefaced by my earlier comments, which remain the same. The cars you refer to were not Eldorodos. In my opinion only, The future collectable cars of this period, not withstanding the brief production period of the Allantes, nor the new XLR, is the 85 Eldorodo Convertable, I believe, the last factory produced, if you wish or factory authorized, as they were. Hope this helps any confusion and dont misunderstand, I love all Cadillacs

[Johnny]

Art, thanks for the clarification.  Of course now you bring up another interesting point, the difference between factory produced and factory authorized, and just for good measure lets throw in "after market conversions" LOL

Allow me to give my thoughts.  I dont believe that after 1976 Cadillac built any convertibles at their factories. I think they outsourced them to quality coachworks, then sold them as "factory authorized".  In other words in my mind an "official" Cadillac convertible after 1976 is one a buyer could buy from a Cadillac dealership with full warranty from Cadillac.  I am not sure what the situation is with the aftermarket conversions that werent "authorized" by Cadillac.

Personally myself, I prefer the hardtop Eldorado coupes of that period over the convertibles.  Actually I prefer the all steel tops over the half vinyl and full simulated tops.  Part of the appeal of the styling is the roof line with the squared off rear window.

As I stated before, I like both the Seville and Eldorados of that period, and would be glad to have the Seville instead of the Eldorado I now own, which I ordered new.

[Art.#22010]

Johnny, we seem to now be on the same page. I believe your right
and we could go on for a long time about , factory, authorized, aftermarket and so on. In the end it is what it is.
        After some 50 years of production, some years without a covertable, the Eldo line came to conclusion. As now represented, not withstanding the argument as to factory or authorized, with or without warranties, The 85 Eldo convertable,
low production numbers, was the last Eldo convertable offered.
That said, though arguable, in my opinion, is the only collectable car produced in the 80s and to limit the arguments of others as to other cars which may be collectable in the future, I wish to only limit that statement, to Eldorodos. PHEW

                                 art #22010

[Dave]

I always liked the Seville, even with all the 4100 problems.
I think the styling still turns heads today and will in the
future. I own a very clean one and guess that it may be a collector car in the next 10-15 years.
But what do I know.

[Brian Campbell]

I believe the Seville, especially the 76-79 series.  A nice clean factory 76 chocolate Brown with a coffee leather interior, coffee vinyl roof, moon roof and wire hubcaps without locks that were stolen every few weeks until Cadillac came out with socket locks.  Next, a nice clean two-tone 79 Elegante fully loaded with real wire wheels and vogue tyres!  

[Mike #19861]

 I believe both of these cars will be collectibels in the years to come. The Eldorado convertibles will lead the way, as do convertibles in general for all cars. I see them trading these days for upwards of $20K

 Personally, I prefer the Eldorado for its clean and timeless styling. I do, as does Johnny, prefer the clean roofed versions that really show off its great proportions with out the break up of the roof line with the stainless top and vinyl roof.

 The Seville with its baroque stylling will be its claim to fame, and it will be collectible, but which of the two will lead the pack. That remains to be seen.

 I have an 85 Eldorado Coupe project car. It has a blown engine which I plan on replacing with an uprated 4.5 that I am building myself. It has the cabriolet roof that is really tattered. I an debating on either getting rid of it or replacing it. Problem is, in typical GM practice, the roof seams were unfinished which would require me to undertake bodywork and paint. It is a firemist paint which could prove difficult to match.

 But, for the time being, the Eldorado seems to be surging in prices. I have watched prices increase in the last couple of years. A decent driver that could have been had a few years ago for about $2500 is heading upwards of $4-$5000 with top notch Biarittzs going for upwards of $10K. Sevilles seem to trail this by $1-$2000.

  Mike

[Dave Smith #17592]

I had an 83 Eldorado with an HT4100.  Or "HT forty-one blundred" as I call them.    My car was on its second engine when I bought it used for $500.   The engine was strong, but it idled crazy.   After several WEEKS at the Caddy dealer, they finally told me to get it out of there because they had no parts or patience to fix it.   Of course they did charge me $400 for the Idle sensor they replaced that didnt help.    

I ended up selling the car on Ebay for $800.    So I lost money on that deal.   These 80s Cads with their obsolete engine computers and miles of vacuum lines that get brittle and leak are just too expensive to attemp restoration.    This is really disappointing because I see so many really sharp looking HT4100 Cads forsale on Ebay all the time.   But then I remember that those owners are all probably just dumping a problem child like I did.

David

[Johnny]

Art, I just got done reading your post concerning Eldo "convertibles", and having finally mastered understanding Abbott and Costellos "Whos on first", I understand your thoughts, and mostly agree.  What you have really brought out is the major problem in judging! In other words, "What exactly is correct"?

Myself I like seeing cars as close to possible as they looked when they rolled out of the factory, and equipped with factory options.  Along these lines, factory produced "mud flaps" are correct!

[Mike #19861]

 A bit of understanding goes a long way with these engines. They really are not that complex, quite simple really when compared to late model electronics.

 They can be made reliable if they are built using the latest upgrades and a basic understanding of the construction of the engine and its particular requirements.

 A sound HT4100 is a very smooth and quiet engine, if a bit underpowered. They are also capable of some pretty impressive fuel economy numbers. A boon in these days of elevated fuel prices. Some simple tuning techniques can make them come alive and be pretty decent performers.

 Im not afraid of these engines at all. You need to know what you are looking for. Never buy one sight unseen, and that goes for buying off Ebay.

  Mike