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What about detergent oil in 39 LaSalle ??

Started by FRED ZWICKER #23106, October 01, 2006, 09:13:21 AM

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FRED ZWICKER #23106

This summer, I purchased a 1939 LaSalle Convertible in great shape and the engine seems to be perfect. Oil pressure holds at 30-35 psi, car does not smoke, engine has good compression and runs quietly. I have traced the ownership back to 1983 and neither owner has overhauled the engine, nor do they know what type of oil was used. For the last 8-10 years, car was stored in a museum in Oklahoma and driven no more than 200 miles during that period ot time.  I talked to one of the owners of the museum who remembered the car, but did not know what kind of oil was used (he recommended detergent oil, but since he didnt know what oil was used, do not feel that this recommendation means much).

On the advice of a friend with a nice original 1940 Cadillac, I changed the oil to Non-Detergent 20W50 Phillips Aircraft Oil. I have added a small bottle of E.O.S. (just recently). Everything seems to be OK and the oil looks clean on the dip stick (it should, as has been driven only about 100 miles since the change). Engine does not have an oil filter.

I would like very much to change to a detergent oil, but since I have no knowledge of what was in the engine previously, am worried about kicking up the sludge that might be in the engine. Is there any way to figure this out without removing the oil pan and looking up inside the engine?  Someone told me that if you try detergent oil, to change it within a short time (how much time ?) to clean up the engine and get rid of the sludge, but others say that it will pull out too much old sludge  quickly and cause all kinds of problems. Also, is an oil pan gasket available if I pull the oil pan to take a look? What should I look for?  Any ideas?

Fred

JIM CLC # 15000

10-03-06
Fred, The answer is (at least,I think it is)oil pan Gasket Sets should be available from just about any new auto-parts store. If you can not get a set right-away, loosen all of the cap-screws that are holding the pan on, a couple of turns and take a "rubber-hammer" and tap the sides of the pan until it comes loose, then remove the screws.The pan (should) will come off with-out breaking the gasket. Put a light coat of RTV or gasket sealer (A regular steel hammer and a 2X4 wood block [to protect the pan] will also work) As far as being able to see any "sluedge" I dont think you will see any EXCEPT in the pan! Clean it out and re-install it and put in a good detergent oil. Make sure that it has Zink in it or else put in an additive that contains Zink. If you are really concerned about "sluedge", put in one quart of a good grade of motor-oil and top it off with "diesel" fuel and run engine until hot (normal-range) then drain. RE-fill with what ever oil you decide to use and use the diesel-fuel treatment prior to each oil change. I once had a neighbor who did the "diesel-fuel" sluedge cleaning prior to each oil change and his engine never had any sluedge build-up in it, BUT can not say what results you will have.
HTH
Good Luck,JIM

FRED ZWICKER #23106

Thanks for the tip Jim,

I called Kanter today to get an oil pan gasket, but they sell it only as part of a master kit ($175).  I will try locally, as usually have good luck with one local auto supply who seems to be able to find just about anything.  I will also need the rear seal, as it should be changed at the same time.  I already added one bottle of E.O.S. for now.  Hopefully I can get the car on our lift at work to follow your recommendations.

Fred

Geoff Newcombe #4719

Would be somewhat surprised if your local parts store carries a pan gasket for a 39 LaSalle but strnager things have happened.  You might if all else fails Im sure you can get one at ......

http://www.olsonsgaskets.com/products.html TARGET=_blank>http://www.olsonsgaskets.com/products.html
or
http://www.coopersvintage.com/ TARGET=_blank>http://www.coopersvintage.com/
or
http://www.egge.com/ TARGET=_blank>http://www.egge.com/
Let us know how you make out so everyone will know.

Jack Hoffman #7042

Pan gasket set is available from Terrill Machine (254)893-2610.
I think you will be suprised at what you find in the pan if it has not been cleaned out for a number of years.

Harry Scott

If there is sludge in the pan there is a good chance it will also be in the valve lifter valley. That area can really get mucked up.

Doug Houston

In the last week or so, I posted a tirade about this very thing. Ill summarize here. If the engine has never been opened, and you use detergent oil in it, youre goosing lady luck.

nasser

Fred:
  Interesting topic and please allow me to add my two cents worth. First of all, if you are into old cars and you get black residue under your finger nails, then you should acustome your self to cutting your own gaskets weather paper or cork. Secondly, as I read in a very good restoration mag. called Skinned Knuckles that detergent oils are not sludge cleaning oils and will not dislodge heave sludge or varnish, but they are designed to prevent the new formation of sludge. I could back this with the article and issue number.
  In 1987, I droped the pan from my 1936 buick engine (straight eight) and found heavey sludge that was grity (textured). I went under the car and cleaned the gutts of the engine from the bottom with keroseen and compressed air as much as I can. Then, I went to the holes in the crank shaft and pressured keroseen through each hole rotating the crank shaft to find the next hole, you would not believe what kind of stuff got out. After that I pressure lubed all galaries with a light oil till all the keroseen is out then I followed that with engine oil (detergent oil). I still own the car and have put more than 4000 miles since with no problem at all, and oil remain clean (not blackened) after each oil change for almost 500 miles.
  I like Jims diesel Idea, it is far safer than keroseen as the latter is very flammable fuel. I am going to re-do the buick treatment for my newly acquired (2 years actually)1939 60 special, I hope it works again.
  Please let us know of what did you find and how did you go. Best regards and happy motoring.
Dr. Nasser,

John Tozer #7946