News:

Due to a technical issue, some recently uploaded pictures have been lost. We are investigating why this happened but the issue has been resolved so that future uploads should be safe.  You can also Modify your post (MORE...) and re-upload the pictures in your post.

Main Menu

2 door 4 door

Started by badpoints, March 14, 2023, 07:51:33 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

badpoints

I grew up in the world of, two doors are cool and sporty and four doors are for your parents. This has been a strong sentiment for decades. The value of 1950s to 1970s two door vs four door is huge.
I wonder if this is changing with the coupe fading away and four doors being dominate. Twenty years from now will the four door still be your parents car.

Moody

A 4 door will always be my parents car. And grandparents car. I'd rather suffer with a two door than drive a 4 door. The kids and grandkids can get in the back. It's about the aesthetics for me, not the functionality. If I want functionality, I'll drive my new daily driver.
Moody

signart

That mentality is fading for several reasons. One being that the two doors are less obtainable for anyone who wants to get in the hobby and doesn't have big pockets.
Another is there are simply more solid and straight survivors available and again more affordable.
The trend now is anything vintage with awesome wheels and yes, slammed is "sick" (cool for you squares, lol) and will draw attention at red lights, cruise-ins and shows just as much or more as the tri-fives, etc. Trucks are the hottest ticket, imho, not so much coupes that are bringing the biggest money. Can't forget to mention station wagons, way up in desirability.
..and of course us geezers that were brought up in the 2 doors rule, "more doors" drool world are fading from the scenery and the new gen of cruising types are finding the fun with what is available.
Even rust is in and it's not just a fad, now. Robbing the crusher is fun, and that's what keeps
our hobby going right now, not 50 and 80 thousand dollar Camaro's, Chevelles, 442's.
I own survivors, restored to original, restomods and rust buckets that have been revived to run (and done). I have fun working on them, but mostly driving them all.   
Art D. Woody

Clewisiii

I like 4 door.  But I prefer luxury and comfort. 

The 61 Fleetwood had seats with pocketed coil springs.  The coupe was just serpentine springs.  The Fleetwood had wood veneer. The coupe did not. The Fleetwood had some real leather as standard. The coupe did not. 

In my mind if you want to collect a classic car why would you want the base model. 
"My interest is in the future, because I am going to spend the rest of my life there."  Charles Kettering

Lexi

Quote from: badpoints on March 14, 2023, 07:51:33 AMI grew up in the world of, two doors are cool and sporty and four doors are for your parents. This has been a strong sentiment for decades. The value of 1950s to 1970s two door vs four door is huge.
I wonder if this is changing with the coupe fading away and four doors being dominate. Twenty years from now will the four door still be your parents car.

I have always found the 2 door vs 4 door thing an oddity. Probably the sports car/racing world which is dominated by 2 door cars (often with extreme paint jobs that scream at the viewer) is responsible for that mind set. Besides, race cars (and base models as Carl pointed out), have few if any options as well as cheaper interiors. Race cars don't need 4 doors. Their laws of functionality don't require them, nor does extra weight help their cause in the job they were designed to accomplish. They mostly don't even need a radio or AC! The list goes on. That said, what is wrong with our grandparent's car? Today some of our late model "grocery getters' can out perform vintage American muscle cars, and do so with fantastic creature comfort. So owning one of those vintage muscle cars is now largely about nostalgia, and not performance.

I prefer Professional and luxury cars, so to me a 2 door Limo generally makes little sense, neither does a 2 door Hearse or Ambulance. How do you get the body or casket in? LOL. They are built for a specific job as are racing cars. They are two different animals. In the Professional car world more doors are generally preferred, (like a 3 way Hearse vs just an end loader for example). Besides, 2 door cars have their drawbacks, such as getting into and out of the backseat especially with some models. Grandparents squeezing into the back of some of these cars? Forget it. I am at that stage and it can be torture. Plus coupe doors are more prone to sagging thus misalignment due to their extra weight & size. The stock answer has been that the lines are cleaner in a 2 door car, but that is largely, if not entirely subjective.

I think in the future 4 door cars might attain a more lofty posistion in the collector car world. Availability could make that choice for people should the 4 door car prove to dominate via the attrition of 2 door models. Little difference than in the antique collecting world. I am old enough to remember going through shops some 55+ years ago. In the high end establishments one could commonly find much Regency era and earlier furniture, & on occassion even antiquity. Victoriana was still being tossed out. Styles post dating 1900 were often ignored or even sneered at. There was much snobbery. Having also been associated with the trade for over 50 years it has changed big time, largely due to what is available to the collector, regionality and trends. As the supply of fine European antiques declined, in moved other areas of collecting to fill the gap. Yes, one can still find the aforementioned objects if searched for, but their availability is now exceptional. We don't base an opinion on the exception to the rule, rather we base it on the "meat" of a subject. Like Statistics, high and low values are tossed to obtain a more true value.

As "gearheads" are a largely fractured community they do share some common threads. The game changer might be the "enviromental terrorists" as my Father used to call them, (greenies). They may compel legislation that make obtaining and driving a vintage car quite problematic in the future, regardless of how many doors the car has. We may be left without any choices.  :-[  Clay/Lexi

z3skybolt

Amen to all the above,

I am 75 and grew up with all the prejudice against 4 door cars.  Having owned many automobiles during my lifetime the only four door cars I ever owned were: a 1951 Chevy, my very first car and a new 1985 Lincoln Town Car.

My first collector car was a 1937 Buick Coupe purchased in 1970.  In 2016 I purchased a 1940 LaSalle 5227 Series Coupe. I wouldn't even consider a four door at that time.  After driving it nearly 9,000 miles it was totaled.  When I went looking for a replacement, low and behold, I fell in love with a 1940 5019, four door sedan.

It isn't as cosmetically nice as the 5227 was but to my surprise both my wife and I like it far better than the coupe!  It has a classier look, doesn't have the "fat"look, rides nicer and everyone loves those rearward opening suicide doors?

Sure, the coupe was sportier and sexier looking.  But....well maybe it is my age....but I wouldn't trade my pedestrian, driver quality "4 door" for my previous show quality coupe, even if I could.

I am as surprised as anyone. Just my personal evolution.  Your mileage may vary.

Bob R.
1940 LaSalle 5227 Coupe(purchased May 2016)
1985 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series. Bought New.

David Greenburg

Both have their place, but for me, a luxury car is better as a 4 door. On many models of big cars, the lines are simply better on a 4 door. And while it's okay for kids, the back seat of an old Cadillac coupe is not particularly practical for adults to get in/out of.  And as Carl notes, Fleetwoods in particular have features not found on lesser models. Those seats make a difference. And I love having 8 power windows.
David Greenburg
'60 Eldorado Seville
'61 Fleetwood Sixty Special

billyoung

I Love them all and have had 2 doors, 4 doors, and convertibles. I do Love my Raggedy Ann 1968 DeVille Convertible though. She is getting a complete makeover done unprofessionally by me.
Age 68, Living in Gods waiting room ( Florida ) Owned over 40 Old Cadillac's from 1955's to 1990 Brougham's. Currently own a 1968 Cadillac DeVille Convertible and a 1992 Cadillac 5.7 Brougham.

TJ Hopland

I've helped a few 'kids' shop for cars over the last couple years and I don't think they were even really aware that a 'regular' car could come in a 2 door.   After I started thinking about it how many have there been in the last 20 some years?  Single digit percentages for sure if even that many?  Mustang?  Challenger?  Corvette?  But those don't seem to be considered regular cars these days. 
StPaul/Mpls, MN USA

73 Eldo convert w/FiTech EFI
80 Eldo Diesel
90 CDV
And other assorted stuff I keep buying for some reason

scotth3886

I think a major part of this is aesthetics.  You take a two door C body, it looks out of proportion with that 10' long trunk.  I think they look much better as a 4-door hardtop.   Even my 66 Fleetwood, despite the B pillar, looks better as a 4-door sedan than it would as a 2-door coupe. 

Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621

Rightly or wrongly, there has always been a market preference for sporty/youthful body styles and it will probably always remain that way. Generally speaking, it's the exterior appearance that counts the most; interior furnishings to a far lesser extent.     
A Cadillac Motorcar is a Possession for which there is no Acceptable Substitute

Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373

#11
I too grew up in a 2 door household. Us kids always hated when we all went somewhere together because getting in/out was a real pain--- And whatever we did, we had to bend and contort ourselves to only step on the floormats.
However we were always sure to make it so my sister got stuck in the middle!!

As I am now older, I'd say it depends on the year. A 2 door vs 4 door on a 50's car doesn't appear as different as 2 door vs 4 door on a 70's.
I think, in my mind anyway, that the 50's styling doesn't seem to make the rear doors stand out as much.
But here's the real reason I like our 4 door 55 over a 2 door:
If it was a 2 door, we couldn't have afforded it.

Jeff R
Jeff Rosansky
CLC #28373
1970 Coupe DeVille (Big Red)
1955 Series 62 (Baby Blue)
Dad's new 1979 Coupe DeVille

signart

Quote from: TJ Hopland on March 14, 2023, 07:17:50 PMI've helped a few 'kids' shop for cars over the last couple years and I don't think they were even really aware that a 'regular' car could come in a 2 door.   After I started thinking about it how many have there been in the last 20 some years?  Single digit percentages for sure if even that many?  Mustang?  Challenger?  Corvette?  But those don't seem to be considered regular cars these days. 

...and the leading seller for Dodge automobiles is the Charger, with barely noticed four doors.
Art D. Woody

scotth3886

Quote from: signart on March 15, 2023, 10:19:45 AM...and the leading seller for Dodge automobiles is the Charger, with barely noticed four doors.

Those are all destroyed in takovers and sideshows anyways.

bctexas

I always figured that different cars have different roles in life.  My 1220lb Lotus Seven replica fills a role that my '70 SDV can't.  The '65 CDV offers a 1960's driving experience very different from the '70.  The '05 Crown Vic offers killer air conditioning unlike any I have owned, comfort for long and short trips and the reliability of an anvil.  The '86 MR2 is a member of the family - we bought it new and it is a hoot to drive.  They are all individuals, so to speak.  And I enjoy them all for what they are.  The number (or presence) of doors not withstanding! 

Happy Motoring!
1965 CDV
1970 SDV

Steve W

In classic cars in general, 2 doors are getting harder to find, and afford. And convertibles? Fuhgedaboudit! So 4 doors are really stepping up in popularity, especially with those new to classic cars. And I see prices for 4 doors escalating as well, especially hardtops. When I was a kid, it was coupes and convertibles that brought all the money, and you couldn't even give 4 doors away. Not so today.

But Cadillacs seem to be in a bubble of their own. 4 doors are not only very popular, in many cases they are preferred. One of my friends, looking at my CdV, said "that's too big of a car to only have 2 doors! It's not a 'two-door', its a 'two-few-doors'!"

For me, I have always preferred coupes. I like the lines, the personal luxury esthetic...and being 6'5" with long legs, I need the longer door to glide in and out easier. And in the case of non-hardtop 4 doors, I have to have the seat all the way back, and I really dislike having the b-pillar in my field of vision. 

I've had MANY classic cars since the 70s, my CdV is the only one that I didn't need to bolt or weld long bars in place to re-locate the seat farther back. The 68 CdV, and I assume many other Cadillacs, came from the factory with two sets of seat mounting holes in the floor, so that the dealer could mount the seat farther back for their taller customers. That's one of the first things I did when I got my CdV! It's just right!
Steve Waddington
1968 Coupe deVille
North Hollywood, CA
CLC Member # 32866

Claudio

For me a two door is better than a lotta door...... I fixed up my 59 Fleetwood and then sold it because it had two doors to many lol 😝.....!!
I now have a 59 CDV but it needs help......

The Tassie Devil(le)

As has been sad on many previous occasions when this subject is brought up is that the 4 door car, and I include Station Wagons in this listing is that they always brought back memories, being good, or bad, about growing up in a family.

2 Door cars were all about personal transport, and memories of single Uncles and Aunts that didn't need the back seat for anything.   We must not forget that in 99% of times, the two door car was cheaper than the four door.

Convertibles are always different, even being two door, they always looked their best with the roof down, which is the way they were advertised.   Plus, mostly the costliest.

As youngsters, when we wanted to purchase out first car, we had to have a two door car, as it was special, and in most cases, it was only filled with the driver, and a special passenger.

Bruce.
'72 Eldorado Convertible (LHD)
'70 Ranchero Squire (RHD)
'74 Chris Craft Gull Wing (SH)
'02 VX Series II Holden Commodore SS Sedan
(Past President Modified Chapter)

Past Cars of significance - to me
1935 Ford 3 Window Coupe
1936 Ford 5 Window Coupe
1937 Chevrolet Sports Coupe
1955 Chevrolet Convertible
1959 Ford Fairlane Ranch Wagon
1960 Cadillac CDV
1972 Cadillac Eldorado Coupe

jdemerson

#18
I'll comment on the 1950-1953 generation Cadillac. I think that the proportions on my 1952 Series 62 sedan are exactly right. I wouldn't trade it for any other model of that period, not even the convertible. In a luxury car, especially, the advantages of four doors seem clear to me.

That said, I believe that the most attractive model (aesthetically) of this generation is the 1950/1951 Series 61 Coupe. I've always been surprised that they don't seem to be as desirable as the longer Coupe De Ville. Before you disagree with this opinion, check one out in real life!

John Emerson
1952 Cadillac sedan 6219X
John Emerson
Middlebury, Vermont
CLC member #26790
1952 Series 6219X
http://bit.ly/21AGnvn

Moody

I couldn't agree more.
Moody