Carrier bearing problem (1961)

[Brent Hladky (#21519)]

The carrier bearing on my 61 recently went out.  Replaced it (rebuilt one), together with the rear drive shaft (new one made, correct length and well balanced).  To my surprise, it shook like there was no tomorrow.  "Shimmied" the carrier bearing but a good portion of the "rock n roll" remains.  Any ideas/suggestions?  Thanks for the help!!

[paul]

First off, there was quite alot written here about a year ago on this topic that might help. Do a search for starters. Now brace yourself-this, I believe, is the biggest problem with this era of Caddies (anybody out there feel free to disagree) and why I ultimately got rid of my 61 Fleetwood 60 special. I replaced the carrier bearing and support when it went out, and afterwards it would shake itself silly. Even had the driveshaft aft of the bearing remade-no difference. The balance was checked over and over again, but still the vibration remained. After much expense we were able to reduce it to an annoying hum that really got going over 60 mph. I had enough and threw in the towel. I hope yours turns out better.

Best of luck!

[Roger A. Zimmermann #21015]

I can agree. My 57 Brougham had some vibrations above 60 mph, worse at 68. Even if it was not bad, I replaced the center bearing (had the chance to find a NOS) I replaced also the first U-joint which was not so good. Recently, I did a test drive and its worse! At 65 mph, the car is shaking lateraly; its almost gone at 75 mph and acceptable at 85. Nothing bad to report under 56 mph. It depends also if the engine is pulling ot coasting.

[Mick]

Hello.
It is an elusive problem; mostly fixed by trial and error.  If your center carrier was improperly rebuilt, you may want to know about a very little known part I posted here; the picture tells all -its available at Dana-Spicer- :

http://groups.msn.com/196364CadillacCommunity/adrenalinemiguel.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=3149 TARGET=_blank>http://groups.msn.com/196364CadillacCommunity/adrenalinemiguel.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=3149

(It is running in my 61)

If the rear axle is lowered with the shock absorbers removed, the driveshaft will either bend or the rubber on the carrier will break, or both, giving the shakes.

PLEASE come back with findings whenever solved. Hope helps somewhat.
Mick

[Mick]

Hi.
There is a big chance the problem is not the center carrier, but the transmission mounts.  Give them a close inspection. PLEASE come back with findings,
Mick

[Bruce Reynolds # 18992]

Gday Brent,

I had a similar problem with my 60 CDV and that was shuddering on take-off and up to about 15 mph.   It isnt as bad now, and I am still chasing it, but can live with it until I actually find the source.

Firstly, I found that the top ball joint on the Diff required replacing, but as I am not sure if the 61 has the same suspension set-up, that mightnt help you.

Secondly, I performed the factory recommended "fix" which was to shim the centre bearing up 1/8" and slot the mounting holes in the chassis 1/8" to the right.   This appears to have taken out most of the driveshaft alignment problems.   I experimented with shims up to 1/4", but the problem with going too hgh is the chance of the spinning universal touching the floor pan.

Thirdly, I checked the condition of the transmission mounting, and shimmed that up 1/8", as mine appeared to be slightly low.

Forthly, I had the tailshafts completely balanced, and found that even though I had recently replaced all the universals, the rear one had become "worn out" again.   I now suspect the rear tailshaft because the rear cross is 7.5 degrees out of phase and it is the "Rubber Sleeve" type.   But, until I can find someone with a "known to be good" car, and have them measure their "phase", I will leave it as it is.   Ed Mobley in CA has a similar problem, and his shaft is the same degrees out, but both our shafts are out on the drive side and not the trailing side.

Lastly, and one thing that I have resisted this far is replacing the lower control arm bushes on the rear suspension as they appear to be in alignment.

The funny thing is that no matter how hard I accellerate in reverse, it is totally vibration free, but one cant drive in reverse all the time.   Too tough on the neck and the reversing lights arent bright enough to illuminate the road at night.

Balancing the tailshaft did reduce to a great extent the slight noise I had at cruising speed though.

Hope this helps a bit.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le),
60 CDV

[Ed Mobley]

Hi,

Cadillac even came out with a special tool to check the driveshaft geometry (Kent Moore J-8905).  Im still trying to find that tool. I believe the 1961 service manual outlines the procedure.

I have a slight shudder between 10 - 15 MPH on my 60 Coupe, but only when going up a steep hill.  At higher speeds, my car is smooth...no vibration.

Im going to leave well enough alone until I can find the right tool to check out the driveshaft.


Regards,


Ed

[JIM CLC # 15000]

07-22-05
All, it wasnt just the Cadillacs of the 60s that had a problem (viberation). I had a 75 Chevrolet that viberated from 55 MPH and up. Got it new, so a lot was changed under warranty. No one could find the problem. The last dealer to work-on-and-give-up made an appointment with the District Repersentve. On the appointed day, I figured it best to check for the viberation prior to having the DR test drive it and tell me to learn to "like it". I went on the Interstate as fast as it would go and no VIBERATION. Still dont know what the problem was.
Good Luck, hope you find the prob., Jim

[Denise 20352]

  I also have vibration on my 76 hearse.  Above about 60 mph is the worst.  I was going to take it to the driveline shop, but if everyone else is having the same problem, maybe its just something that one has to live with.

-d

[Bruce Reynolds # 18992]

Gday Densie,

You dont ha ve to live with nasty vibrations as they werent there when the vehicle was new.

If you are having a vibration at those speeds, I would be recommending that if you think the tailshaft(s) are out of balance, get them balanced.   You might even find that the extension housing bush is worn, or the unis are shot.

When I had my shafts balanced, they found that one of the shafts was slightly bent.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le),
60 CDV

[Denise 20352]

  I sorta wish you hadnt mentioned that, but now that you did, I recall that the studs on the end of the shocks are bent, which means that the car bottomed out hard on something.  I wouldnt be surprised if the driveshaft was hit.  Maybe I should go get that checked, after I fix the brakes, steering column, steering leak, knock in the engine, etc...

-denise

[Richard Goulden]

I dont know much about driveshafts, but when I did mine on my 59, I replaced the universial joints, nos carrier bearing and carrier, AND had the male end of the rear shaft sprayed with Teflon, to remove slight "slop", in the sliding joint. It is as smooth as silk. Another thing the carrier bearing must be seated properly in the housing, otherwise the carrier will " rock when the shaft is turning. Of coarse I had it balanced as a complete unit, from front yolk ( also nos), to rear unversial, the guy doing the job commented it was one smooooth turning shaft.
Hope this helps